Seeker, Mr. Nelson was present at state tournament. He wasnt drinking but he did ask someone to go get a drink and he was turned down. How come he does not admit to that. He conviently left that out. The Tuslaw coach was at the arena and WAS NOT DRINKING.....Mr Nelson knows that he was not drinking. As for the fans and parents that were drinking that is their right they were not on the coaching staff. Whether it was right or not, the fact is it is their right to drink. Tuslaw schools are not responsible for the fans or parents. They are responsbile for the children and staff. To say that the coach and/or coaching staff was drinking and children were put in danger is wrong. If the children were in danger as he "claims" then why didnt he take his children and leave....why wait until now to start saying things. He fabricated the truth because he was told something he did not like. He transferred his children illegally, got caught and needed the heat off of them. He basically did not get his way. I understand he wants to be involved. I agree with that, but to want things his way and to start fabricating the truth and slandering people when he does not get his way is another story. It is little things that he just leaves out to make himself look good and everyone else look bad. Seriously....there is always two sides to every story and just because his boys are not eligible this year does not mean that everyone in Tuslaw is bad and that coaches are bad and the list goes on. He got caught and wants to blame everyone else but himself. I truly do not think that this is a consipriacy and people are out to get him.....he chose to lie on the affidavant. He could have done the right thing. There are consequences when rules are broken.

Vikingnurse;669801 wrote:Seeker, Mr. Nelson was present at state tournament. Mr. Nelson was also drinking at state tournament, not at the state tournament, but afterwards. How come he does not admit to that. He conviently left that out. The Tuslaw coach was at the arena and WAS NOT DRINKING.....Mr Nelson knows that he was not drinking. As for the fans and parents that were drinking that is their right they were not on the coaching staff. Whether it was right or not, the fact is it is their right to drink. Tuslaw schools are not responsible for the fans or parents. They are responsbile for the children and staff. To say that the coach and/or coaching staff was drinking children were put in danger is wrong. If the children were in danger as he "claims" then why didnt he take his chidlren and leave....why wait until now to start saying things. He fabricated the truth because he was told something he did not like. He transferred his children illegally, got caught and needed the heat off of them. He basically did not get his way. I understand he wants to be involved. I agree with that, but to want things his way and to start fabricating the truth and slandering people when he does not get his way is another story. It is little things that he just leaves out to make himself look good and everyone else look bad. Seriously....there is always two sides to every story and just because his boys are not eligible this year does not mean that everyone in Tuslaw is bad and that coaches are bad and the list goes on. He got caught and wants to blame everyone else but himself. I truly do not think that this is a consipriacy and people are out to get him.....he chose to lie on the affidavant. He could have done the right thing. There are consequences when rules are broken.

Thanks for clearing that up, you are right, there were NO coaches drunk at the State tourney. Only one father had been drinking.

Matburn;669797 wrote:I am still curious as to what needs to change so these kids CAN wrestle next year. If nothing changes, won't the OHSAA continue to rule them ineligable? Please, as a wrestling fan, I really want to see them back on the Mat ASAP

That"s something to think about. If circumstances don't change between now the end of the ineligabity could Ohsaa continue the ineligabilty? Dean, if you enrolled the twins into Waynedale through open enrolement now, would this year count as the year that they couldn't wrestle making them eligable next year. I, too, want to see them wrestle next year.

Not wrestling but eligibility none the less ......per the Plain Dealer Tuesday morning

" Two players on Beachwood's girls basketball team have been ruled ineligible for one year for falsifying information in their transfer documents, the OHSAA said.
The players were not identified, will not be eligible until Jan. 31, 2012 aid OHSAA Assistant Commissioner Roxanne Price. " By the information we received from Beachwood, we have determined the two students-athletes did not meet any of the transfer exceptions" Price said in an e-mail.
Beachwood, 14-3 and ranked 21st by The Plain Dealer, had voluntarily withheld the students from participation since Jan 28 when questions arose.
The team does not have to forfeit any games due to Bylaw 10 exception pertaining to cases where an individual's eligibility was established by falsified information.
Beachwood coach Melvin Burke, in his first season with the Bison following stints at Lutheran East and Cleveland Central Catholic, would not comment.
It's not known if the students plan to appeal the decision before the OHSAA's Board of Control. they need to decide soon because the next meeting is Feb.17. The playoffs begin Feb. 19.
"It's now up to the parents of the students to decide if they're going to appeal or not," said Doug Levin, the director of marketing and development for the Beachwood City School District

