killer_ewok wrote:

ytownfootball wrote: Interesting diatribe but I do have a question for Stiller fans.

Many of you seem to be banking on the fact that Troy P. will return healthy and thus increase your chances of making a run (no mention of how bad the special teams have been or the fact that a lack of solid running game exsisted all season but anyway).

Troy plays with reckless abandon, it's what makes him as effective as he is. It's my contention that his style of play is what is going to prevent him from seeing as much of the field as he did earlier in his career and I think his best days are behind him. He's shown lately to be anything but durable. Were I the Stillers I'd be looking to find a replacement pretty quick.

Good point about Troy and I think that's why some of us said "barring major injuries." Troy has had some trouble staying healthy lately but I think looking for a suitable backup would be wise, not looking for a replacement. If Troy misses significant time again next season then maybe it will be time to consider that but not yet. Troy Polamalu, Ed Reed, Bob Sanders. All great safeties....all having injury trouble recently. No way do you look into "replacing" those players until you're pretty sure they're going to continue to miss long periods of time each season.

Did the Special Teams stink? Oh yes. Can't deny that. We'll see what a new ST coach can get done this season. I'm hoping that he turns things around for that unit. And while the running game wasn't great.....I think it was solid but just inconsistent due to Arians' playcalling. I feel like he got away from it too much at times. Mendenhall really established himself last season and I think that the running game is pretty solid if Arians sticks with it.

My main concern is the offensive line/pass protection. THAT has been the nagging deficiency the last few seasons.

Personally, Polamau will be fine. Maybe that long layoff is just what he needed to completely heal his injuries. You know he will report to training camp in top notch shape.

ytownfootball wrote: O-line has been very questionable and was the main juice behind asserting that the running game has been poor, well poor by comparison to seasons when it was instrumental in their success.

One thing about living in the AFC Central, you better be able to run the ball or you could be in for some long games.

I get that but IMO the Steelers were able to run the ball but Arians didn't make it a point to do it. There were times when the Steelers would usually line up and get a yard on 3rd and 1 by running the ball. Now, Arians calls a play and the Steelers come out 4 or 5-wide on short distances. Not sure if he thinks he can't pick it up running but I feel that they didn't attempt it enough to know if that was really the case. I think the guys up front get a decent surge on running plays but their pass protection leaves a lot to be desired. #7 is on his back far too often.

The Steelers have way more competeition in the AFc then they did in 2008-09. The Jets are the new Steel Curtain defense, the Bengals are defending AFC North champs, the Browns beat the Steelers and are making changes w/in the organization to change their losing ways. The Titans should be back in the top again next year. Houston is improving every year, many think SD is on the verge of taking the next step, Denver will be in its second year with a new coach and QB.

Then there is the rivalry w/ perennial playoff team the Ravens. Many ppl. will tell you it takes two years to get 100% after a knee injury, so Tom Brady could be closer to 2007 than 2009 and I suspect NE will bring in some better players for next year. Of course Indy is the early SB favorite.

OH SHIT!!!!

Apparently it isn't just us delusional Steeler fans who think Pittsburgh is the greatest at everything and anyone who disagrees about that is an idiot not worth anything (or however some of you phrase it whenever a Steeler fan disagrees with you) who feel a Roethlisberger-Manning comparison isn't stupid, due to the difference in postseason success.

PROTIP: Note how Jason Cole, while mentioning that Ben was bad in his first Super Bowl win, ALSO brings up how good he was in the playoffs before that game. Some people here seem to struggle to remember that and act like that one bad performance in a win completely nullifies his previous good performances in wins.

ADDENDUM: As you can tell from the first sentence, Cole even expresses that he is wary about having his views on the matter compared to mine. But then writes something that basically expresses my personal thoughts on the matter.

ROFLMAO @ YOU PC'S!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!LOL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

LTrain23 wrote: ROFLMAO @ YOU PC'S!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!LOL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

PC'S!!?!?!?!??!!?!?!!?????!!!???

I truly am Laughing My Ass Off Rolling On Floor. Okay...not really....but you won the argument...whatever it was.

Ben actually made a few decent plays in that first Super Bowl.

He had the one where he rolled out to his left and then just heaved it up but Hines Ward caught it at the 1. It was like a 45-yard pass. Then Ben scored on a sneak, which was controversial, but it goes down as a TD. Late in the game when the Steelers were trying to get a first down to run it out the Seahawks played run up the middle and Ben took it himself to the outside for a first down.

Those plays still matter regardless of the QB rating.

I remember a couple of those Cleveland games when Ben rallied the Steelers from behind. The one play where he took off and ran for like a 30-yard touchdown.

