SCOTUS Decisions

Pre-RvW, were there any states with provisions that made exceptions when it came to the health of the mother, or were they blanket bans?

posted by ptown_trojans_1

My views have evolved on this and that's mainly due to my wife and sister. Both have endometriosis and pretty much have explained to me the dangers of being pregnant and how things could go wrong over the course of the pregnancy. My wife isn't in favor of abortion, she just wants to have the option to terminate the  pregnancy if it starts to endanger her own health. This is also the popular view on polls that most people support the ability to have an abortion if it endangers the health of the mother. If you straight up ban abortion or put severe limits on it, women like my wife may have no options when things go bad. I've also had two friends that nearly died in childbirth because of the issue. 

I don't think Ds are all in favor of abortions, it is just the choice/ option to have when things go badly during a pregnancy. Sometimes the best option is to abort, at least as of right now medically wise. 

I used to not care as I'm just a dude. But I've come around to seeing the benefits of just having the option, even past 20 weeks. 

I totally get this view, and don't disagree nor want anything blanket banned. My issue is with the people who support 20+ week abortions just for the hell of it. They all talk with these one off scenarios, but I don't think many people have said a woman should die due to her unborn baby. The using abortions as birth control is the weird part.

The left knows they probably have no chance to derail Kavanaugh; they are now going to try and say he would be ok with Trump pardoning himself, in order to bring in that whole topic .....yada, yada, yada ...  

When you are devoid of good ideas and rational thought; you do stupid, hysterical stuff I guess. 

posted by QuakerOats

The left knows they probably have no chance to derail Kavanaugh; they are now going to try and say he would be ok with Trump pardoning himself, in order to bring in that whole topic .....yada, yada, yada ...  

 

When you are devoid of good ideas and rational thought; you do stupid, hysterical stuff I guess. 

You should know!

posted by justincredible

Pre-RvW, were there any states with provisions that made exceptions when it came to the health of the mother, or were they blanket bans?

I'm not so sure. I'm sure some states had exceptions and some states still do. I do know a handfull of states have trigger laws that if Rv.W is overturned abortion is straight outlawed. 

posted by iclfan2

I totally get this view, and don't disagree nor want anything blanket banned. My issue is with the people who support 20+ week abortions just for the hell of it. They all talk with these one off scenarios, but I don't think many people have said a woman should die due to her unborn baby. The using abortions as birth control is the weird part.

I'm not so sure who's saying that. The only argument I've ever heard is just having the access, the ability to have one is the concern.

posted by QuakerOats

The left knows they probably have no chance to derail Kavanaugh; they are now going to try and say he would be ok with Trump pardoning himself, in order to bring in that whole topic .....yada, yada, yada ...  

 

When you are devoid of good ideas and rational thought; you do stupid, hysterical stuff I guess. 

Count me as one where I want to know his thoughts. I think it is a legit question to ask if a sitting President can pardon himself. Could Nixon have pardoned himself? Could Clinton have? What exactly are the limits of the President in regards to these matters? Sounds like a legit question to a SCOTUS nominee to me. He also wrote a 2009 review article about it. 
 

The tweets coming from the Hollywood elites as they freak out over a person who reveres the constitution and the rule of law are pretty priceless.  While it is downright alarming that they are so removed from reality, it is comical. 

posted by ptown_trojans_1

My views have evolved on this and that's mainly due to my wife and sister. Both have endometriosis and pretty much have explained to me the dangers of being pregnant and how things could go wrong over the course of the pregnancy.

That seems like a pretty extreme position, but is typical fearmongering from the Dems.  I believe even the Church accepts abortion in the case where the mother's life could be in danger, and has for a long time.  I don't believe the Right, for the most part, has ever opposed abortion in cases of rape, incest and endangerment to the mother.  Extremists, sure, but the example you give is never going to be illegal even if RvW got overturned.

It's the same thing with birth control.  No one has ever said it shouldn't be prescribed for off-label (non-birth control) uses.  That's an issue, potentially, with some insurance companies, as it is with any drug when talking off-label use.  But even the infamous Hobby Lobby case dealt with like 3-4 of the 12+ pills available.

If you took away abortion as a wedge issue, would Democrats ever win another election?  I almost hope a challenge does come before SCOTUS (although I can't see how) so it can be smacked down and put this definitively to rest.

