Safety or no safety?

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Fab1b's avatar

Fab1b

The Bald A-Hole!!

12,949 posts
Jan 5, 2011 3:12 PM
IMO it should have been called forward progress and down. I mean they pushed him back 3-4 yards before the break in contact and retackle. If this was a pass and it was caught at the 2, forced back into the endzone and tackled no doubt it would have been forward progress at the spot of the catch, think about that!
Jan 5, 2011 3:12pm
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Sonofanump

Jan 5, 2011 3:29 PM
ytownfootball;626988 wrote:Of course it was the wrong call, but that's more justification than is required even for the the most ardent of haters. Haters is over used of course, but there is no other way to describe someone who believes this to be anything other than the WRONG call...stupid.

Thanks for the info.
I think it means the most. It is a national (non biased) group of NCAA officials (educated on the rules).
Now, if Dave Perry or Rogers Reddings or Bill Carollo come out and state somthing different, then I (actually all of us) will listen.
Jan 5, 2011 3:29pm
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Footwedge

Senior Member

9,265 posts
Jan 5, 2011 4:00 PM
Jesus God Almighty!!! This was a horrible call...and anyone who thinks differently is fucking nuts.

The man was hitat the 2, wrapped up at the 2, and for 3 full seconds (replay it) was driven back into the end zone....with absolutely no forward progress....AT ALL.

It was a horrible call, period....and I would say the exact same thing had the Bucks tackled a Razorback the same way.

PS...the false start penalty was horse shit too.
Jan 5, 2011 4:00pm
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Footwedge

Senior Member

9,265 posts
Jan 5, 2011 4:01 PM
Sonofanump;627024 wrote:I think it means the most. It is a national (non biased) group of NCAA officials (educated on the rules).
Now, if Dave Perry or Rogers Reddings or Bill Carollo come out and state somthing different, then I (actually all of us) will listen.

And you cal yourself a ref....shameful.
Jan 5, 2011 4:01pm
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dat dude

Senior Member

1,564 posts
Jan 5, 2011 4:02 PM
bigkahuna;626794 wrote:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WamGj2blI5w
very similar play

He doesn't actually get wrapped up, but he does get forced back by the defender actually doing it.

That's a terrible example. Look at the rule: "where a ball carrier is so held that his forward progress is stopped."

McKnight was knocked back. Herron was being held back.

I honestly can't believe people cannot understand this. Its amazing.
Jan 5, 2011 4:02pm
CinciX12's avatar

CinciX12

Senior Member

2,874 posts
Jan 5, 2011 4:05 PM
Footwedge;627046 wrote:Jesus God Almighty!!! This was a horrible call...and anyone who thinks differently is fucking nuts.

The man was hitat the 2, wrapped up at the 2, and for 3 full seconds (replay it) was driven back into the end zone....with absolutely no forward progress....AT ALL.

It was a horrible call, period....and I would say the exact same thing had the Bucks tackled a Razorback the same way.

PS...the false start penalty was horse shit too.

I've never seen someone go after a false start penalty before. He either moved or he didn't lol. I don't even know the play you are talking about though.
Jan 5, 2011 4:05pm
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Footwedge

Senior Member

9,265 posts
Jan 5, 2011 4:09 PM
Sonofanump;626976 wrote:It's been updated since I left this morning. It is now at 81% believe the safety to incorrect.
Link please.
Jan 5, 2011 4:09pm
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Sonofanump

Jan 5, 2011 4:11 PM
CinciX12;627054 wrote:I've never seen someone go after a false start penalty before. He either moved or he didn't lol. I don't even know the play you are talking about though.

I only remember one false start on the OSU RT. Not sure what the contention there could be.
Jan 5, 2011 4:11pm
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Sonofanump

Jan 5, 2011 4:14 PM
Footwedge;627056 wrote:Link please.

Nope. It's my world and I don't want any of you in it!
Jan 5, 2011 4:14pm
jhay78's avatar

jhay78

Senior Member

1,917 posts
Jan 5, 2011 4:18 PM
CinciX12;627054 wrote:I've never seen someone go after a false start penalty before. He either moved or he didn't lol. I don't even know the play you are talking about though.
Sonofanump;627058 wrote:I only remember one false start on the OSU RT. Not sure what the contention there could be.

Last or next-to-last drive, false start called on Shugarts, who happened to jump while 2 Razorbacks were already across the line of scrimmage.
Jan 5, 2011 4:18pm
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queencitybuckeye

Senior Member

7,117 posts
Jan 5, 2011 4:21 PM
jhay78;627070 wrote:Last or next-to-last drive, false start called on Shugarts, who happened to jump while 2 Razorbacks were already across the line of scrimmage.

Back in the day, defensive players could cross the line and get back without penalty, as long as they made no contact, while those of us on the o-line had to remain stationary, the assumption being that we had a higher IQ than the defensive dummies. :). Is that still the case?
Jan 5, 2011 4:21pm
CinciX12's avatar

CinciX12

Senior Member

2,874 posts
Jan 5, 2011 4:21 PM
jhay78;627070 wrote:Last or next-to-last drive, false start called on Shugarts, who happened to jump while 2 Razorbacks were already across the line of scrimmage.