The guy does whatever it takes. He's won games in different ways, sometimes playing his best and other times struggling early but staying resilient and playing in the fourth quarter.

I think the Steelers will have a good shot moving forward if their defense can get back to usual form. It should with Polamalu and Smith coming back and a few draft picks.

Not many teams will be able to match the Steelers with a top-ranked defense and a good QB who is 28 and playing at his peak level. They have a lot of other good players on offense but just those two elements alone are the recipe for success.

I'd agree with that. Ben makes plays that don't show up in QB rating on a regular basis. The worry that I have is that with the hits he takes due to holding onto the ball to make those plays, he's not really a good 28-year-old QB playing at his peak level with all these great future endeavors in front of him...

I worry that he's another Culpepper, where he ages really quickly due to the punishment and goes from a superstar kind of player to an afterthought in the blink of an eye. I hope that's not the case, but I worry about it a lot. It was scary how quickly Culpepper went from being the shit to being an afterthought...I can see that happening to Ben. Hopefully, it doesn't, but I can see it.

Pittsburgh fans are clueless IMO. No way in hell is Ben better than Manning.

bo shemmy3337 wrote: Pittsburgh fans are clueless IMO.

Yipee!

Heretic wrote: I'd agree with that. Ben makes plays that don't show up in QB rating on a regular basis. The worry that I have is that with the hits he takes due to holding onto the ball to make those plays, he's not really a good 28-year-old QB playing at his peak level with all these great future endeavors in front of him...

I worry that he's another Culpepper, where he ages really quickly due to the punishment and goes from a superstar kind of player to an afterthought in the blink of an eye. I hope that's not the case, but I worry about it a lot. It was scary how quickly Culpepper went from being the shit to being an afterthought...I can see that happening to Ben. Hopefully, it doesn't, but I can see it.

I think he's starting to lose some of his athletic ability that he had in his first few years but he's getting a lot better as a pure pocket passer. He had a great year, though, in terms of passing yards and TDs and rating. Up there with the likes of Manning, Schaub, Rivers in the AFC. I think because of the progress he's made in this more spread out offense the past two years, he's a much better all-around QB now than he was earlier in his career. I don't think he'll play many more years but he should have his 3-4 best years coming up.

Interesting discussions going on here. I won't get in to the "who's better" debate, because that is just turning in to a pissing contest.
However there are a few points I'd like to add. First, a little correction from earlier in the thread...the Steelers are 2-0 in Super Bowls this decade, not 2-1. Their only loss in 7 appearances, came in 1995(Dallas).
Now the misconception that Roethlisberger was drafted onto a contending team/great situation. Wrong! Under Bill Cowher, the Steelers were noted for strong defense and a solid running game. Yet, through all those years, they could reach the Super Bowl just once, the aforementioned loss to the Cowboys. The Steelers drafted Roethlisberger with the 11th pick of the first round. Why were they drafting that high? They were 6-10 the previous season! Hardly a great situation. The Pittsburgh Steelers were NOT a Super Bowl contender when the drafted Ben Roethlisberger. They BECAME a Super Bowl contender WHEN they drafted Ben Roethlisberger!

DeyDurkie5 wrote:

Al Capone wrote: What's the bet on? How about the Steelers having twice the wins that the Browns have.

No, Steelers winning the super bowl or hell even making it

DeyDurkie5 wrote:

Al Capone wrote: I didn't think you would want anything to do with the Browns winning anything.

Yeah I know I don't because it would be a dumb bet lol, and you don't want anything to do with the steelers winning/making it to the super bowl because it is also a dumb bet.

Well the odds would be heavily in your favor. Only 2 teams out of 32 can make the Super Bowl. So if you give him 30:1 odds, maybe he'll take your bet.

bo shemmy3337 wrote: Pittsburgh fans are clueless IMO. No way in hell is Ben better than Manning.

not a steeler fan and not clueless ill take big ben in the playoffs any day over peyton, big ben wouldnt have thrown that int

grass_licker wrote:

bo shemmy3337 wrote: Pittsburgh fans are clueless IMO. No way in hell is Ben better than Manning.

not a steeler fan and not clueless ill take big ben in the playoffs any day over peyton, big ben wouldnt have thrown that int

And if he did he at least would have made the tackle.

2shoes wrote: Interesting discussions going on here. I won't get in to the "who's better" debate, because that is just turning in to a pissing contest.
However there are a few points I'd like to add. First, a little correction from earlier in the thread...the Steelers are 2-0 in Super Bowls this decade, not 2-1. Their only loss in 7 appearances, came in 1995(Dallas).
Now the misconception that Roethlisberger was drafted onto a contending team/great situation. Wrong! Under Bill Cowher, the Steelers were noted for strong defense and a solid running game. Yet, through all those years, they could reach the Super Bowl just once, the aforementioned loss to the Cowboys. The Steelers drafted Roethlisberger with the 11th pick of the first round. Why were they drafting that high? They were 6-10 the previous season! Hardly a great situation. The Pittsburgh Steelers were NOT a Super Bowl contender when the drafted Ben Roethlisberger. They BECAME a Super Bowl contender WHEN they drafted Ben Roethlisberger!