Matburn;669797 wrote:I am still curious as to what needs to change so these kids CAN wrestle next year. If nothing changes, won't the OHSAA continue to rule them ineligable? Please, as a wrestling fan, I really want to see them back on the Mat ASAP

In 28 pages of postings, I've been overloaded with too much information about too many things not related to the eligibility standards of the OHSAA regarding transfers. What I have not seen here or for that matter anywhere (not even in the press) were the following two factual items;

1. What items from the affidavit or rules were allegedly violated (paragraph, item et al), and I do mean allegedly because I give full benefit of the doubt to both parties. I've seen posts alluding to incorrect transfer of driver's license and all but can not draw a firm conclusion that those items are the reason behind the OHSAA's ruling (albeit correct or incorrect) because I have yet to see what the stated cause for the ruling is.

2. The response from the defending party (Mr. Nelson) disputing the OHSAA's ruling and his counter argument as to why they got it incorrect. I understand the eligibility was granted and revoked, I understand Mr. Nelson believes he and his son's have been unjustly and unfairly treated in this matter. I still do not know why the decision was reversed, on what grounds or rules violations.

Somewhere, someone has these factual items but I have yet to see them disclosed (They may have been and I am unaware of the source). Everything else on this forum is noise that surrounds this specific case but doesn't really impact the eligibility issue either way. It is hard to see the forest in this case through all of the trees. If the specific violations were posted and an appeal was lost, then to regain eligibility the violations would have to be corrected is what my uneducated guess would be.

As a wrestling parent and fan, I am sorry to see that these boys are sidelined.

Everything aside... (tuslaw problems/ who was drinking/driving) I want to know what was falsified and how this was determined. That is the real issue. Supposedly there is a transcript of the meeting where ms. moore said it had to do with the marriage issue s which mr.nelson said was original problem. Then in daily record ohsaa said that was not it. Them during this meeting ms. moore said it was indeed this issue ans she would have never made that call if she knew that there was no seperation....yet the boys are still ineligible.... Why can't we get a straight answer from ohssa? If that was the inital reason for ineligibility and she admits this was a mistake that was transcripted...why not reversed? Am I the only one concerned with this ruling based upon that or for all we know a lack of a credible source? All the reasons for the move don't matter... It is was everything done as asked by ohsaa? Why the inital ineligible ruling? Was the evidence against the nelsons credible? Most importantly Why are the nelsons and their new school are being left in the dark?

FallOffCradle;669998 wrote:In 28 pages of postings, I've been overloaded with too much information about too many things not related to the eligibility standards of the OHSAA regarding transfers. What I have not seen here or for that matter anywhere (not even in the press) were the following two factual items;

1. What items from the affidavit or rules were allegedly violated (paragraph, item et al), and I do mean allegedly because I give full benefit of the doubt to both parties. I've seen posts alluding to incorrect transfer of driver's license and all but can not draw a firm conclusion that those items are the reason behind the OHSAA's ruling (albeit correct or incorrect) because I have yet to see what the stated cause for the ruling is.

2. The response from the defending party (Mr. Nelson) disputing the OHSAA's ruling and his counter argument as to why they got it incorrect. I understand the eligibility was granted and revoked, I understand Mr. Nelson believes he and his son's have been unjustly and unfairly treated in this matter. I still do not know why the decision was reversed, on what grounds or rules violations.

