iced earth;1305247 wrote:There you have it....the first 0 fer in school history...how does a program recover from that? Although I don't beleive it's all the coaching staffs fault, you almost have to start anew to rebound from this don't you? Thoughts?

Define start anew please? Are you talking Coach? Defense? Offense? weight room program? Or all?

Jmar25;1305352 wrote:Define start anew please? Are you talking Coach? Defense? Offense? weight room program? Or all?

Should Z be replaced?

Yes, Z needs to step down. For all the great accomplishments of his career, fielding the worst team in school history (60 years) doesn't cut it.

yep, sorry, he owns it. 0 and 10. kids quitting and parents fighting, good coaching, bad coaching, no talent, poor attitudes- on and on and on-etc etc etc! Kids and parents are not going to leave district, but it is a sad state of affairs

Alright, Waynedale. The season's over. Now what?

thank god for wrestling.

thePITman;1305967 wrote:Alright, Waynedale. The season's over. Now what?

Personally I don't think Z is the answer yet. Has done too much good to let a couple bad years force him down.

I think you need to start with some changes in the regiment and programs first. I would also take a look at my staff and make sure I am on the same page with everyone and everyone is on my page as well. Maybe be a little more open to others ideas and make sure I was getting good information and help by looking back at the film.

I just believe that a little "shake up" is in order first before a head coaching switch. Hopefully the basketball team or baseball teams have success. A TEAM needs to have success and maybe shed some light on that concept for the returning kids. Remember too... this is high school football we are talking about, not professional. There are always new coaches out there but the last thing you want is a coach who isn't in the school and who knows what teaching positions will be open.

told this am that this is his 2nd or 3d group of asst coaches?

Jmar25;1306215 wrote:Personally I don't think Z is the answer yet. Has done too much good to let a couple bad years force him down.

I think you need to start with some changes in the regiment and programs first. I would also take a look at my staff and make sure I am on the same page with everyone and everyone is on my page as well. Maybe be a little more open to others ideas and make sure I was getting good information and help by looking back at the film.

I just believe that a little "shake up" is in order first before a head coaching switch. Hopefully the basketball team or baseball teams have success. A TEAM needs to have success and maybe shed some light on that concept for the returning kids. Remember too... this is high school football we are talking about, not professional. There are always new coaches out there but the last thing you want is a coach who isn't in the school and who knows what teaching positions will be open.

MOUNTAINBEAR;1306221 wrote:told this am that this is his 2nd or 3d group of asst coaches?

Ummm... I wouldn't call it that. I know that hofacre,harvey, dale lemon, and his dad have been there from the beginning. the barkley guy has been there since waynedale hired him. Stutz is new. Z's brother left because of family stuff and work. Louie left to concentrate on wrestling and more family time. Eric brock was there for a year but is head coach and athletic director in newcommerstown. Mark lemon helped a year but was too busy because of the business.

I don't think i'd say that he's on a different staff really. At least not by his choice. I'm not sure who else he could bring in though outside of a district hiring. That change may be the toughest and least likely change.

Pass the hat, swallow the pride, step down. For Christ sake...the program is rotten from pee wee though arsity. Someone has dropped the ball. It starts at the top and rolls down hill.

Zuercher was a hell of a ball player, he is not even close to to head coach material.

Bears program is in disarray, and I'm not sure many people really would want to take the reins.

I know I'm new here but the word from inside is that none of the varsity boys are having fun or like playing for Z.

He may have been a great player, but lacks the ability to bond with the kids...........most are intimidated. Those that do show any independant spirit with anything contrary to the way Z thinks it should be (players & assistant coaches included) will have to deal with Z's wrath.

You can't have an idea that isn't his.

Those that cross over into both the varsity & JV programs would much rather play JV & their performance, spirit & attitude on the field confirms it.............. at least until Z shows up at their games anyway.

Several good former players have said they would return to football if coaching was changed, but want nothing to do with the current varsity coaches.

More to come....................

At this point, I would say a coaching change would have little impact. There isn't a coach anywhere that I know of that could win with next years junior or senior class. This years freshman class will win at some point. Curious how they and their parents view Coach Z?? If he loses some of these kids, then a coaching change may be necessary??

Hunter86;1307957 wrote:I know I'm new here but the word from inside is that none of the varsity boys are having fun or like playing for Z.

He may have been a great player, but lacks the ability to bond with the kids...........most are intimidated. Those that do show any independant spirit with anything contrary to the way Z thinks it should be (players & assistant coaches included) will have to deal with Z's wrath.

You can't have an idea that isn't his.

Those that cross over into both the varsity & JV programs would much rather play JV & their performance, spirit & attitude on the field confirms it.............. at least until Z shows up at their games anyway.

Several good former players have said they would return to football if coaching was changed, but want nothing to do with the current varsity coaches.

More to come....................

Elaborate....?

Havin Fun;1308291 wrote:At this point, I would say a coaching change would have little impact. There isn't a coach anywhere that I know of that could win with next years junior or senior class. This years freshman class will win at some point. Curious how they and their parents view Coach Z?? If he loses some of these kids, then a coaching change may be necessary??