Oh thats right I remember now. On first glance, I would have to say it is because the Arkansas defensive lineman didn't get close enough to Shugarts for the ref to feel that was the reason he jumped. The Arkansas guy obviously jumped, maybe even 2 of them did early. But I don't think that the jump warranted drawing an offsides call on them.
Jan 5, 2011 4:21pm
royal_k's avatar

royal_k

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4,423 posts
Jan 5, 2011 4:26 PM
I've watched a lot of football, and that was a horrible call. I've never seen a RB pushed back that far and held like that (no forward progress at all) and not have the ball marked where the tackle first started. It's pretty simple...they blew the call. They, the officials, even looked confused in the endzone before signaling the safety.
Jan 5, 2011 4:26pm
Writerbuckeye's avatar

Writerbuckeye

Senior Member

4,745 posts
Jan 5, 2011 5:14 PM
That was a horrid call. I've watched football at all levels for 40 plus years and never seen a player pushed four yards BACK into the endzone and then had a safety called. Under any conditions. Until last night, of course.

Once forward progress is stopped, refs usually (as in 99.9999 percent of the time) blow the whistle and the play is over, with the ball spotted back where progress was INITIALLY stopped, not where the player ended up.

Just a really bad call by an officiating crew that had more than a few problems during the evening.
Jan 5, 2011 5:14pm
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slingshot4ever

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4,085 posts
Jan 5, 2011 7:55 PM
It was a safety.
Jan 5, 2011 7:55pm
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bigkahuna

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4,454 posts
Jan 5, 2011 8:15 PM
sportchampps;626812 wrote:here is an example of how many times forward progress is called

Forward progress was called and that why the runner wasnt considered outta balance
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zpCWRkGniWg

Another:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VNWVKk7J5z0

Another:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=So8y7y2oQ9o

I watch alot of football and thats the only play like that i can remember where they didnt call forward progress

1. Shitty call, he was pushed out of bounce. I'll agree with you on that.

2. Another shitty call. Should have been a fumble. I've seen where a player is being pushed back by 3-4 defenders, and some d-bag comes up and grabs the ball. This was 1 player in the process of stripping the ball.

3. I think this was a mistake on the announcer. They called it a no-fumble because they felt his knee was down.
Jan 5, 2011 8:15pm
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bigkahuna

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4,454 posts
Jan 5, 2011 8:20 PM
Fab1b;626994 wrote:IMO it should have been called forward progress and down. I mean they pushed him back 3-4 yards before the break in contact and retackle. If this was a pass and it was caught at the 2, forced back into the endzone and tackled no doubt it would have been forward progress at the spot of the catch, think about that!

You all keep saying he was knocked back 3,4, or 5 yards. He was hit at the 2-3 yard line, which would mean (by simple math) that he was shoved back 2-3 yards DEEP into the endzone.

I'm with Karen, I've seen where something similar to this happens, and the player gains yardage. If that would have happened in this play we would see a lot of this... "What strength by Herron to break that tackle and fight for extra yards..." or, if this had happened and the whistle was blown quick we'd see "Bull Shit, he wasn't down yet..."

If the 1st tackler hadn't fallen off/been shaken off, we wouldn't be having this discussion.
Jan 5, 2011 8:20pm
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sportchampps

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7,361 posts
Jan 5, 2011 8:26 PM
he was 2 yards deep into the endzone
Jan 5, 2011 8:26pm
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bigkahuna

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4,454 posts
Jan 5, 2011 8:35 PM
That's my point. It's not like he was hit at the 4-5 and pushed back 4-5 yards.
Jan 5, 2011 8:35pm
ytownfootball's avatar

ytownfootball

Bold faced liar...

6,978 posts
Jan 5, 2011 8:40 PM
He was hit at the 2 and pushed 2 deep into the endzone

2+2=4

SMH...Michigan math...:D
Jan 5, 2011 8:40pm
Pick6's avatar

Pick6

A USA American

14,946 posts
Jan 5, 2011 8:45 PM
seriously surprised this thread has gone 5 pages..i dont see whats so hard to understand.
Jan 5, 2011 8:45pm
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bigkahuna

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4,454 posts
Jan 5, 2011 9:12 PM
ytownfootball;627395 wrote:He was hit at the 2 and pushed 2 deep into the endzone

2+2=4

SMH...Michigan math...:D

Really? LOL

Once he's in the endzone, game over. Once, he crossed the goal line, it doesn't matter how many yards he was pushed back. It's not like a level system where yds 1-2=2 points but the back of the endzone=5.
Jan 5, 2011 9:12pm
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Al Bundy

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4,180 posts
Jan 5, 2011 10:00 PM
bigkahuna;627430 wrote:Really? LOL

Once he's in the endzone, game over. Once, he crossed the goal line, it doesn't matter how many yards he was pushed back. It's not like a level system where yds 1-2=2 points but the back of the endzone=5.

It was a blown call. His forward progress was stopped at the 2. I have seen a lot of football in my life, and I have never seen forward progress not given on a play like that. If they always called it like that, you would see teams always driving a player back and letting another defender make the tackle.
Jan 5, 2011 10:00pm
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bigkahuna

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4,454 posts
Jan 5, 2011 10:14 PM
I'll agree that the whistle should have been blown. I don't think that anyone is arguing that.

However, once he "broke" that tackle, forward progress was a gonner.
Jan 5, 2011 10:14pm
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Sonofanump

Jan 5, 2011 10:27 PM
bigkahuna;627518 wrote:I'll agree that the whistle should have been blown. I don't think that anyone is arguing that.

However, once he "broke" that tackle, forward progress was a gonner.

I disagree. The reverse angle shows the linejudge putting his hand in the air on the two yard line. A hand in the air signifies the end of the play. We have an official signaling dead ball standing on the two yard line.
Jan 5, 2011 10:27pm