LOCKED: George Floyd

posted by kayo

Which professions ‘don’t get to have bad apples’?

People "authorized" to use physical force against other human beings.

posted by justincredible

3rd precinct is now extra crispy:

https://twitter.com/Breaking911/status/1266210344462139393

City might wanna get a handle on this. Wtf.

Minnesota police arrested a CNN reporter and his camera crew. Wtf?

posted by O-Trap

At the risk of sounding like I'm coming to the defense, peaceful protest certainly hasn't done shit and has been regularly mocked.

After all, the Boston Tea Party was hardly an orderly, civil discourse.

I had to bring this over from the other thread.  I get where you are going with this, but I don't think this is the best comparison.  The only things damaged from the Boston tea party were the tea and a padlock on the ship. 

posted by like_that

Minnesota police arrested a CNN reporter and his camera crew. Wtf?

I think they are doing it wrong.

As for letting them get into police station and burn it down......seems like that would have been where to draw the line on these "protesters"...oh I mean rioters.

If it gets worse because now they feel emboldened...they will move to the next target to get and live bullets will likely be there waiting.

posted by queencitybuckeye

Part of it is the cops modifying the "blue line" attitude to include actively working on helping to get rid of bad cops instead of covering for them or just standing by. How you get there is the tough part of course.

That's a valid point.

I think most LEO agencies operate kind of how they treat Milton in Office Space.  If they want you to go away, they'll move you into worse and worse roles until eventually you're stuck behind a desk with little ability to do harm.

 Or they do buckle up and fire an incompetent officer and he winds up at a tiny department, where again, he's still able to do far less harm.

I think there are extreme outliers to that rule though, and this unfortunately was one of those times. 

Watch the video of the CNN crew getting "arrested"....shit looks fake as hell.

posted by Spock

Watch the video of the CNN crew getting "arrested"....shit looks fake as hell.

Dude, the city admitted they did it and let them go. The Minneapolis police force sounds like a pretty retarded bunch.

Any legal people on here? What would be taking them this long to "investigate' to charge the guy?

I thought this was a good thread on the intricacies of 1st Degree Homicide, 2nd, 3rd, etc. and what to charge him and the others with.

https://twitter.com/PoliceLawProf/status/1265664134600953856?s=20

Dude will plea down to involuntary manslaughter.  Bet he only gets a few years.

posted by Spock

Watch the video of the CNN crew getting "arrested"....shit looks fake as hell.

Do explain, what makes it look fake as hell to you?

posted by SportsAndLady

Do explain, what makes it look fake as hell to you?

All of it.

https://www.breitbart.com/crime/2020/05/28/minneapolis-mayor-to-rioters-please-practice-social-distancing-wear-masks/

So how about instead of making that statement....you make a statement about not burning your city down.  And WTF......you passed out masks?

Lol CC saying someone getting arrested looks fake. What is the point of believing that? You must live in a fucking bubble if that looked fake. 

Clever.

https://www.gofundme.com/f/scores-bar-mpls-riot-rebuild

If they burn down Matt’s Bar, I’m going up there to riot over that.

posted by justincredible

https://www.gofundme.com/f/scores-bar-mpls-riot-rebuild

There is a video of him crying and people trying to steal his safe too, very sad. It's incredible that people condone this behavior (not saying anyone on here is). What about all of the people employed by these businesses, let alone the owners of them. Your fucking up your own neighborhood's inhabitants bc you are mad/ you're taking advantage of this situation (Antifa fucks). 

The National Guard is there now, tonight might get even crazier. 

posted by iclfan2

There is a video of him crying and people trying to steal his safe too, very sad. It's incredible that people condone this behavior (not saying anyone on here is). What about all of the people employed by these businesses, let alone the owners of them. Your fucking up your own neighborhood's inhabitants bc you are mad/ you're taking advantage of this situation (Antifa fucks). 

The National Guard is there now, tonight might get even crazier. 

Geraldo Riveria was bashing the hell out the Mayor this morning for letting this happen.  Basically, tearing down your neighborhood that likely wont be rebuilt, you think that Target is coming back?  Hell no.  

He blamed the liberal Mayor for just letting it happen.  

posted by Spock

AAs for the incident, I have seen the 2 videos...what happened between the 2?  Likely this rogue cop instigated some sort of resisting from the guy and he pushed back a little, and the cop decided to restrain him in a way to really harm him.  Hell by the look on the cops face, it looked like he knew he was killing him.

So does he get off with lesser charge if the guy resisted?

I'm going to side-step the first part of what you said.

I don't think it should matter.  Resisting arrest is an additional charge, but it poses no more threat of violence to anyone, so he was no more deserving of being killed.
 

posted by justincredible

https://twitter.com/stillgray/status/1266100816659636224

They're going to be disappointed when they realize that those phones can be tracked through the IMEI (as long as they're connected), and they can be shut off and prevented from service, even with other carriers.
 

posted by Spock

Kind of defeats the purpose of complaining about police brutality.  

