2020 Presidential Election thread

I have dropped this quote from my friend before, but let's real as far as the left is concerned (and you can extend this to the right) it's not so much the pussy grabbing, but who actually is doing the pussy grabbing. 

With that being said, anyone who has virtued about Donald being a pussy grabber will now be 100% full of shit if they vote for Biden.  Just like anyone who virtued about Bill was 100% full of shit when they voted for Donald (I plugged this in here, because boogie was going to come in with his whataboutism about evangelicals).

posted by like_that

I have dropped this quote from my friend before, but let's real as far as the left is concerned (and you can extend this to the right) it's not so much the pussy grabbing, but who actually is doing the pussy grabbing. 

With that being said, anyone who has virtued about Donald being a pussy grabber will now be 100% full of shit if they vote for Biden.  Just like anyone who virtued about Bill was 100% full of shit when they voted for Donald (I plugged this in here, because boogie was going to come in with his whataboutism about evangelicals).

Just like I find the whole "Trump's the devil" bullshit hilarious coming from some of these media & celebrity people. Not difficult to Google and find pics of people like Whoopi Goldberg, Joy Behar, etc who now think Trump is Satan cheesing it up in photos like they were besties years ago. It was fine when he was just a rich guy who was cool to be seen with but now? Hypocrites.

posted by like_that

I have dropped this quote from my friend before, but let's real as far as the left is concerned (and you can extend this to the right) it's not so much the pussy grabbing, but who actually is doing the pussy grabbing. 

With that being said, anyone who has virtued about Donald being a pussy grabber will now be 100% full of shit if they vote for Biden.  Just like anyone who virtued about Bill was 100% full of shit when they voted for Donald (I plugged this in here, because boogie was going to come in with his whataboutism about evangelicals).

No I won't. I get your point. I'm interested to watch those who screamed about Trump's p-grabbing figure out what they'll do with Biden.  

In other news Justin Amash is running for the LP's nomination to be their presidential candidate.  If he were to win, that would settle my vote for 2020 pretty easily.  I didn't agree with his take on Trump's impeachment, but overall I am a fan. It should be an easy choice for everyone, but unfortunately our society has been duped into thinking we only have 2 options.

If Amash wins the LP nomination, who does he hurt more?  Biden or Trump.  I see arguments for both sides.

posted by BR1986FB

Just like I find the whole "Trump's the devil" bullshit hilarious coming from some of these media & celebrity people. Not difficult to Google and find pics of people like Whoopi Goldberg, Joy Behar, etc who now think Trump is Satan cheesing it up in photos like they were besties years ago. It was fine when he was just a rich guy who was cool to be seen with but now? Hypocrites.

Yep he was NEVER called a rapist, bigot, racist, homophobe, liar...until he became president.  

posted by like_that

In other news Justin Amash is running for the LP's nomination to be their presidential candidate.  If he were to win, that would settle my vote for 2020 pretty easily.  I didn't agree with his take on Trump's impeachment, but overall I am a fan. It should be an easy choice for everyone, but unfortunately our society has been duped into thinking we only have 2 options.

If Amash wins the LP nomination, who does he hurt more?  Biden or Trump.  I see arguments for both sides.

 

It hurts the Dems way more

posted by Spock

Yep he was NEVER called a rapist, bigot, racist, homophobe, liar...until he became president.  

Well, other than how that's not true, GOOD POINT!!!!

posted by like_that

If Amash wins the LP nomination, who does he hurt more?  Biden or Trump.  I see arguments for both sides.

Getting in late and with much less press than Gary Johnson, who along with Jill Stein had 0 impact on any state race in 2016.  But Michigan was so close, I could see Amash allowing Biden to win MI (not that Trump might not lose MI, anyway).

Our elections are practically rigged against 3rd party candidates.  Amash will never get on the debate stage, which is a big blow.  And your major media outlets will barely cover him, which is an even bigger blow.  And those two together severely limit how much money you can raise, which is the nail in the coffin.

posted by gut

Getting in late and with much less press than Gary Johnson, who along with Jill Stein had 0 impact on any state race in 2016.  But Michigan was so close, I could see Amash allowing Biden to win MI (not that Trump might not lose MI, anyway).

Our elections are practically rigged against 3rd party candidates.  Amash will never get on the debate stage, which is a big blow.  And your major media outlets will barely cover him, which is an even bigger blow.  And those two together severely limit how much money you can raise, which is the nail in the coffin.

I've seen the same argument for stealing votes from Biden.   I don't think Amash will win the LP nomination, though. 

While I prefer Jacob Hornberger, Amash would definitely bring a lot more name recognition. He's significantly better than Gary Johnson, at the very least. It's funny (sad) watching both sides complain that he's going to "steal" votes from their preferred candidate and give the election to the other guy. Again. Same shit happened in 2016. Same shit happened in 2012. It's always the most important election of our lives. It's always too important to throw away your vote. It'll be the same shit in 2024. 2028. 2032. Until the end of time.

With Ranked Choice Voting Amash would win the election outright. Ranked choice voting fixes a lot of issues.