Somewhere, someone has these factual items but I have yet to see them disclosed (They may have been and I am unaware of the source). Everything else on this forum is noise that surrounds this specific case but doesn't really impact the eligibility issue either way. It is hard to see the forest in this case through all of the trees. If the specific violations were posted and an appeal was lost, then to regain eligibility the violations would have to be corrected is what my uneducated guess would be.

As a wrestling parent and fan, I am sorry to see that these boys are sidelined.

We posted at the same time. Thank you! I'm glad someone else feels the same. The way ohsaa is handling this is crazy and very disappointing... How many other cases have been handled this way?

Falloffcradle, here is a peice of the daily record article, that includes the reasons for the twins to be ruled ineligible. The original charges are: falsifying information on affadavits that allowed the twins to transfer, and not have to sit out a year. Apparently there are exceptions (listed on the OHSAA website) that allow transfer student/athletes to not have to sit out a year.....

"There's more to Waynedale sophomore wrestlers Zack and Zane Nelson being ruled ineligible than mistakenly filling out a small section of paperwork incorrectly, a spokesperson for the Ohio High School Athletic Association said Monday.

OHSAA director of information services Tim Stried disputed an assertion made by Waynedale athletic director Erich Riebe and the boys' father, Dean Nelson, that the boys may have been ruled ineligible because a question was misinterpreted about parental custody.

"The affidavit submitted by Mr. Nelson was not just filled out incorrectly, as they claim," Stried stated in an email to The Daily Record Monday. "There were several pieces of information on the affidavit that were falsified with the intent to create eligibility at Waynedale for Zack and Zane."

Many people at Waynedale questioned why the OHSAA would send a letter stating that the Nelsons were eligible to wrestle there after moving from Tuslaw, but then change its mind.

Stried said that once a packet of information was delivered to the OHSAA that proved several parts of the affidavit were falsified, the state's governing body for athletics decided to rule the Nelsons ineligible.

"If the OHSAA had been aware of the falsification on the affidavit when the affidavit was initially submitted, eligibility would not have been granted," Stried said. "Zack and Zane will be eligible to compete for Waynedale next January.

Jmar25;670031 wrote:We posted at the same time. Thank you! I'm glad someone else feels the same. The way ohsaa is handling this is crazy and very disappointing... How many other cases have been handled this way?

You are only getting one side of the story..... please keep that in mind when you are forming your opinions.

FallOffCradle;669998 wrote:In 28 pages of postings, I've been overloaded with too much information about too many things not related to the eligibility standards of the OHSAA regarding transfers. What I have not seen here or for that matter anywhere (not even in the press) were the following two factual items;

1. What items from the affidavit or rules were allegedly violated (paragraph, item et al), and I do mean allegedly because I give full benefit of the doubt to both parties. I've seen posts alluding to incorrect transfer of driver's license and all but can not draw a firm conclusion that those items are the reason behind the OHSAA's ruling (albeit correct or incorrect) because I have yet to see what the stated cause for the ruling is.

2. The response from the defending party (Mr. Nelson) disputing the OHSAA's ruling and his counter argument as to why they got it incorrect. I understand the eligibility was granted and revoked, I understand Mr. Nelson believes he and his son's have been unjustly and unfairly treated in this matter. I still do not know why the decision was reversed, on what grounds or rules violations.

Somewhere, someone has these factual items but I have yet to see them disclosed (They may have been and I am unaware of the source). Everything else on this forum is noise that surrounds this specific case but doesn't really impact the eligibility issue either way. It is hard to see the forest in this case through all of the trees. If the specific violations were posted and an appeal was lost, then to regain eligibility the violations would have to be corrected is what my uneducated guess would be.

As a wrestling parent and fan, I am sorry to see that these boys are sidelined.

We have received nothing verbally or in writing as to why the OHSAA has ruled the twins Ineligible. You know as much as us.

Here is my statement and only statement today.

We are now on equal ground with the OHSAA for the first time.
We are very optimistic about the outcome because of that.
I'am excited and so is my entire family with the rout we have selected.
We are in very good hands.