Not really.  People tried peacefully kneeling, but that received chiding and backlash, too.
 

posted by Ironman92

Nothing in any way acceptable what that officer did....he should rot in hell.

I feel this is a safe place for me to ask this. I’m confused about the rage a bit. Any cop killing anyone is awful obviously. Aren’t more white people killed by cops than any other race? I’m ignorant on this....someone kindly help me out. My FB is blown up talking about white cops murdering black people. If they are only killing black people I get it, but numbers I saw show way more white people are killed by cops. I get this particular individual one and there have been several others in recent time. 

It's not "way more" according to anything I've seen, and that gap is even narrowing.  I did see someone share a similar chart yesterday, and this year, I believe it had the numbers at 41 white people and 37 black people.  There are six white people for every black person in the US.
 

posted by iclfan2

That convo will go like this: yes more white people are killed, but blacks are a smaller part of the population, but they commit more crimes, but they only get arrested for more crimes bc of racism... no way to prove any of the last part

Eh, you can't even really prove anything but the first two points.  The "commit more crimes" part is also nearly impossible to prove.
 

posted by Spock

1.  safe place....LOL.

2.  No, cops killing some people is acceptable due to the what the damage that person it doing.

You do realize that "safe place" isn't always used to mean "safe space" the way colleges have started using it the last few years, right?

Also, holy shit.  Did you just say that one justification for a cop killing a person is the damage he's doing?  How much damage warrants killing?  What if he poses no threat to anyone's safety?  Still justifiable for Officer Billy Badass to mow him down?
 

posted by MontyBrunswick

I mean, yeah I agree...but I don't know how you prevent them 100%. They're going to slip through the cracks.

There's one obvious thing that could happen: Cops being held accountable when they kill citizens who aren't posing an immediate threat to commit violence.  Too many seemingly get off with a little slap on the wrist.  That "thin blue line" needs to do some self-policing if they want their image to change.
 

posted by Fab4Runner

They don't just slip through cracks. How many of these officers have disciplinary records? How many are for excessive use of force? How many have been accused of domestic violence? Why is it so hard to fire a shitty police officer? Many fired officers are hired back, sometimes because of an administrative error during the investigation. There are major problems with a lot of LEAs.

I know it's too broad a stroke, but I believe the saying goes, "Cops beat; firemen cheat."  Neither is a monolith, of course, but it's worth wondering why such a quip exists.
 

posted by iclfan2

The problem is unions. A ton of people in multiple industries should be fired all the time, but it’s almost impossible bc of unions and lawsuits. 

This is a huge issue.  I know this might be an unpopular opinion on here, but I don't think government positions should have unions.
 

posted by jmog

Not a true statement at all. If the whole thing was bad we would literally see 1000s of these cases every year.

Man, that's where you draw the line?
 

posted by kayo

Which professions ‘don’t get to have bad apples’?

The ones where being a bad apple results in life-changing violence without repercussion.
 

posted by Spock

https://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2020/05/shocking-revelation-george-floyd-officer-derek-chauvin-worked-security-minneapolis-club-end-last-year/?utm_source=Twitter&utm_campaign=websitesharingbuttons

 

This is interesting also.  

I have to admit, I discount anything said in an article if the title starts with something like "Shocking Revelation."  That's some tabloid-level writing, right there.
 

posted by Laley23

People have to be honest with themselves if anything is going to change, the man wouldn’t be dead if he were white. 

I think I've mentioned it before, but the one time I had an officer pull a gun on me, this crossed my mind.  All other things being equal in my life, if I'd had darker skin, I genuinely had to wonder if it had turned out so peacefully.
 

posted by justincredible

https://twitter.com/Lukewearechange/status/1266209443798228992
 

I know this is going to sound awful, but not being a fan of government authority of the use of force to carry it out, I'm not 100% mad about this.
 

posted by queencitybuckeye

Part of it is the cops modifying the "blue line" attitude to include actively working on helping to get rid of bad cops instead of covering for them or just standing by. How you get there is the tough part of course.

Bingo.  No covering up for cops.  Even minor stuff.  If cops are going to have the right to use physical force, even lethal at times, then each officer had better have their house in perfect order from a legal and ethical standpoint.
 

posted by queencitybuckeye

I'm quite sure we probably do, the ones that result in death make the news.

I think you're probably right.
 

posted by like_that

I had to bring this over from the other thread.  I get where you are going with this, but I don't think this is the best comparison.  The only things damaged from the Boston tea party were the tea and a padlock on the ship. 

I just looked it up.  About 92,000 pounds of tea.  Present-day value of the damages is estimated to be north of $1MM.  That's certainly significant.

It may have been less public, but I think it's a more apt parallel than perhaps you were considering.
 

posted by Spock

Dude will plea down to involuntary manslaughter.  Bet he only gets a few years.

Wonder how soon the riot will start when that happens.

Dude's gofundme has eclipsed the $100k goal already. Awesome.