The Russia/Ukraine situation

posted by Fletch

Oh so we should worry about what they "would do"?  Right now they are invading a country and killing people.  Not worried about that?

Sounds on par with people like you, lead from behind.  All this BS about sanctions and crap.  ALL OF THAT COULD HAVE BEEN DONE WEEKS AGO AND LIKELY PREVENT THIS.  

But hey WTF, lets have a fucking war and people like us are paying $5 a gallon in gas and just lost 20% in the stock market.  You need to STFU.,

Yeah man... who cares if it results in complete destructions of major cities setting the path for decades of war. You gotta be alpha and lead from the front!!!!

CC's got about the same wartime knowledge and insight as a 10-year-old playing Risk for the first time.

It’s a good thing he mentioned people are also dying. I was going to think his outrage stemmed from what he’s paying for gas. 

Ah fuck it, I still think that anyways. 

posted by Heretic

CC's got about the same wartime knowledge and insight as a 10-year-old playing Risk for the first time.

Risk is serious business.  Nothing like thinking you are going to have some quality time having fun with the wife and kids only for it to descend into managing a family battle.

posted by justincredible

Legit think of this everytime someone mentions the bravery of the Ukrainian people. 

"I come from Ukraine. You not say Ukraine is WEAK!...Ukraine is game to you? HOW ABOUT I TAKE THE BOARD AND SMASH!!!"

posted by majorspark

The breakup of Yugoslavia is the only post WW2 event in Europe that would come close to the death and destruction that is going on today.  A violent internal separation of a nation on many ethnic lines.  Quite different than Ukraine.

The Hungarian uprising was put down quickly with little loss of life and property.  The West was mostly hands off.  Same with  Czechoslovakia.  Not the case in Ukraine.

Go read Putin's speech.  He has made his intentions quite clear.  This has caused a huge shift in the European mindset.

I don't totally disagree with you, just the quick reference to WWII.  Everything doesn't always have to be the worst since WWII. 

I agree that this has united Europe not seen since the fall of the Wall. 

Even the breakup of Yugoslavia didn't cause this much unity. 

posted by Fletch

Oh so we should worry about what they "would do"?  Right now they are invading a country and killing people.  Not worried about that?

Sounds on par with people like you, lead from behind.  All this BS about sanctions and crap.  ALL OF THAT COULD HAVE BEEN DONE WEEKS AGO AND LIKELY PREVENT THIS.  

But hey WTF, lets have a fucking war and people like us are paying $5 a gallon in gas and just lost 20% in the stock market.  You need to STFU.,

Someone needs to understand how nuclear weapons, deterrence theory, and the escalation ladder work. 

One cannot simply make a nuclear power do what you want it to....

I'm guessing your answer to the Cold War was just to blow the Reds all to hell. 

posted by ptown_trojans_1

Someone needs to understand how nuclear weapons, deterrence theory, and the escalation ladder work. 

One cannot simply make a nuclear power do what you want it to....

I'm guessing your answer to the Cold War was just to blow the Reds all to hell. 

Curious - if Trump were president in his second term do you think this invasion would be happening? 

And yes, she did just say this.  

Comforting, isn't it.

posted by QuakerOats

Curious - if Trump were president in his second term do you think this invasion would be happening? 

Possibly not, but not for the reason the Trumpkins pretend.

posted by ptown_trojans_1

I don't totally disagree with you, just the quick reference to WWII.  Everything doesn't always have to be the worst since WWII. 

I agree that this has united Europe not seen since the fall of the Wall. 

Even the breakup of Yugoslavia didn't cause this much unity. 

WWII is a benchmark in recent world history.  It is going to be referenced.  It is true everything doesn't have to be the worst since WWII.  But in that measure something has to be.  The current situation checks a lot of boxes.

posted by QuakerOats

Curious - if Trump were president in his second term do you think this invasion would be happening? 

I do.  I think this has been planned for awhile and would have gone on regardless of the election.  Not that I feel great about Biden being in charge during this, but what would Trump have done differently?  Gas pipeline cutoff would not have made a difference in my opinion.  

I used to work with Russians in the mining and steel industries.  Honest to God, it was the opinion of everyone I worked with that they fucked up everything they touched - “meanwhile in Russia” style.  This operation harkens back to that - clumsy, horribly executed, terrible planning, awful communication.  It makes me think what I thought then - thank God I wasn’t born in Russia.  I can’t imagine the binge drinking going on as a result of this debacle.

posted by QuakerOats

Curious - if Trump were president in his second term do you think this invasion would be happening? 

Does it matter? 

Pretty easy to say oh Trump wouldn't have allowed that when his words the last week maybe suggest otherwise. 

posted by majorspark

WWII is a benchmark in recent world history.  It is going to be referenced.  It is true everything doesn't have to be the worst since WWII.  But in that measure something has to be.  The current situation checks a lot of boxes.

Sort of correct. It is the end of the Cold War that is the benchmark here, especially when talking eastern Europe. 

A lot of Putin's grievances are related to how he sees the greatest travesty of the 20th century, the collapse of the Soviet Union and failed efforts to save it in 1989-1991. 

Trump is in love with Putin. They’re both pieces of shit. How someone could support either one blows my mind. 

posted by ptown_trojans_1

Does it matter? 

Pretty easy to say oh Trump wouldn't have allowed that when his words the last week maybe suggest otherwise. 

We are still importing a lot of oil from Russia. If Trump would have won, we wouldn't be dependent upon Russian oil to the extent that we are.

posted by ptown_trojans_1

Sort of correct. It is the end of the Cold War that is the benchmark here, especially when talking eastern Europe. 

A lot of Putin's grievances are related to how he sees the greatest travesty of the 20th century, the collapse of the Soviet Union and failed efforts to save it in 1989-1991. 

I said a benchmark.  Benches have many marks.  Putin also noted grievances he has that pre date WWII.

How Putin sees the fall of the Soviet Union is very similar to Hitler and the surrender and humiliation of Germany in WWI.

The 80's called and wanted their foreign policy back and we hung up on them. 

posted by ptown_trojans_1

Does it matter? 

Pretty easy to say oh Trump wouldn't have allowed that when his words the last week maybe suggest otherwise. 

I was just asking a question; not surprised you dodged it.