My deepest apologies to all the educated and truly concerned Citizens that want to improve things and have had to listen to me when I have responded to the hecklers and unidentified rock throwers. That was wrong of me and I should not have thrown any of the rocks back. No excuses..I should have not even have recognized them. It is a huge character flaw in me to fight with bullies and not walk away from a fight. It is very immature of me ..Please except my sincere apologies from a over passionate and over protective at times father.. My greatest asset has always been my passion but is also at times is my greatest weakness.

Any details from here on out will be available as a public record. I will blog occasionally with my attorney's approval and supply updates on statuses and dates but no inside information on our case. Maybe a quick daily blog on constructive Idea's to make things better for future families. I will not address obvious pot stirrers or rock throwers...so throw those rocks, your going to any way.

For you constructive people that want the best for your kids and your school ...Email me [email protected]. Facebook me, if you identify yourself and you are cool I will except you as a friend. The T-shirts are already gone but more are on the way. The twins deeply appreciate the ground swell of support they have received and are already seeing the up sides to this unfair and challenging time in their young life. They may have seen the darkest of characters in this story but they have also seen the best of people, values and outpouring of love and goodness. Thank you Ohio chatter. Thank you Waynedale, the Super, the Principle, the AD and most The head coach, and a giant thanks to the Waynedale fans and community!!! You have never wavered or doubted even a little! Big hug and thanks, Dean Nelson.

Daisy1519;670051 wrote:You are only getting one side of the story..... please keep that in mind when you are forming your opinions.

Regardless of whether Mr. Nelson did falsify the information it would be nice to know what was allegedly falsified. The OHSAA could handle this a lot better.

In my opinion that is the most sensible post thus far Mr. Nelson.

Good luck to you and you sons.

From what I have read, it seems like it went something like this:
An application was filed by falcon81, previously of Tuslaw, to wrestle at Waynedale due to a residency change.
OHSAA reviewed the application and granted the transfer of eligibility from Tuslaw to Waynedale.
Falcon81's sons were wrestling the 2010-2011 season for their new school Waynedale.
OHSAA was given reason by members of the wrestling communitee, to review the original application for aleged inaccuracies.
OHSAA's review of the evidence found inaccuracies in the application for transfer of eligibility, and reversed the original ruling and imposed a penalty.
A protest to the ineligability and penalty was filed by Mr Nelson, and an expedited hearing date was set.
A protest hearing was granted by OHSAA and the ruling of ineligable, as well as the penalty, were confirmed as a result of the protest hearing.

I doubt OHSAA can or would provide any of the details of what was wrong with the application. I'm guessing that it would be considered confidential.

falcon81;670056 wrote:We are now on equal ground with the OHSAA for the first time. * * * Any details from here on out will be available as a public record. ***.

I take it you filed a complaint. If so, in what Court? Thanks.

I Wear Pants;670062 wrote:Regardless of whether Mr. Nelson did falsify the information it would be nice to know what was allegedly falsified. The OHSAA could handle this a lot better.

I don't think that's really any of our business and I can understand why the OHSAA hasn't shared that information. This case is between the OHSAA and the Nelson boys.

Daisy1519;670089 wrote:* * * This case is between the OHSAA and the Nelson boys.

I'd suggest the case [issue] is [or should] actually between OHSAA and its member; namely, the school district in which the Nelson boys are located, with the Nelson boys being caught in between. That is, it is the member school district which would have first agreed to comply with [enforce if necessary] OSHAA rules and regulations. From what appears in the posts, at least, "* * * Waynedale, the Super, the Principle (sic), the AD and most The head coach" appear to have been placed on the side in favor of the Nelsons. Earlier posts, if true, also appear to support this position. Regardless of the items alleged to be falsified by the parents, the check and balance is the member school's duty to investigate and monitor the tranfer to be certain it comports with the OSHAA transfer/eligibility requirements. I assume the school district undertook those obligations and were satisfied that the transfer/eligibility requirements were met, sans the parents' statements alone.