Ranked Choice Voting? Don't know that I've heard of that. Is there a quick-n-easy explanation?

posted by Heretic

Ranked Choice Voting? Don't know that I've heard of that. Is there a quick-n-easy explanation?

You rank the candidates in order of who you'd like to see in office, and each rank has a point value.  Candidate with the highest points wins.

Are the Bernie bros gonna go for Biden or another candidate?

posted by O-Trap

You rank the candidates in order of who you'd like to see in office, and each rank has a point value.  Candidate with the highest points wins.

Lol. Of course justin, the libertarian, thinks the Libertarian candidate would win that style of election. 

posted by SportsAndLady

Lol. Of course justin, the libertarian, thinks the Libertarian candidate would win that style of election. 

In a three-candidate race, he/she might.  The polarization of the major two parties would obviously result in most people putting one candidate at the top and one at the bottom, so the third-party candidate would probably get the second-place pick on a LOT of ballots.  Couple that with the first-place votes it would get from the sub-set of voters that would actually pick them, and it might end up electing a third-party candidate.

posted by SportsAndLady

Lol. Of course justin, the libertarian, thinks the Libertarian candidate would win that style of election. 

Amash would win in my completely hypothetical situation, yes. My preferred candidate would not, but Amash would.

posted by O-Trap

You rank the candidates in order of who you'd like to see in office, and each rank has a point value.  Candidate with the highest points wins.

This isn't quite right.

For a single office, like for a mayor or governor, RCV helps to elect a candidate who reflects a majority of voters in a single election even when several viable candidates are in the race. It does this by counting the votes in rounds.

Voters pick a first-choice candidate and have the option to rank backup candidates in order of their choice: second, third, and so on. If a candidate receives more than half of the first choices, that candidate wins, just like in any other election. However, if there is no majority winner after counting first choices, the race is decided by an "instant runoff." The candidate with the fewest votes is eliminated, and voters who picked that candidate as ‘number 1’ will have their votes count for their next choice. This process continues until a candidate wins with more than half of the votes.

https://www.fairvote.org/rcv#how_rcv_works

posted by justincredible

This isn't quite right.

For a single office, like for a mayor or governor, RCV helps to elect a candidate who reflects a majority of voters in a single election even when several viable candidates are in the race. It does this by counting the votes in rounds.

Voters pick a first-choice candidate and have the option to rank backup candidates in order of their choice: second, third, and so on. If a candidate receives more than half of the first choices, that candidate wins, just like in any other election. However, if there is no majority winner after counting first choices, the race is decided by an "instant runoff." The candidate with the fewest votes is eliminated, and voters who picked that candidate as ‘number 1’ will have their votes count for their next choice. This process continues until a candidate wins with more than half of the votes.

https://www.fairvote.org/rcv#how_rcv_works

This is a lot more specific than I was trying to be, but yeah, it probably works better, too.  The version I described would basically just result in the candidate that everyone hated the least, more than likely.

posted by justincredible

This isn't quite right.

For a single office, like for a mayor or governor, RCV helps to elect a candidate who reflects a majority of voters in a single election even when several viable candidates are in the race. It does this by counting the votes in rounds.

Voters pick a first-choice candidate and have the option to rank backup candidates in order of their choice: second, third, and so on. If a candidate receives more than half of the first choices, that candidate wins, just like in any other election. However, if there is no majority winner after counting first choices, the race is decided by an "instant runoff." The candidate with the fewest votes is eliminated, and voters who picked that candidate as ‘number 1’ will have their votes count for their next choice. This process continues until a candidate wins with more than half of the votes.

https://www.fairvote.org/rcv#how_rcv_works

Makes sense, but two big concerns over your thought Amash would wind up winning.

1. The way elections are now, the two big parties get like 95+% of the votes, with libertarians, green party and others getting the scraps. Unless, I'm reading this totally wrong, wouldn't Amash need to get a ton of votes just to not get eliminated regardless of how many people voted him #2? Because it'd take him being close enough to the big parties in support to not wind up being eventually eliminated. To me, it sounds like he'd be like, "I got up to 6% after outlasting all the other 3rd party candidates!!! And now I'm third out of three, so, well, it was fun while it lasted..."

2. As much of a shit-show as people raise over elections now regardless of who wins (2008 JJ had a couple people up in arms over Obama winning Ohio because McCain carried far more counties, but due to dominating the big cities, Obama had the edge in votes; 2016 nationally had all sorts of libs wanting to abolish the Electoral because Hillary won the popular vote), man, it'd be pure fucking chaos if either Trump or Biden had a 47-45 lead AND would have also got the Electoral, but because of this, wound up losing because the other guy was a more popular #2.

Heh, Trump and Biden both remind me of #2. Lol.

The reason I think he would win is because ranked choice voting eliminates the need to vote defensively. So instead of voting against Trump, or against Biden, you can vote for Amash, and put Trump or Biden as your second choice, and you're still 'protected' from the other guy.

It eliminates the 'wasted vote' argument. The 'stealing votes from' argument.