Valid points

Hunter86;1307957 wrote:I know I'm new here but the word from inside is that none of the varsity boys are having fun or like playing for Z.

He may have been a great player, but lacks the ability to bond with the kids...........most are intimidated. Those that do show any independant spirit with anything contrary to the way Z thinks it should be (players & assistant coaches included) will have to deal with Z's wrath.

You can't have an idea that isn't his.

Those that cross over into both the varsity & JV programs would much rather play JV & their performance, spirit & attitude on the field confirms it.............. at least until Z shows up at their games anyway.

Several good former players have said they would return to football if coaching was changed, but want nothing to do with the current varsity coaches.

More to come....................

Who are some of those kids who would play if Z was not the coach? I know of two possible impact players in the junior class and one quit football to play soccer without ever playing for Z. The other played one year and would make no difference at 140 pounds. Just can't think of anyone else although I am not around as much as before.

Hunter86;1307957 wrote:I know I'm new here but the word from inside is that none of the varsity boys are having fun or like playing for Z.

He may have been a great player, but lacks the ability to bond with the kids...........most are intimidated. Those that do show any independant spirit with anything contrary to the way Z thinks it should be (players & assistant coaches included) will have to deal with Z's wrath.

You can't have an idea that isn't his.

Those that cross over into both the varsity & JV programs would much rather play JV & their performance, spirit & attitude on the field confirms it.............. at least until Z shows up at their games anyway.

Several good former players have said they would return to football if coaching was changed, but want nothing to do with the current varsity coaches.

More to come....................

Sounds like petty excuses to me... also I sounds like someone who is just trying to start something and drag Z through the dirt... More to come...

Havin Fun;1308291 wrote:At this point, I would say a coaching change would have little impact. There isn't a coach anywhere that I know of that could win with next years junior or senior class. This years freshman class will win at some point. Curious how they and their parents view Coach Z?? If he loses some of these kids, then a coaching change may be necessary??

My problem isn't just winning with next year's classes, it's rebuilding a once dominant program. Putting all the eggs in one basket regarding this freshman class isn't fair to them or the program. And after them, then what? Is the junior high and youth program being developed?? It's like 50 years of winning tradition is just being thrown out the window, with this substandard product being accepted as okay. Heck, I say put the wrestling coach in charge of both programs! He knows all about the football tradition.

Question for those who may know?....are there many 190lb.+ athletes walking around the halls not playing football? If there is, than job no.1 should be to get those guys on the team.

If there isn't....than this is all a moot point.

jaco;1308568 wrote:Heck, I say put the wrestling coach in charge of both programs! He knows all about the football tradition.

There you go! Now your talking...

iced earth;1308586 wrote:Question for those who may know?....are there many 190lb.+ athletes walking around the halls not playing football? If there is, than job no.1 should be to get those guys on the team.

If there isn't....than this is all a moot point.

190lb - yes, 190lb athletes - not that i know of

Jmar25;1308563 wrote:Sounds like petty excuses to me... also I sounds like someone who is just trying to start something and drag Z through the dirt... More to come...

After seeing how "Z" treated the upcoming future players at the Rittman game, he's in the dirt already. (ask around)

How about his time out rant when Rittman was preparing to go for 2 after their touchdown...............he was still on the field screaming when the timeout was over & was still out there when the ball was about to be snapped.

I don't know who you are or where you work, but in the real world happy employees are far more productive than those who work for a boss that screams at them for their mistakes.

A constructive coach will pull a player aside who makes a mistake, tell him what was done wrong, build the player's confidence up by telling him he's a better player than that, and give the kid a boost by showing that he's truly behind him mistakes or not.

Not by tearing into him in front of his teammates.

Want more ?

Here ya go:

Word from the inside is we're stuck with "Z" for next year.

The only possible way to change that is for parents, booster club members & any other person who supports Waynedale athletics to show up in mass at the next school board meeting & voice their opinion.

If you like "Z" and the program as it is Jmar25, just do nothing.

Keep in mind that others inside are lobbying hard to keep "Z" where he is, because they have their personal reasons to have him in control of the program.

If you don't have a clue what I'm talking about, you need to step back & look at the big picture here before you think I'm just here stirring up the pot.

I will say this if it is true that a coach was screaming at kids who are 0-9 in a final game, he probably needs to go. After a 0-5 or 0-6 start you have to realize the team cannot compete and you need to build the kids up and prepare for the next season. Keeping a positive tone and learning from mistakes is far more beneficial than screaming at kids and driving more away from the program.

Hunter86;1308660 wrote:
Keep in mind that others inside are lobbying hard to keep "Z" where he is, because they have their personal reasons to have him in control of the program.

If you don't have a clue what I'm talking about, you need to step back & look at the big picture here before you think I'm just here stirring up the pot.

seriously with this

Hunter86;1308660 wrote:
Word from the inside is we're stuck with "Z" for next year.