OSHAA’s Affidavit For Bona Fide Legal Change Of Residence provides: “In addition to the duties imposed upon the parents as heretofore described, school administrators have a duty to investigate and continually monitor all alleged bona fide residential changes. Schools should maintain files on all transfer students who claim to have made a bona fide change in residence which files should include the documentation that supports each of the claims set forth in the Affidavit. Additionally, the school should visit the new residence on some type of regular basis to verify some of the other affirmations that cannot be verified through documentation. These visits should be planned so as to yield meaningful and accurate results (i.e. to confirm that the majority of meals are eaten at the new residence, one should not send the truancy officer to the home at 10:00 in the morning when no one is home much less eating). A log identifying the times, dates, persons making the visits and findings from the visits should also be maintained in the student’s file”.

Has any sanction been imposed upon the member school district?

PAIronman;670156 wrote:I'd suggest the case [issue] is [or should] actually between OHSAA and its member; namely, the school district in which the Nelson boys are located, with the Nelson boys being caught in between. That is, it is the member school district which would have first agreed to comply with [enforce if necessary] OSHAA rules and regulations. From what appears in the posts, at least, "* * * Waynedale, the Super, the Principle (sic), the AD and most The head coach" appear to have been placed on the side in favor of the Nelsons. Earlier posts, if true, also appear to support this position. Regardless of the items alleged to be falsified by the parents, the check and balance is the member school's duty to investigate and monitor the tranfer to be certain it comports with the OSHAA transfer/eligibility requirements. I assume the school district undertook those obligations and were satisfied that the transfer/eligibility requirements were met, sans the parents' statements alone.

OSHAA’s Affidavit For Bona Fide Legal Change Of Residence provides: “In addition to the duties imposed upon the parents as heretofore described, school administrators have a duty to investigate and continually monitor all alleged bona fide residential changes. Schools should maintain files on all transfer students who claim to have made a bona fide change in residence which files should include the documentation that supports each of the claims set forth in the Affidavit. Additionally, the school should visit the new residence on some type of regular basis to verify some of the other affirmations that cannot be verified through documentation. These visits should be planned so as to yield meaningful and accurate results (i.e. to confirm that the majority of meals are eaten at the new residence, one should not send the truancy officer to the home at 10:00 in the morning when no one is home much less eating). A log identifying the times, dates, persons making the visits and findings from the visits should also be maintained in the student’s file”.

Has any sanction been imposed upon the member school district?

I believe Mr. Nelson said that these said bed checks, visits,, etc. were sworn affadavits from the Norwayne AD and superintendent that were presented last friday at the hearing. Must not have been what the OHSAA wanted because they upheld their ruling.

Daisy1519;670051 wrote:You are only getting one side of the story..... please keep that in mind when you are forming your opinions.

I know this. I'm smart enough to realize that. The comment had nothing to do with the story. It had to do with the fact that the boys nor school district know the exact reasoning. according to the info from the daily record along with what mr.nelson have said is that a decision was based off of an anonymous packet... Why? Also privacy may be an issue with us but parties involved have the right to know and they currently do not.. That is wrong plain and simple. if these were any of our kids and we were in the dark I'd think we would be going crazy. if this is how ohssa handles situations of this nature... I want a change.

Daisy1519;670166 wrote:I believe Mr. Nelson said that these said bed checks, visits,, etc. were sworn affadavits from the Norwayne AD and superintendent that were presented last friday at the hearing. Must not have been what the OHSAA wanted because they upheld their ruling.

Right - my point. Where's the OSHAA member's [the school district's] culpability? They had an equal duty "to verify some of the other affirmations that cannot be verified through documentation" among other things. If this was simply a "documentation" matter, it would be kind of hard for OSHAA not to have accurately determined that upfront. OSHAA's initial passing on non-documented items may leave some room for error; to be verified/monitored by the exercise of the duties to be performed by the member school district. I do not think anyone is suggesting that the member school district did not perform its duties in good faith. However, the use of "falsify" in relation to the parents affirmations certainly does. Simply, the member district could not be very efficient in their duties if OSHAA clearly disagreed with the member district, reversed itself and imposed the current sanctions. So, not really much of a question of "[m]ust not have been what the OHSAA wanted...." Instead, the member simply could not have adequately done what was required.

