FatHobbit;1754769 wrote:You think gun dealers should make the call if someone should be allowed to buy a gun?

Of course. Isn't that how it works...put the blame on everyone else but the shooter and those closest to the shooter who would know he has mental issues.

FatHobbit;1754679 wrote:I'm not a huge fan of concealed carry, but I would not blame how easy it is to get a gun if a family member was shot.



I fail to see how me wanting to be able to protect myself is related to the president coming to take my guns away.

Serious question. Do you think Obama would make guns illegal if he could?

No he would not dude. He would make getting guns more burdensome like getting licenses, etc. but he wouldn't make all guns illegal. And, you should know this. When people do not agree with you it does not help your cause when you do not consider their real positions.

FatHobbit;1754686 wrote:Maybe less people own guns, but there are more guns in the US and gun violence is still decreasing.

Additionally the people who predicted concealed carry would lead to the wild wild west were very wrong.

Concealed carry license holders commit less crime than people who just go and buy guns. Should treat all gun ownership like concealed carry. This oregon kid and his batshit crazy mom stockpiling guns in their little apartment and going to shooting clubs "where no one would be watching us" maybe wouldn't go through the process of getting licensed, etc.

sleeper;1754712 wrote:Somehow I think cocaine not being available OTC at the grocery store and instead relies on knowing a network of trust worthy law breakers to get your fix is infinitely harder. That's just me and logic though speaking.

No doubt. Take adderall. People love that stuff - even nerdy academic types trying to get performance enhancing drugs in grad school. It is possible but not easy in the slightest.

queencitybuckeye;1754750 wrote:The system that's really broken is the mental health treatment system. We should really stop focusing on symptoms and work on root cause instead.

A generation ago:

Guns: legal to own
Mental heath system: relatively good
Number of mass shooting incidents: small

Today:

Guns: legal to own
Mental health system: horrid
Number of mass shooting incidents: larger

What do you propose? This kid was not clinically mentally ill. Maybe over the counter Lunesta?

Tiernan;1754756 wrote:He was pretty much a psychotic retard and yet he was able to buy guns "legally"...and right there is the rub, some gun-fuck retailer who probably immediately recognized this shitbag was a half wit, preferred the cash to being responsible. And with the mentality that typically permeates that low class industry this will continue to happen over and over and over and over and over...

His mom was a loon stock piling guns in their home because she believed the gubmint was going to take away the guns. She took him shooting at gun clubs where a range master wouldn't be "watching over them."

And so here is the problem. This woman is nuts. Her beliefs are not grounded in empirical reality but she's not clinically insane or having some kind of documented mental illness that would prevent her from buying a gun.

Maybe she is clinically depressed? But gun-rights activists balk at the notion of not allowing people to buy guns if they are depressed and also they argue that this would only discourage people from getting mental health treatment (which is probably true).

BoatShoes;1755162 wrote:His mom was a loon stock piling guns in their home because she believed the gubmint was going to take away the guns. She took him shooting at gun clubs where a range master wouldn't be "watching over them."

And so here is the problem. This woman is nuts. Her beliefs are not grounded in empirical reality but she's not clinically insane or having some kind of documented mental illness that would prevent her from buying a gun.

Maybe she is clinically depressed? But gun-rights activists balk at the notion of not allowing people to buy guns if they are depressed and also they argue that this would only discourage people from getting mental health treatment (which is probably true).

The "problem" is that psycho people are going to kill people, especially more now days because the dumbass media puts their faces all over the tv and puts up the number of people they've killed next to each other like its a fucking scoreboard.

Then people want to start blaming other people or companies or issues instead of putting the blame solely on the psycho. Kind of like you blaming the mother.

BoatShoes;1755156 wrote:No he would not dude. He would make getting guns more burdensome like getting licenses, etc. but he wouldn't make all guns illegal. And, you should know this. When people do not agree with you it does not help your cause when you do not consider their real positions.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/news/wonkblog/wp/2015/06/23/what-happened-after-australia-banned-lots-of-guns-after-a-massacre/

In an interview with comedian Marc Maron that aired Monday, President Obama cited Australia's gun laws as an example the United States should follow.
...

But one of Howard's other lasting legacies is Australia's gun control regime. The law banned semi-automatic and automatic rifles and shotguns.

Sounds like Obama wants to ban guns to me. And if he doesn't include hand guns it will have 0 effect. So the next time something happens they will go after hand guns.