The only possible way to change that is for parents, booster club members & any other person who supports Waynedale athletics to show up in mass at the next school board meeting & voice their opinion.

If you like "Z" and the program as it is Jmar25, just do nothing.

Keep in mind that others inside are lobbying hard to keep "Z" where he is, because they have their personal reasons to have him in control of the program.

If you don't have a clue what I'm talking about, you need to step back & look at the big picture here before you think I'm just here stirring up the pot.

I might buy into what you're saying more but then you bring out the secret society comments... and now the lynch mob is out to get him and there is this giant underground movement to remove Z. Then my favorite "stir the pot" moment when you say... more to come... If that isn't stirring the pot... I don't know what is. It's tough to take your comments seriously when you talk conspiracy theories and leave us on a cliff hanger ending on your very first two posts.

I've said it once and I'll say it again. These things sound like excuses when you talk about kids not coming out and not wanting to play for this coach ect... excuses. Had those kids when I played and back when Beast played ect... guess what... if that is how they are going to act what in the heck do you think they are going to when the going gets tough? (I know... cliche) Answer is you probably can't rely on those types of kids anyway to help your team.

I will listen to those that want to say he isn't doing well from a play call point or from the x's and o's. That's fine. He platooned one year and I know a lot of people didn't like that... fine...I will even listen to those that say his personality isn't right as long as it doesn't come off as a whiny, spiteful, mean, and in a girly tone of a comment (Havin fun puts it into a way that has none of those tones and to boot is constructive) By the way, Kevin Maltarich is very similar to Z in his personality....


But how you,eyes, and ghost put things.... it comes off as bitter people who just don't like the guy and want him out. The guy has had a couple rough years. Get over it. It's small school football. It comes in cycles and honestly... the last two years have been talent related... This year they never had a chance at 10-0. They had some talent just not enough where it counts (up front). I thought 5-5 but when you come up short in tight games and start league play with the monsters... its easy to fall off and not care and go 0-10. The troubling part to me is you're going to get more of the same despite the coach if some kids don't start to grow... Urban Meyer himself couldn't get it done this year and would need some "recruits" from the area to succeed in the next year or two.

So go have fun with your lynch mob. have your secret meetings. start up a petition to have him removed. go to the board meeting and state your case. That's fine. I'm sure many of you guys who are the loudest complainers could have had a 7-3 season. I just ask that you guys are at least diligent in your research and work. Then throw your name into the hat to be the next coach. PLEASE!!! I BEG YOU TO BE THE NEW COACH!


I just pray we don't get Bill Dennis or someone similar because anyone with any sense will stay away. The only types that will want to coach at Waynedale after the way you guys act are only the bill dennis types. (of course you may like that because he beat us this year) Then lets see where this program heads if we are going to get rid of a coach for the wrong reasons. I can assure its nowhere I want to see this program go and a place where I want to send my kids.

Furthermore I'm done with this thread and at this point it has run its course.

Jmar25;1310032 wrote:Furthermore I'm done with this thread and at this point it has run its course.

Great..............Glad we got that out of the way.


This years seniors, other than a couple who always play 100% & have talent, were lackluster at best.

The junior class is full of good athletes & the football team has some of the better ones.

Heck that class in jr high won basketball league championships and LL baseball league championships as well. They also were fairly successful in jr high football (I don't know their exact records there).

Factor in soccer, those that chose no football & only focused on wrestling, and apathy (not doing any sports at all) and it looks like HS broke up the continuity between the junior class that as a whole were some pretty good athletes.

The sophomores have some good kids too, but once again the other sports cut into the numbers there.

The freshmen have some good prospects, but as we saw they aren't quite ready for varsity play, but they showed good promise when several played on the jv team.

Would I coach the varsity next year.............Yes for free if given the opportunity...........but that will never happen.

What would I do different ?

First thing I would do is admit I don't know everything about the game.

With that over with, I would start by surrounding myself with the best assistant coaches I can find..........starting with an offensive coordinator.

(Your best defense in football is one that never gets on the field)............points win games and a good offense that can make long drives & control the ball & keep it out of the opposing teams hands by dominating time of possession (and finishing with points) would be my # 1 priority. If you don't have 250# linemen, you have to compensate with trickery & misdirection rather than trying to pound it up the middle every ___________ time.

Next I would set realistic goals.........I know that the playoffs next year are a million to one shot, but ending up a solid 5 and 5 is totally possible.

I would talk with the players preseason and ask them where they think they would fit in best for them and the team and work with them in small groups on repetition in their position play till their reactions become automatic as a play progresses & the season continues..

I would try to put each player in a position that relates to their individual ability to play off their strengths; be it speed, pass receiving,
lineman, defensive tackling or whatever.

One more thing (I really need to work too);

My door would be always open to any player who needs time from me.............on or off the field.

HS football is just a short period in a kids life, but the confidence in yourself that can be learned thru a properly developed personality will carry over the rest of their life.

Knowing that their teammates and coaches have their back no matter what will build the confidence in even an average player to excel & go
beyond what even he thought he can do.............. I've seen it happen