Progressives, part 3...

posted by CenterBHSFan

So, I'm going to go out on a limb and conjecture that this will be used by the Dems as leverage if all else fails. Since, you know, they are already testing the waters to see how far it will float:

Curious, do you agree with the Trump argument that the President is absolute on their power and what they can do? The only check on them is impeachment and Supreme Court rulings? 

That's the argument his lawyers made yesterday, which led to that question.

The Trump legal answer to that question was, yes. If the act did not lead to an impeachment. 

posted by ptown_trojans_1

Curious, do you agree with the Trump argument that the President is absolute on their power and what they can do? The only check on them is impeachment and Supreme Court rulings? 

That's the argument his lawyers made yesterday, which led to that question.

The Trump legal answer to that question was, yes. If the act did not lead to an impeachment. 

No, I do not agree with that premise.

Why is it that, if anybody should point out that the Dems are out of fucking control that they are somehow in agreeance with shit like that?

And why is it that when also pointing out the obvious we gotta go through the whole assery of the "yeah, but" ?

Is it really so hard to simply say that they are doing wrong?

posted by CenterBHSFan

No, I do not agree with that premise.

Why is it that, if anybody should point out that the Dems are out of fucking control that they are somehow in agreeance with shit like that?

And why is it that when also pointing out the obvious we gotta go through the whole assery of the "yeah, but" ?

Is it really so hard to simply say that they are doing wrong?

As a show of good faith, I will start off:

It was wrong of Hillary Clinton to start questioning Barack Obama's actual nationality.

See how easy that is?

posted by CenterBHSFan

No, I do not agree with that premise.

Why is it that, if anybody should point out that the Dems are out of fucking control that they are somehow in agreeance with shit like that?

And why is it that when also pointing out the obvious we gotta go through the whole assery of the "yeah, but" ?

Is it really so hard to simply say that they are doing wrong?

I'm just going with what was quoted and said in the latest Trump court case. Nothing more, nothing less. 

I provided the context for that quote that is all. 

I think it is a very interesting case on Presidential power. 

I actually think many on this board will be against Trump in this case as he is claiming absolute power. Again, these are his words and his lawyers saying this. 

posted by ptown_trojans_1

I'm just going with what was quoted and said in the latest Trump court case. Nothing more, nothing less. 

I provided the context for that quote that is all. 

I think it is a very interesting case on Presidential power. 

I actually think many on this board will be against Trump in this case as he is claiming absolute power. Again, these are his words and his lawyers saying this. 

Yeah, absolute monarchial power shouldn't even be given a chance, unless it is for me.

posted by CenterBHSFan

Yeah, absolute monarchial power shouldn't even be given a chance, unless it is for me.

Then, you are obviously not voting for Trump then, because Trump is the one arguing he can do whatever he wants with little to no oversight. 

His lawyers and him have been making that argument on the trail and in these court cases. 

Unless, this is another example where people on here just disregard everything that Trump says....

posted by ptown_trojans_1

Then, you are obviously not voting for Trump then, because Trump is the one arguing he can do whatever he wants with little to no oversight. 

His lawyers and him have been making that argument on the trail and in these court cases. 

Unless, this is another example where people on here just disregard everything that Trump says....

Yea I’m just gonna vote for an 80 year old geriatric who stands for nothing I agree with because Trump says stupid shit. I won’t vote for him in the primary, not that it matters.

On a different note, it needs to be a federal crime to block traffic. These pro Hamas brain dead losers continue to do dumb shit and keep getting more aggressive at their protests. Luckily it’s only happening in liberal cities that deserve it, but the two tier justice system is out of control. 

posted by iclfan2

Yea I’m just gonna vote for an 80 year old geriatric who stands for nothing I agree with because Trump says stupid shit. I won’t vote for him in the primary, not that it matters.

Just says or you think he won't do now?

You don't think Trump will actually do the stuff he says? Him saying it is one thing, but his lawyers saying it is another. The guardrails that prevented the worst actions are gone. 

