Disgusted by the Trump administration part II

How is it that Pelosi seems to be the voice of reason now for the Dems regarding impeachment and this report?

She is correct, but the rest of those jackals cannot resist to keep attacking 

Pelosi is practically a moderate in this version of the Democratic party.  Scary stuff.

But people like Schiff are completely safe, so he can lie with impunity to further the agenda.  It's just like Trump supporters - Schiff's voters literally don't care if he's lying about Trump.  It fires them up when he takes on the POTUS, whether it's true doesn't matter.

Pelosi, on the other hand, is thinking about the larger overall election and what overstepping is going to do for their majority.  I feel like Trump may be able to continually troll people like Schumer, Schiff and others....and they'll take the bait and help him get re-elected.

posted by kizer permanente

420-0 gave a shit? So do about 55% of Americans last I looked? 

Unclench, Sport. Didn't Barr already say he was going to release it? 

posted by fish82

Unclench, Sport. Didn't Barr already say he was going to release it? 

lol Unclench? Didn't mean to scare you with such ferocity. I apologize. 
And has Barr already said he'd release it? I missed it then. 

I have a feeling that if it is released it will be so heavily redacted that you'll have *lefties screaming that vital information will be withheld. We'll then see another conspiracy theory sprout, led by the media. If you think about it how else will the media get a Trump Bump?

In the past twenty years we've had:

Truthers - 911
Birthers - Obama
Gaters - Trump

Social media has turned everybody into a nutter.
* edit
I would be remiss if I didn't include the spastic right in this.

posted by thavoice

How is it that Pelosi seems to be the voice of reason now for the Dems regarding impeachment and this report?

She is correct, but the rest of those jackals cannot resist to keep attacking 

Unfortunately, the democratic party has shifted so far left that Pelosi is now "middle" in comparison...

posted by BoatShoes

 

Kind of funny to me - in both the Hillary email case and likely in this case - much to the chagrin of people who dislike them - the criminal investigators have set high bars for the standards of criminal intent necessary and really we should all think that a good result in a society that values freedom. 

In the Clinton case, the statute does not require intent. 

The twisting and turning never ceases.

posted by QuakerOats

 

 

In the Clinton case, the statute does not require intent. 

 

The twisting and turning never ceases.

The first lesson in first year crim law is that all crimes require proving mens rea "criminal intent" and an actus reus "criminal act"

The criminal intent in Hillary's case - 18 USC 793(f) - is "gross negligence" and her "intent" did not rise to that standard following Supreme interpretation of the espionage act. 

As with Trump - collusion that would rise to the level of a crime - conspiracy against the united states under 18 USC 371 - you have to prove that the parties "knowingly" agreed to commit some crime. Per Barr's letter, the Special Counsel found nothing that would rise to such an illegal agreement. 

Hope that helps! 

Subsection (f) of the pertinent statute (the Espionage Act, codified at Section 793 of Title 18, U.S. Code) makes it a felony to mishandle classified information “through gross negligence”

Take care

posted by QuakerOats

 

Subsection (f) of the pertinent statute (the Espionage Act, codified at Section 793 of Title 18, U.S. Code) makes it a felony to mishandle classified information “through gross negligence”

 

 

Take care

BoatShoes' post addressed that.

"The criminal intent in Hillary's case - 18 USC 793(f) - is 'gross negligence' and her 'intent' did not rise to that standard following Supreme interpretation of the espionage act."

My bolding, obviously.

Trumps new budget cuts out funding for special Olympics. What kind of soulless human does that? I used to volunteer in HS for the special Olympics and it was awesome. 

posted by SportsAndLady

Trumps new budget cuts out funding for special Olympics. What kind of soulless human does that? I used to volunteer in HS for the special Olympics and it was awesome. 

To be fair, it’s hard to justify the Special Olympics  when there’s so much money to be made in charter schools. 

I'm sure this will be an unpopular view, but I don't have a problem with that.  As far as I can tell, the only rebuttal to it would be an emotional appeal.  A sort of "Think of the children" reaction.

Historically, emotional choices on money matters have rarely been wise.

Having said that, I certainly would hate to see the Special Olympics go away.  I wonder if they would be able to have the drop privately funded.  With the name recognition and publicity of this drop in funding, I would think so.