On the surface I'm ok with background checks and making sure lunatics can't buy weapons. But I don't trust the anti gunners. They say they want reasonable gun control and if it saves one life, isn't it worth it. But Australia has a gun ban and they had a 50% reduction in gun violence. So they still have gun violence. (albeit much, much less than we do) And every time there is more gun violence I am convinced they will chip, chip, chip away at our 2nd amendment rights until they are gone. You can say they don't want to ban all guns, and probably you don't want to, but I will never be convinced that the people in leadership of the anti-gun movement aren't doing everything they can to get rid of everyone else's guns. (Obviously their security will still carry guns because guns make THEM safer.)

If that makes me sound like a nut, then so be it.

SportsAndLady;1755165 wrote:The "problem" is that psycho people are going to kill people, especially more now days because the dumbass media puts their faces all over the tv and puts up the number of people they've killed next to each other like its a fucking scoreboard.

Then people want to start blaming other people or companies or issues instead of putting the blame solely on the psycho. Kind of like you blaming the mother.

Just read the fucking 4chan thread. Those sick fucks were talking about his fucking "kill score."

like_that;1755191 wrote:Just read the fucking 4chan thread. Those sick fucks were talking about his fucking "kill score."

Yeah those guys are pathetic.

CNN is also pathetic:

[video=youtube;x5U_XD4kDJ4][/video]

SportsAndLady;1755165 wrote:The "problem" is that psycho people are going to kill people, especially more now days because the dumbass media puts their faces all over the tv and puts up the number of people they've killed next to each other like its a fucking scoreboard.

Then people want to start blaming other people or companies or issues instead of putting the blame solely on the psycho. Kind of like you blaming the mother.

The psycho people kill way more people in Merica. It is simply a fact. Whether it is the cost of freedom that we should accept is a matter of opinion.

Psychos do not exist in vaccuums.

P.S. I am guessing you do not see the irony that you did not solely blamed the victim but the media for putting his kill count on tv like a scoreboard.

BoatShoes;1755195 wrote:The psycho people kill way more people in Merica. It is simply a fact. Whether it is the cost of freedom that we should accept is a matter of opinion.

Psychos do not exist in vaccuums.

P.S. I am guessing you do not see the irony that you did not solely blamed the victim but the media for putting his kill count on tv like a scoreboard.

Uhhh, no. Lol.

I said these guys are psychos and they go out and kill people for the "glory" they'll receive from the media. Among other things, but I'm not blaming their parents or their teachers or their upbringings.

I blame the fuck out of his worthless parents....these type people know damn well they are harboring a potential mass shooter and don't do a thing because it might be "embarrassing". Take everything they have for victim funds and if they don't have shit they go to jail for being idiots.

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/10/05/us/4-students-arrested-in-northern-california-suspected-of-plotting-killings-in-high-school.html?_r=0

Four high school students in California arrested for plotting an attack.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/news/morning-mix/wp/2015/10/05/philadelphia-colleges-on-alert-after-4chan-post-threatens-violence-monday/

Philadelphia schools and universities to be on the look out this week thanks to a 4chan tip. I would be nervous as shit to be a student right now. I don't even like going to the movies anymore.

Heretic;1754767 wrote:You know, if there was one thing I'd like to see statistical evidence of to see if there's any correlation to anything, it would be the time period when it suddenly became "in" to overly medicate the fuck out anyone who seems abnormal in any way. When I was growing up, I don't recall knowing anyone living off Zoloft or Paxil or whatever, but now it seems a shit-ton of people seem to need that stuff to act "normal" -- probably because that's what they were told at some point in their youth. I've never been a fan of Big Pharm to begin with, so it makes me wonder if all their pills designed to alter a person's chemical balance might be contributing to these mentally-ill types going all kill-crazy.

The Big Pharms are to blame for the heroin problem in America right now but that is a different topic....

friendfromlowry;1755415 wrote:http://www.nytimes.com/2015/10/05/us/4-students-arrested-in-northern-california-suspected-of-plotting-killings-in-high-school.html?_r=0

Four high school students in California arrested for plotting an attack.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/news/morning-mix/wp/2015/10/05/philadelphia-colleges-on-alert-after-4chan-post-threatens-violence-monday/

Philadelphia schools and universities to be on the look out this week thanks to a 4chan tip. I would be nervous as shit to be a student right now. I don't even like going to the movies anymore.

maybe you should get a CCW to protect yourself and others, stop looking for others to do for you what you can do for yourself.

BoatShoes;1755162 wrote:...

