Manhattan Buckeye;691429 wrote:Again, this is the problem, we don't value the skills necessary today, the teachers' unions are out of touch.

ernest_t_bass;691444 wrote:I'm getting sick of these damn snow days, you? We called off yesterday b/c of a little ice, and I was PISSED! Most schools around us went. I would have rather gone.

With all these snow days, we should just take our time off in the Winter, instead of Summer. Seeing this shit makes me want to lean towards a year round school system. I'd much rather like 2-3 weeks off b/t quarters.

ernest_t_bass;691426 wrote:Absolutely not, but I would assume that there is some type of base, no?

ernest_t_bass;691448 wrote:It was stated somewhere in another thread that eliminating it, or enforcing that part of the bill, will be minuscule to reducing our debt. I don't have numbers, just stating what I read.

Gblock;691450 wrote:you are giving an example of schools where sped's are included in to regular classes....many districts/schools dont do this.

mella;691462 wrote:The only interaction I have had with SPEDs who don't co-teach is with a few individuals who only have about 10 students all day and they are not teaching high level classes. So yes these teachers do need a varied education and do have specialized skills but they don't work any harder than a core subject regular ed teacher.

Writerbuckeye;691461 wrote:Reducing debt is only one aspect of passing this legislation. This bill is more about giving more control to local entities like school boards over their budgets and personnel management. ...

Then again, if it "only" saves a few million dollars -- that's still a savings that is needed right now.

Union folks aren't doing themselves any favors (with the public) using this argument.

LJ;691460 wrote:no such thing as a base. The have determined that there is a range that they are willing to pay for talent that they believe can do a specific job. You can negotiate within that range. If you feel you are worth more than that range, you either take it, or you go on to the next job.

Writerbuckeye;691461 wrote:Reducing debt is only one aspect of passing this legislation. This bill is more about giving more control to local entities like school boards over their budgets and personnel management. Those opposed to the bill like to keep bringing up that this bill doesn't save that much money NOW, but that's a bit of a straw man. The savings will come down the road and over time.

It (the bill) is also only one small piece of what I am sure is a lot of steps being taken by the administration to close the budget deficit.

Then again, if it "only" saves a few million dollars -- that's still a savings that is needed right now.

Union folks aren't doing themselves any favors (with the public) using this argument.

ernest_t_bass;691467 wrote:Is the lowest number in the range not a base for starting?

Gblock;691463 wrote:you must work in the burbs....come to the inner city and sit with a SPED teacher for a day and you would change your tune. and im not saying harder im saying it is equal to what a person would do teaching other subjects. its just a different skill set. most of the teachers that teach foreign languages at my schools have been from that country and grew up speaking it...does that make them smarter?

teaching high school in my experience was easier than teaching middle school and elementary which i have also done....

ernest_t_bass;691475 wrote:Semantics.

LJ;691485 wrote:Not really. Is a gym teacher worth the same as a SPED teacher? No, but the district has a base salary that teachers will get. In private industry they will not earn the same, because there is no base. It's hard to explain to someone who has never experienced it (not dogging you, but if you have never experienced it, then all you can go off of is your experience)

Senate Bill 5 Update



On Wednesday, February 23, Senate President Tom Niehaus (R-New Richmond) spoke to reporters after Senate session about some of the changes Senate Republicans plan to make to Senate Bill 5. The changes outlined by President Niehaus DO NOT change the OEA’s position of total opposition to Senate Bill 5.



The Senate Insurance, Commerce & Labor will be taking amendment proposals through noon on Friday in preparation for a possible committee and Senate floor vote next week. Many changes are expected to the bill.



At this time, the actual language of the changes President Niehaus discussed with reporters is not available. The following are changes expected to Senate Bill 5 based on President Niehaus’ general comments indicate the following changes:



- Allow state employees and employees of state institutions of higher education to collectively bargain on wages only, not benefits or other matters. Currently, SB 5 provides no collective bargaining rights to these public employees.

- Prohibit strikes for all public employees, including school employees. Currently, SB 5 allows school employees to strike, but authorizes school districts to hire permanent replacement workers.

LJ;691485 wrote:Not really. Is a gym teacher worth the same as a SPED teacher? No, but the district has a base salary that teachers will get. In private industry they will not earn the same, because there is no base. It's hard to explain to someone who has never experienced it (not dogging you, but if you have never experienced it, then all you can go off of is your experience)

Gblock;691493 wrote:again its all relative...a special ed teacher probably teaches 14-16 students in some situations unless all the sped team splits up the subjects and trades students throughout the day and then you may see 40....gym teachers probably see 200 students a day and its not just roll the ball out an play basketball anymore. gym teachers also have a lot of set up and prep work to do. now is it rocket science? certainly not. but the public thinks its important and wants it in the school and i think they deserve as much as any teacher. on a side note we have very few gym teachers now and often they are split between up to 3-4 schools. it is also one of the first programs cut.

tsst_fballfan;691495 wrote:Actually in the private sector need comes into play for pay also. So in a private scenario if nobody wanted to be a SPED teacher they would pay that position more to attract someone to the position.

LJ;691496 wrote:Personally I think that thought is assinine. That gym teacher is not worth as much as the SPED teacher. No way in hell. Private industry would not pay them as much.

Con_Alma;691502 wrote:It's not that it isn't "important". It is. It Simply does not in my mind require the skill-set to teach Ap Physics or Ap Calc. There's bound to be a greater supply of people with the skill-set to teach health/gym than a higher level math/science thus making their marketable value and thus pay lower in an open market.

Con_Alma;691326 wrote:... Democrats and unions see the measure as an attack on workers' rights and an attempt to cripple union support for Democrats. Union leaders say they would make pension and health care concessions if they can keep their bargaining rights, but Walker has refused to compromise. ...