I guess this is the main difference on why I will never vote for him as I see his words and actions as against everything this country has stood for. 

posted by ptown_trojans_1

Unless, this is another example where people on here just disregard everything that Trump says....

I think over half the board votes Libertarian, but you continue to cast that same aspersion that everyone here is MAGA.

As for Trump, he's going to make whatever legal arguments he can to get the case dismissed or acquitted, so I don't get my knickers all in a bunch over that.

The POTUS probably should have near immunity while in office.  The DOJ and courts have always avoided weighing in on that subject for what should be obvious reasons, so congrats Dems.

And, no, I'm not arguing Trump had immunity with the election interference stuff.  Seems clear that was related to actions as a candidate and not official duties, which means he can and should face criminal action when out of office.  That latter part is the sticky one - Congress CAN move very quickly to impeach and remove someone from office.  That is the remedy prescribed in the Constitution, the fact that neither party today is likely to impeach "their guy" for anything is a different matter.   But the POTUS should not have to deal with the distraction of lawsuits while carrying out the duties of the office.  And if you honestly and objectively think about it, that's probably a pretty good idea.

posted by ptown_trojans_1

Then, you are obviously not voting for Trump then, because Trump is the one arguing he can do whatever he wants with little to no oversight. 

His lawyers and him have been making that argument on the trail and in these court cases. 

Unless, this is another example where people on here just disregard everything that Trump says....

There you go again trying to act like you’re “center” when in reality you’re about as liberal as most major city people along the coasts.

80% of this board is libertarian and hate Trump yet you act like everyone just gives Trump a pass.

We all want about every single R candidate over Trump, yet you believe we are all “MAGA!”.

Other than 1 or 2 weirdos like Quaker almost no one on this board is a fan of Trump.

But because we aren’t as far left as you that OBVIOUSLY means we are MAGA!

The ONLY person I would vote for Trump over is Biden. I would vote RFK jr, all R candidates, Tulsi Gabbard if she ran, etc all over Trump.

I just refuse to give my vote for dementia  

posted by ptown_trojans_1

Then, you are obviously not voting for Trump then, because Trump is the one arguing he can do whatever he wants with little to no oversight. 

His lawyers and him have been making that argument on the trail and in these court cases. 

Unless, this is another example where people on here just disregard everything that Trump says....

I'm not voting for Trump lol! In seriousness, I will write in Spike Cohen,.

I'm not a Trumpster, but I fully understand why he appeals to people. I don't think he is racist, misogynist or any of the hashtags that lefties like to label him with. I think he's a asshole. But then again, he's not my friend so why would I care?

I'm also not going to vote for Biden. You know, that guy who doesn't want schools to be racial jungles, thinks that there are some clean and smart black people and huffs little girls like they're orange kittens. Only the shitlibs will vote for that.

By the way, who was the last Republican presidential candidate that you voted for?

posted by gut

I think over half the board votes Libertarian, but you continue to cast that same aspersion that everyone here is MAGA.

As for Trump, he's going to make whatever legal arguments he can to get the case dismissed or acquitted, so I don't get my knickers all in a bunch over that.

The POTUS probably should have near immunity while in office.  The DOJ and courts have always avoided weighing in on that subject for what should be obvious reasons, so congrats Dems.

And, no, I'm not arguing Trump had immunity with the election interference stuff.  Seems clear that was related to actions as a candidate and not official duties, which means he can and should face criminal action when out of office.  That latter part is the sticky one - Congress CAN move very quickly to impeach and remove someone from office.  That is the remedy prescribed in the Constitution, the fact that neither party today is likely to impeach "their guy" for anything is a different matter.   But the POTUS should not have to deal with the distraction of lawsuits while carrying out the duties of the office.  And if you honestly and objectively think about it, that's probably a pretty good idea.

I think the only team players here are QO for Republicans and Gblock and Ptown for Democrats. Some of us are definitely wishy-washy with it and some of us don't want anything to do with the duopoly. 