So Jack Dorsey, the face of twitter, just had a short meeting with Trump. Firstly the meeting was so short I don't know how in the world anybody could accomplish anything. Jack is quite progressive and what he things Trump will do to help him and his company is beyond me. The last person I would go to for anything concerning social policy would be Trump wtf. I think both of these screwballs were just looking for that media recognition of appearing to be working together or something.

posted by CenterBHSFan

So Jack Dorsey, the face of twitter, just had a short meeting with Trump. Firstly the meeting was so short I don't know how in the world anybody could accomplish anything. Jack is quite progressive and what he things Trump will do to help him and his company is beyond me. The last person I would go to for anything concerning social policy would be Trump wtf. I think both of these screwballs were just looking for that media recognition of appearing to be working together or something.

I believe he went to thank Trump for making him billions of dollars.  The more Trump tweets the more this guy makes money

posted by CenterBHSFan

So Jack Dorsey, the face of twitter, just had a short meeting with Trump. Firstly the meeting was so short I don't know how in the world anybody could accomplish anything. Jack is quite progressive and what he things Trump will do to help him and his company is beyond me. The last person I would go to for anything concerning social policy would be Trump wtf. I think both of these screwballs were just looking for that media recognition of appearing to be working together or something.

From a story I saw, I noticed a certain someone whining about losing "followers" due to Twitter's occasional purging of bot and spam accounts earlier in the day of said meeting. While that wasn't given as the official reason for their meeting, it wouldn't be shocking if that turned into the focus of it.

posted by Heretic

From a story I saw, I noticed a certain someone whining about losing "followers" due to Twitter's occasional purging of bot and spam accounts earlier in the day of said meeting. While that wasn't given as the official reason for their meeting, it wouldn't be shocking if that turned into the focus of it.

Saw that too and actually thought that was the purpose of the meeting leading up to it lol.

Sometimes Trump does something too stupid even to just be trolling.

You presumably don't want McGahn to testify before Congress.  Then don't go and suggest he misspoke or was mistaken about his THIRTY HOURS of interviews with Mueller's team.

I think, sure, maybe he really is trying to goad Dems into impeaching him because that will rally his base, especially if the IG and Barr come out with some concerning stuff around the whole investigation.  I just don't see who that mastermind in the Trump Admin would be (certainly not the Orange One).

posted by gut

I just don't see who that mastermind in the Trump Admin would be (certainly not the Orange One).

I don't know if it is just blind luck but Trump makes a comment on a hypothetical and Andrew McCabe is out there spelling out how dirt from foreign operatives is laundered to political campaigns and its completely legal cause its been properly washed.

https://www.realclearpolitics.com/video/2019/06/14/andrew_mccabe_not_illegal_for_americans_to_contract_out_opposition_research_to_foreign_individuals.html

posted by majorspark

I don't know if it is just blind luck but Trump makes a comment on a hypothetical...

That's an interesting point.  Not the first time he's done this - push the buttons to provoke a lot of uber partisan hot-takes, and then he finally spells it out and makes his detractors look stupid pushing fake news.

I didn't think his response to the hypothetical was bad, it was just insufficient.  Yes, you should not invite foreign influence or possibly "owe" someone something.  However, I think you actually have a duty to hear it, and then pass it on to the media and FBI so that it's not covered up. 

The risk is that you end-up being used to legitimize a smear.  And, as we've seen, that's precisely what happened with Russia-collusion.  And I doubt there was any coordination with McCabe, but I think you have to be an idiot not to realize that it's 100% true (the laundering of otherwise illegal/unethical oppo research).  It's exactly what Hillary did - it's a distinction without a difference to have the information voluntarily delivered be illegal, but money funneled thru a couple of third parties to BUY that info isn't illegal.  And I think this particular area, and some others, are kind of rigged to work against outsiders - even if you know about the dirt peddaling network, you probably don't know how to access it legally.

What people, myself included, forget is that Trump is very experienced in the political influence and dirty politics sphere.  He doesn't have to be all that savvy, but because of his money and profile he's been playing that game for close to 50 years.  He plays dumb because it comes naturally, but sometimes I think he is setting traps for his opponents.  He's also very good at leveraging this unique political asset where his words are malleable, and forgiven for being prone to misspeaking and abusing hyperbole - he gets the do over, and uses that to his advantage to bait his opponents into indefensible positions.