Same could be said for Republicans and guns, but that seems to be a much less settled issue in many respects.

posted by ptown_trojans_1

My views have evolved on this and that's mainly due to my wife and sister. Both have endometriosis and pretty much have explained to me the dangers of being pregnant and how things could go wrong over the course of the pregnancy. My wife isn't in favor of abortion, she just wants to have the option to terminate the  pregnancy if it starts to endanger her own health. This is also the popular view on polls that most people support the ability to have an abortion if it endangers the health of the mother. If you straight up ban abortion or put severe limits on it, women like my wife may have no options when things go bad. I've also had two friends that nearly died in childbirth because of the issue. 

I don't think Ds are all in favor of abortions, it is just the choice/ option to have when things go badly during a pregnancy. Sometimes the best option is to abort, at least as of right now medically wise. 

I used to not care as I'm just a dude. But I've come around to seeing the benefits of just having the option, even past 20 weeks. 

Marginal case, less than 4% fall into the "health of mother, rape, incest" that the left hangs onto.

I think 95% of the "right" or "pro-life" side of the aisle would vote "yes" right now on banning abortions that are just for economic reasons or the "oops, I don't want a child but got pregnant) reasons but was iron clad when it comes to allowing abortions in those marginal cases of "health, rape, and incest".

The problem is the left don't really want that, they want abortions at will for any reason.

posted by jmog

Marginal case, less than 4% fall into the "health of mother, rape, incest" that the left hangs onto.

 

I think 95% of the "right" or "pro-life" side of the aisle would vote "yes" right now on banning abortions that are just for economic reasons or the "oops, I don't want a child but got pregnant) reasons but was iron clad when it comes to allowing abortions in those marginal cases of "health, rape, and incest".

 

The problem is the left don't really want that, they want abortions at will for any reason.

As it should be. Aside from religion, what reason do you feel is good enough to prevent an abortion for any reason?

posted by Rotinaj

As it should be. Aside from religion, what reason do you feel is good enough to prevent an abortion for any reason?

Because it’s killing a life, has nothing to do with religion for me. If you are ok with abortion at will then you are ok with killing a 2 week old baby at will or you have a hypocritical stance on the subject in my opinion. 

You dont kill a human life unless there is a valid, pressing reason to (self defense, possibly punishment for murder, etc). 

posted by Rotinaj

As it should be. Aside from religion, what reason do you feel is good enough to prevent an abortion for any reason?

That’s a pretty fucked up opinion. Don’t have sex if you don’t want a baby. If you do have one, and decide to kill it past 20 weeks while viable for no other reason than not wanting it, you are a piece of shit.

Id be fine with the 20 week cutoff. As for the whole just not having sex if you don’t want a kid thing, it’s simply unrealistic. 

I don't really think the Government should be making those decisions, but personally I think they are fucked up.  The more data proves most abortions are done for reasons that aren't rape, health of the mother, etc the more I am personally against it.  The main argument starts and ends when you believe it is a human pretty much.  If you take a look at a fetal chart, I am not sure how some people could be comfortable with killing a baby at 20 weeks. 

Edit: I am not sure how it is now, but I would prefer schools to teach actual preventive techniques and safe sex practices instead of trying to scare kids away from having sex.  I graduated in 2006. 

Also want to add that I find the left's infatuation with abortions very odd. 

posted by like_that

Also want to add that I find the left's infatuation with abortions very odd. 

yea they are all about liberties and rights...."women have the right to do what she wants with her body....yadyadyada.  But when it comes to my right to carry a gun they dont seem to care about rights

posted by Rotinaj

Id be fine with the 20 week cutoff. As for the whole just not having sex if you don’t want a kid thing, it’s simply unrealistic. 

To your second part, wear a condom while the girl takes birth control. It isn’t that hard. Let’s all be honest, if the guy could be the one to control the BC, there’d be a lot less problems. 

posted by like_that

Also want to add that I find the left's infatuation with abortions very odd. 

The right chose pro life, so the left has to take the opposite....and, as usual, they crank up the rhetoric to 11.

It's a wedge issue.  All bullshit.  I doubt 9 out of 10 people actually disagree on much with respect to this issue.  It's an easy issue, right or left, to stump on (as opposed to complex issues like economics and foreign policy).

posted by iclfan2

To your second part, wear a condom while the girl takes birth control. It isn’t that hard. Let’s all be honest, if the guy could be the one to control the BC, there’d be a lot less problems. 

It's always going to come back to health and socio economic issues.  While I agree it shouldn't be a form of birth control, banning abortions would be like the war on drugs (just unnecessarily criminalizing people who otherwise outstanding citizens). 

Women who aren't prepared to raise a child are still going to seek abortions - it can be safe and accessible, or not.

This is gross. And spectacularly un-funny. Why is this woman a thing?