posted by jmogNo way you can say I was pompous and then post this. Good lord zero self aw
Fair enough. My phrasing was not good. My point continues to be that Harvard, Penn and MIT are not hostile towards Jewish people despite what some vocal protesters say and woke administrators talking in circles.
posted by QuakerOats
I would say getting at least one of these leftists fired (thus far) is meaningful.
Do you think her replacement will be John Birch Society type?
posted by Dr Winston O'BoogieDo you think her replacement will be John Birch Society type?
Lol, he's just falling into the typical politard trap of "They fired a member of the opposition party; this HAS to be a win!!!!" that doesn't take into effect things such as who will be the replacement because I'm guessing the odds of the new Penn prez having political views that he agrees with are extremely low.
Kind of like when the Ds were running victory laps due to the House Rs being in shambles, unable to agree on a name to get behind for the speaker race. And then the Rs got together to elect some crazy overly-religious dipshit who thinks he's the new Moses or some such stupidity. And all a person can say is, "Good job, guys, you decided to go all-in in the short-term 'these people are SOOOOO dysfunctional' win and rode that horse until it was too late.
posted by Dr Winston O'BoogieFair enough. My phrasing was not good. My point continues to be that Harvard, Penn and MIT are not hostile towards Jewish people despite what some vocal protesters say and woke administrators talking in circles.
Aside from my first “pompous” sentence above, my stats are from surveys and studies done since October attacks. That is direct evidence against your stance.
posted by jmogAside from my first “pompous” sentence above, my stats are from surveys and studies done since October attacks. That is direct evidence against your stance.
If you want to believe those schools have an antisemitism problem, you go right ahead. It’s an irrelevant story to most people since it doesn’t affect them even indirectly and never will. I don’t believe those places are antisemitic in the least. Calling a bunch of woke administrators up to capital hill so a congresswoman can pontificate on righteousness is the epitome of using the media to distract the populace from anything remotely impactful.
posted by Dr Winston O'BoogieIf you want to believe those schools have an antisemitism problem, you go right ahead. It’s an irrelevant story to most people since it doesn’t affect them even indirectly and never will. I don’t believe those places are antisemitic in the least. Calling a bunch of woke administrators up to capital hill so a congresswoman can pontificate on righteousness is the epitome of using the media to distract the populace from anything remotely impactful.
So statistical studies/surveys vs your feelings got it.
I think that “ pompous” was just about right.
posted by Devils AdvocateI think that “ pompous” was just about right.
Possibly, but really hard to take serious when his next post was just as "pompous".
"But if you think Jewish students, faculty and alumni do not have an outsized influence at Harvard, MIT, and Penn, then you don’t know very much about those schools."
posted by jmogSo statistical studies/surveys vs your feelings got it.
I don't know anything about your surveys. I will once again state my point: This congressional testimony was a huge soft ball at bat for this congresswoman. She called up three woke administrators from Ivy League and similar schools. Surprising no one, they talked in circles when she asked them about their schools' tolerance for hate speech against Jews. The predicted reaction and outrage ensued. Yet lost in this is the fact that these three schools have a long history of having a large Jewish population in their student bodies, on their faculty and in their alumni base. They have each been historical bastions of Jewish intellectual life.
Despite some idiots chanting about "from river to sea for Palestine" or whatever they like to say, these schools are hardly antisemetic. This was a standard attention grab by yet another worthless member of congress who has a track record of accomplishing nothing.
posted by Dr Winston O'BoogieI don't know anything about your surveys. I will once again state my point: This congressional testimony was a huge soft ball at bat for this congresswoman. She called up three woke administrators from Ivy League and similar schools. Surprising no one, they talked in circles when she asked them about their schools' tolerance for hate speech against Jews. The predicted reaction and outrage ensued. Yet lost in this is the fact that these three schools have a long history of having a large Jewish population in their student bodies, on their faculty and in their alumni base. They have each been historical bastions of Jewish intellectual life.
Despite some idiots chanting about "from river to sea for Palestine" or whatever they like to say, these schools are hardly antisemetic. This was a standard attention grab by yet another worthless member of congress who has a track record of accomplishing nothing.
70+% have seen anti-sematic since Oct 7th.
The percent of Jews that feel comfortable has dropped from 64% down to 39%.
So you still want to say its not a problem...
I think the biggest issue here is what these edifices of "higher learning" are going to do about what is considered hate speech. Because right now it seems to be that calling for the extermination of a people is not hate speech, but calling somebody the N-word is.
Personally, I'd much rather somebody call me a mean name than I'd like for them to call for my death. I don't know... something about levels of severity.
At any rate, I think society has to get a firm grasp of what hate speech really is, because the redefining of words that has been going on has done nobody any favors.
posted by jmog
70+% have seen anti-sematic since Oct 7th.