Good post. The Steelers weren't expected to be that good in 2004 after going 6-10 in 2003. When Ben took over he gave the entire team a spark. They won at Dallas and beat New England and Philly, two undefeated teams back-to-back, and the team fed off of that momentum.

dwccrew wrote:

DeyDurkie5 wrote:

Al Capone wrote: What's the bet on? How about the Steelers having twice the wins that the Browns have.

No, Steelers winning the super bowl or hell even making it

DeyDurkie5 wrote:

Al Capone wrote: I didn't think you would want anything to do with the Browns winning anything.

Yeah I know I don't because it would be a dumb bet lol, and you don't want anything to do with the steelers winning/making it to the super bowl because it is also a dumb bet.

Well the odds would be heavily in your favor. Only 2 teams out of 32 can make the Super Bowl. So if you give him 30:1 odds, maybe he'll take your bet.

fuck that on 30-1 odds...Capone thinks the steelers are the best, so I will give minimal odds if that

Why don't you think they'll be good next year?

They were 9-7 same record as the Jets and Ravens and that was without Polamalu and Smith, the two players they could least afford to lose on defense.

I'm usually not that optimistic about my teams but I think this season was a fluke, bad luck or whatever you want to call it and they'll be back next year with a top defense. There's no way the Steelers defense stays down. No chance.

Non wrote: Why don't you think they'll be good next year?

They were 9-7 same record as the Jets and Ravens and that was without Polamalu and Smith, the two players they could least afford to lose on defense.

I'm usually not that optimistic about my teams but I think this season was a fluke, bad luck or whatever you want to call it and they'll be back next year with a top defense. There's no way the Steelers defense stays down. No chance.

i have said constantly that I think they will be a playoff team, but won't have enough to make it to the Super Bowl. Could that be a loss in the AFC championship game? Yes. Could it be in the first round of the playoffs? Yes....I think they will have a good playoff team, but won't have what it takes to reach the super bowl. Capone can't seem to fathom that

Non wrote: It's tough to rank the QBs right now.

Like 10 guys that could easily be top five.

I'd say in the AFC there are five legit Pro Bowl caliber QBs fighting for three spots.

Manning
Brady
Roethlisberger
Schaub
Rivers

Those are the five best and all good, legit franchise QBs. I'd put Manning No. 1 but he is a little on the old side at 33 (34 in March). Ben turns 28 in March and is clearly in his prime, playing at the highest level of his career. Schaub and Rivers are the same way.

No Breez?

1. Peyton
2. Breez
3. Brady
4. Rivers
5. Warner
6. Favre
7 Shaub
8 Ben

^^^^Bree"s".

Brees is not above Brady. Try to set aside the fact that you just watched Brees win his first Super Bowl and Brady struggled to return after a knee, and remember just how much "as good" or "better" Brady has been in multiple SB winning seasons.....

Why dod ppl go bonkers for someone or some team after they win it all??? I mean yeah he won one but all of a sudden he's Joe Montana??? If he can do it consistenlty like Brady then he may surpass him but not after ONE.

Just like the ppl. who, every year, pick the same team to go back and win it again. It's so fresh in their mind that they can't imagine that next year anyone could be better than the current champ. Yet how many times do we see the champ go back???

Not often, but when it does happen Tom Brady is likely behind center....

^^^Compare and contrast Brees over the past 3 years stat wise with Brady (or anyone else). My guess would be that he has the top qb rating over that 3 year period.

Yeah, there's difference between saying someone is the best "right now" or saying best "of all time". When Brady's career is over, a lot of people will view him as one of the best ever, regardless of what he does from here on out. Brees isn't going to get that kind of recognition at the moment, but if you were looking for a quarterback to start next season for your team, it isn't a stretch to say you'd want Brees over Brady. Brady's health is a question mark and that alone makes him more of a risk than a healthy Brees coming off of a great season in which he won the title.

There were several quarterbacks who were better than Montana while he was in KC. At that point in time, he wouldn't have been anyone's first pick but it doesn't change how his entire body of work is viewed today.

All time passer: Manning #2, Culpepper #6, Brady #8, Brees #9.

Brees holds three ind. records, Brady two (though he quarterbacked the highest scoring offense in a single season)

Brady has 3 SB's, Brees 1 SB