I think in general, this board gives Trump a pass saying oh he isn't that bad and is just like Biden when in reality Trump is saying and doing things that would be a lot worse than anything Biden is doing now.

The last Presidential Republican I voted for? 2004 Bush. 

But, I have voted for Larry Hogan twice when I lived in Maryland and voted for Republicans in Congressional and Senate races over the years too. 

posted by ptown_trojans_1

I think in general, this board gives Trump a pass saying oh he isn't that bad and is just like Biden when in reality Trump is saying and doing things that would be a lot worse than anything Biden is doing now.

LOL, literally no one here except QO does that.  It's just your "moderate" view that if people aren't irrationally alarmed over how Trump is going to destroy Democracy and start WWIII, that means they defend/excuse him.  Mocking people clearly deluded by TDS isn't the same as defending the guy.

Also, the Biden influence peddling scheme is indeed very, very bad.  Potentially compromising even if they just sold the illusion of influence.  At the end of the day, Biden's family has made a shit ton of money off the "brand", and he was clearly complicit even if he didn't benefit directly.

posted by ptown_trojans_1

I think in general, this board gives Trump a pass saying oh he isn't that bad and is just like Biden when in reality Trump is saying and doing things that would be a lot worse than anything Biden is doing now.

The last Presidential Republican I voted for? 2004 Bush. 

But, I have voted for Larry Hogan twice when I lived in Maryland and voted for Republicans in Congressional and Senate races over the years too. 

No one really cares anymore what politicians say; all that matters is what they do.  Maybe you can help us out, but I don't think there is one thing that Trump would do that is anywhere close to the damage biden has inflicted.  Name a few, or just one.

posted by QuakerOats

 but I don't think there is one thing that Trump would do that is anywhere close to the damage biden has inflicted. 

Well, aside from the election fraud and bogus claims that have millions of people questioning election integrity....

Unless, I supposed, you actually believe Biden and the Dems stole the election, despite the absence of evidence.

posted by ptown_trojans_1

I think in general, this board gives Trump a pass saying oh he isn't that bad and is just like Biden when in reality Trump is saying and doing things that would be a lot worse than anything Biden is doing now.

The last Presidential Republican I voted for? 2004 Bush. 

But, I have voted for Larry Hogan twice when I lived in Maryland and voted for Republicans in Congressional and Senate races over the years too. 

Your first paragraph proves all of us correct. You are no where near “middle of the road”.

If you don’t believe the Biden family selling access and influence is clearly on the same level as Trump “ruining democracy” then you can not be helped.

posted by QuakerOats

No one really cares anymore what politicians say; all that matters is what they do.  Maybe you can help us out, but I don't think there is one thing that Trump would do that is anywhere close to the damage biden has inflicted.  Name a few, or just one.

Created the entire mess of election doubting that permeates almost all republican philosophy.  I think this has permanently weakened our country and amplified the political divide exponentially.  The fact that no one trusts anyone or anything is in large part due to his conspiracy BS.

Biden’s a chump, don’t get me wrong.  But Trump has done plenty of harm by putting his ego ahead of the good of our nation.

posted by Dr Winston O'Boogie

Created the entire mess of election doubting that permeates almost all republican philosophy.  I think this has permanently weakened our country and amplified the political divide exponentially.  The fact that no one trusts anyone or anything is in large part due to his conspiracy BS..

To be fair, the Dems and their media began a full court press on obstructing and removing him from office the day after he was elected.  They also, along with Hillary, claimed he stole the election colluding with Russia...The only real difference is they stopped short of committing fraud and attempting to stop the certification.

So if I'm assigning blame for the current state of affairs, it's like 60% Trump and 40% Democrats.

I mean, almost much every election the Dems have lost, going back to Gore, involves denials and claims of voter suppression, disenfranchisement and gerrymandering.  But, sure, Trump is the sole reason we are where we are today.