The percent of Jews that feel comfortable has dropped from 64% down to 39%.
So you still want to say its not a problem...
I know this is always your MO - I believe your engineer, so I get your inclination to quantify every last topic. Despite this ADL survey, I stand by my opinion. This is a nothing story that has been predictably stoked to keep the outrage machine running.
posted by CenterBHSFanI think the biggest issue here is what these edifices of "higher learning" are going to do about what is considered hate speech. Because right now it seems to be that calling for the extermination of a people is not hate speech, but calling somebody the N-word is.
Personally, I'd much rather somebody call me a mean name than I'd like for them to call for my death. I don't know... something about levels of severity.
At any rate, I think society has to get a firm grasp of what hate speech really is, because the redefining of words that has been going on has done nobody any favors.
The biggest issue here is you have two groups of people vying for the same shitty piece of desert because each believes their own God favors them over others. The extreme Palestinians want the Israelis wiped out and the extreme Jews want the Palestinians wiped out. The moderates on both sides are of no help because they essentially legitimize the zealots by following a cafeteria version of the same twisted faith, thereby sending the message that the zealots are simply believers of legitimate world views who happen to follow each a “little too enthusiastically”. A simple reading of the Torah or Quran will show the zealots are actually following their respective faiths pretty much the way they were laid out.
Until we admit that this entire ordeal is simply two religions reaching their potential, we’ll continue to pretend that there is somehow a right and a wrong side to this. Of course, and in spite of the noise about Ivy League presidents/protests, the US is entirely behind one side. As a result we will continue to pay the harsh price anyone does who comes between fanatical believers and their heavenly mission.
posted by Dr Winston O'BoogieI know this is always your MO - I believe your engineer, so I get your inclination to quantify every last topic. Despite this ADL survey, I stand by my opinion. This is a nothing story that has been predictably stoked to keep the outrage machine running.
They want it to be a non-story, but the withholding of billions of dollars in future donations is a story, as is the the enlightenment of those who may not have realized the depths to which these radical Marxist 'organizations' have fallen.
posted by QuakerOatsThey want it to be a non-story, but the withholding of billions of dollars in future donations is a story, as is the the enlightenment of those who may not have realized the depths to which these radical Marxist 'organizations' have fallen.
In 365 days, this will all be long forgotten. I think you know that deep inside.
posted by Dr Winston O'BoogieIn 365 days, this will all be long forgotten. I think you know that deep inside.
I believe this is a true statement. But 2 things can be true, it can be a problem now and still be forgotten completely inside of a year.
posted by Dr Winston O'BoogieIn 365 days, this will all be long forgotten. I think you know that deep inside.
That's the way it goes. They (Harvard) still have $50 billion and it has been ceded to the leftists in charge; they have the staying power to inflict much more damage in the years to come.
posted by Dr Winston O'Boogie
The biggest issue here is you have two groups of people vying for the same shitty piece of desert because each believes their own God favors them over others. The extreme Palestinians want the Israelis wiped out and the extreme Jews want the Palestinians wiped out. The moderates on both sides are of no help because they essentially legitimize the zealots by following a cafeteria version of the same twisted faith, thereby sending the message that the zealots are simply believers of legitimate world views who happen to follow each a “little too enthusiastically”. A simple reading of the Torah or Quran will show the zealots are actually following their respective faiths pretty much the way they were laid out.
Until we admit that this entire ordeal is simply two religions reaching their potential, we’ll continue to pretend that there is somehow a right and a wrong side to this. Of course, and in spite of the noise about Ivy League presidents/protests, the US is entirely behind one side. As a result we will continue to pay the harsh price anyone does who comes between fanatical believers and their heavenly mission.
With the main thing being that, as a country, we need our forever wars because they're as good a reason as any to keep the money machine churning out $$$. If we had any interest in any solution not involving constant strife, well, considering how much money we provide Israel (over 3 billion a year, I think), I'd say we would have the right to say they are essentially our vassal and need to get in line or get cut off. But that's not our way because we love our conflicts and especially love them when our proxy states are at the forefront of them and we can play the role of "big brother" where we're not officially at war, but are offering support and printing money like mad for those who are.
posted by jmogI believe this is a true statement. But 2 things can be true, it can be a problem now and still be forgotten completely inside of a year.
There may be a problem at these schools with respect to things being said by protesters that are detestable to others. But that’s nothing new at these places. I will posit that the only reason anyone cares about this particular instance above any other is because a congresswoman decided she wanted relevancy and set up a so-easy-an-infant-could-do-it “hearing” in order to get on tv and outrage the rest of the choir.
posted by QuakerOatsThat's the way it goes. They (Harvard) still have $50 billion and it has been ceded to the leftists in charge; they have the staying power to inflict much more damage in the years to come.
Harvard’s been a left leaning school since the early 20th century at least.