And so here is the problem. This woman is nuts. Her beliefs are not grounded in empirical reality but she's not clinically insane or having some kind of documented mental illness that would prevent her from buying a gun.

...

For the last 50 or 60 years our US society has laid an all-out assault on absolutes (be "what is normal", absolute right and wrong, absolute truth, "what is 'reality'") and now you are going to come in on the back side of this tragedy and state the above?

You can't have it both ways.

Concerning the bolded portion - in the past, when an individual would make that claim concerning any other area of life some quack would get on TV or radio, or as a hired college professor and question who has any right to impose your version of reality on someone else.

Belly35;1755417 wrote:maybe you should get a CCW to protect yourself and others, stop looking for others to do for you what you can do for yourself.

Because CCW holders are constantly preventing mass shootings right?

Heretic;1754767 wrote:You know, if there was one thing I'd like to see statistical evidence of to see if there's any correlation to anything, it would be the time period when it suddenly became "in" to overly medicate the fuck out anyone who seems abnormal in any way. When I was growing up, I don't recall knowing anyone living off Zoloft or Paxil or whatever, but now it seems a shit-ton of people seem to need that stuff to act "normal" -- probably because that's what they were told at some point in their youth. I've never been a fan of Big Pharm to begin with, so it makes me wonder if all their pills designed to alter a person's chemical balance might be contributing to these mentally-ill types going all kill-crazy.

Cannot disagree; although the last sentence is a stretch.

Because CCW holders are constantly preventing mass shootings right?

Well, no. That's not what he's saying at all. It's about the CCW carrier protecting HIMSELF. You don't have a responsibility to inject yourself into a dangerous situation just because you carry.

We have... and we will continue to focus on the wrong thing concerning these mass shootings, which not uncoincidentally, have increased dramatically the past few years. We all have bought into the narrative that it is all about guns, and we focus on guns and argue about guns as we wring our hands as to what to do.
In reality, the problem is hate, intolerance and marginalization brought on by the politics of division that is either deliberately (for political capital)...or cluelessly promulgated by our nation's leaders on both sides of the aisle. It was notable that in BHO's immediate (within 15 minutes and without all the facts) response/speech to the shooting, he dramatically wrung his hands and stated he would "politicize" it (exactly what we don't need)....and he failed to realize his own complicity.

The politics of division has come home to roost.

Heretic;1754767 wrote:You know, if there was one thing I'd like to see statistical evidence of to see if there's any correlation to anything, it would be the time period when it suddenly became "in" to overly medicate the fuck out anyone who seems abnormal in any way. When I was growing up, I don't recall knowing anyone living off Zoloft or Paxil or whatever, but now it seems a shit-ton of people seem to need that stuff to act "normal" -- probably because that's what they were told at some point in their youth. I've never been a fan of Big Pharm to begin with, so it makes me wonder if all their pills designed to alter a person's chemical balance might be contributing to these mentally-ill types going all kill-crazy.

I would love to know this as well.

friendfromlowry;1755426 wrote:Because CCW holders are constantly preventing mass shootings right?

If that soldier who was shot seven times would of had a CCW and nor was able to carry a weapon ...would the situation have been different? We don't know but we do know what happen when there was no one armed and prepared.
It only takes one time to save many and be prepared. But you would rather have your head up your ass and kiss your life good bye...

Belly35;1755474 wrote:If that soldier who was shot seven times would of had a CCW and nor was able to carry a weapon ...would the situation have been different? We don't know but we do know what happen when there was no one armed and prepared.
It only takes one time to save many and be prepared. But you would rather have your head up your ass and kiss your life good bye...

You are retarded belly

HitsRus;1755449 wrote:Well, no. That's not what he's saying at all. It's about the CCW carrier protecting HIMSELF. You don't have a responsibility to inject yourself into a dangerous situation just because you carry.

I bolded the confusing parts. Let me know which it is.

Belly35;1755417 wrote:maybe you should get a CCW to protect yourself and others, stop looking for others to do for you what you can do for yourself.

Belly35;1755474 wrote:If that soldier who was shot seven times would of had a CCW and nor was able to carry a weapon ...would the situation have been different? We don't know but we do know what happen when there was no one armed and prepared.
It only takes one time to save many and be prepared. But you would rather have your head up your ass and kiss your life good bye...

IF assault weapons were banned, IF gun laws were more strictly enforced, IF...Let me know when you have a counter-argument that isn't based on hypotheticals. Typical Belly, though. Someone doesn't share his infatuation with owning, shooting, and talking about guns then they have their head up their ass.