The Waynedale AD has a documented file on the home visits to The Nelson family. Apparently they were in compliance with ALL random visits AND "bed checks". Also there are students, who are not wrestlers that ride to school daily with the twins.

State approved...then revoked. The reasons for ineligibility have not been stated and OHSAA will not release a comment to the Press.

PAIronman;670188 wrote:Right - my point. Where's the OSHAA member's [the school district's] culpability? They had an equal duty "to verify some of the other affirmations that cannot be verified through documentation" among other things. If this was simply a "documentation" matter, it would be kind of hard for OSHAA not to have accurately determined that upfront. OSHAA's initial passing on non-documented items may leave some room for error; to be verified/monitored by the exercise of the duties to be performed by the member school district. I do not think anyone is suggesting that the member school district did not perform its duties in good faith. However, the use of "falsify" in relation to the parents affirmations certainly does. Simply, the member district could not be very efficient in their duties if OSHAA clearly disagreed with the member district, reversed itself and imposed the current sanctions. So, not really much of a question of "[m]ust not have been what the OHSAA wanted...." Instead, the member simply could not have adequately done what was required.

Huh? What are non documented items?

Jmar25;670177 wrote:I know this. I'm smart enough to realize that. The comment had nothing to do with the story. It had to do with the fact that the boys nor school district know the exact reasoning. according to the info from the daily record along with what mr.nelson have said is that a decision was based off of an anonymous packet... Why? Also privacy may be an issue with us but parties involved have the right to know and they currently do not.. That is wrong plain and simple. if these were any of our kids and we were in the dark I'd think we would be going crazy. if this is how ohssa handles situations of this nature... I want a change.

Jmar25, I was not intending to insult your intelligence. ;o( It is my understanding that the original reason (falsifying information on the transfer affadvits) is still the reason why the twins are ineligible. Last Friday was the appeal hearing, and based on the shared information(both for and against the twins) and questions from the board to the twins/parents, the board decided to uphold their original decision to rule the twins ineligible. No one knows what was in the packet.

Way too personal, attack edited!

Daisy1519;670221 wrote:Huh? What are non documented items?

Precisely Daisy1519! I can only conclude that it is parental statements made in the Affidavit For Bona Fide Legal Change Of Residence, under which OSHAA imposes the duty upon its member school distrcit to monitor/verify "some of the other affirmations that cannot be verified through documentation" (non documented items - perhaps). You responded to I Wear Pants' statement that it "would be nice to know what was allegedly falsified" with "I don't think that's really any of our business". I suggested that certainly this cannot be a simple "documentation" matter (one in which documents were falsified) because I would expect OSHAA to more readily determine the veracity of documentation before they initially determined eligibility existed. Instead, I can only assume that at issue in the non-eligibility determination are non-documented items ("other affirmations that cannot be verified through documentation") which the school district member was required to do certain things to monitor and verify. It apparently did to its satisfaction (see your reference to the school district's affidavits/my reference to Falcon81's praise of the district representatives) find in support of the transfer eligibility and "other affirmations that cannot be verified through documentation". Since OSHAA reversed its original eligiblity determination based upon "false matters" so we are told, it not only disbelieves the parents statements it must also disbelieve its member. Members are sanctionable for failure to do its part in the process. I am wondering if there were any school district sanctions for failing to appropriately monitor or verify issues for eligibility since OSHAA found ineligibility, and while perhaps none of my business, I like I Wear Pants, am curious as to the items that were determined to be false by OSHAA.

Volunteer;670276 wrote:Way too personal, attack edited!

That was more personal than the allegations and threats being made by falcon81???? Guess the facts are not to be posted on here!!