My league goes 50+ WRs deep and is a keeper league, so both Little and Josh Gordon got drafted, but both really late (like rounds 16 and 17).

More cuts, Gordon, etc....

http://www.espncleveland.com/common/more.php?m=49&post_id=3831

DT's...

http://cle.scout.com/2/1215322.html

O-Line....

http://www.cleveland.com/browns/index.ssf/2012/08/cleveland_browns_o-line_blocks.html?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter

(snicker...snicker)

From Clayton's mailbag:

Q: This year's installment of the Browns feels much improved, doesn't it? I understand a lot of folks saying that the improvement might not show in the win column due to the brutal schedule, but this is a team on the rise, right?


Kovacs in Dallas

A: That was my opinion during my visit to Browns camp and having watched three preseason games. Compare the wide receiving corps for potential compared to what was there in the first year of the Eric Mangini administration. Greg Little, Josh Gordon and Travis Benjamin have great potential. There is more speed and athleticism. Brandon Weeden has more talent and potential at QB than Colt McCoy. In an offensive game, the team is moving in the right direction. But young offenses and inexperienced quarterbacks create turnovers. In a tough division and with a tough schedule, that's where the Browns will pay the price this year. The potential problem for the future is whether new owner Jimmy Haslam will make too many changes. I think the Browns are going in the right direction.

^^^ young offensive team = turnovers.

I agree with that. Look at this preseason already, . In 3 first quarters we have 6 turnovers.

like_that;1256137 wrote:From Clayton's mailbag:

Q: This year's installment of the Browns feels much improved, doesn't it? I understand a lot of folks saying that the improvement might not show in the win column due to the brutal schedule, but this is a team on the rise, right?


Kovacs in Dallas

A: That was my opinion during my visit to Browns camp and having watched three preseason games. Compare the wide receiving corps for potential compared to what was there in the first year of the Eric Mangini administration. Greg Little, Josh Gordon and Travis Benjamin have great potential. There is more speed and athleticism. Brandon Weeden has more talent and potential at QB than Colt McCoy. In an offensive game, the team is moving in the right direction. But young offenses and inexperienced quarterbacks create turnovers. In a tough division and with a tough schedule, that's where the Browns will pay the price this year. The potential problem for the future is whether new owner Jimmy Haslam will make too many changes. I think the Browns are going in the right direction.

The word potential annoys me. Every team has potential all over the field. Aside from trich I'm not very optimistic when it comes to our offense this season, no matter how much "potential" they may have.

Guaranteed that people are going to be flipping their lids over the lack of offensive production in the first half of the year. I expect it from the fans (flipping out) and the players (lack of production). I don't think the light bulb is really going to go off until the second half of the season. Sucks for the fans but hopefully it will give a glimmer of the future.

BR1986FB;1256159 wrote: I don't think the light bulb is really going to go off until the second half of the season.

I also agree with this. From what I have seen so far they just don't look like a "finished" product, and we probably won't see that until the second half of the season.

If we look pretty bad the first half and start looking pretty decent, say, the last 4 games, will that buy Heckert/Shurmur another year like it did Mangini?

Mangini is on ESPN First Take right now. I don't know about you guys but I don't know what I hate worse, watching the guy on television or actually agreeing with what he is saying.

Mr Miyagi;1256173 wrote:I also agree with this. From what I have seen so far they just don't look like a "finished" product, and we probably won't see that until the second half of the season.

If we look pretty bad the first half and start looking pretty decent, say, the last 4 games, will that buy Heckert/Shurmur another year like it did Mangini?

The last 4 games? no. Last 8 games? maybe.

Rotinaj;1256181 wrote:The last 4 games? no. Last 8 games? maybe.

This is more likely (last 8).

McCoy to start against Da Bears....

BR1986FB;1256274 wrote:McCoy to start against Da Bears....

Showcasing him to be traded is my guess. Hell probably play 3 quarters.

Rotinaj;1256276 wrote:Showcasing him to be traded is my guess. Hell probably play 3 quarters.

And the idiots over on cleveland.com think it's because he's won the starting job...

BR1986FB;1256159 wrote:Guaranteed that people are going to be flipping their lids over the lack of offensive production in the first half of the year. I expect it from the fans (flipping out) and the players (lack of production). I don't think the light bulb is really going to go off until the second half of the season. Sucks for the fans but hopefully it will give a glimmer of the future.

I think it depends. People are going to blow a gasket if we aren't scoring points and there is the appearance the offense is being shackled by uber conservative play-calling that produces nothing but field goals (on a good week).

With a strong arm QB like Weeden and a speedy deep threat like Benjamin, people are going to want to see them taking chances at least. Gordon is himself quickly starting to look like a playmaker.

If the Browns play an exciting style of ball and make mistakes, people will be far more tolerant. If it is nothing but a boring barrage of 3 yard passes that don't produce points then it is going to be ugly in this town.

My hope is that somewhere in the recesses of their mind Shurmur and crew realize they are all losing their jobs if the product doesn't look substantially better, and choose to go down guns blazing instead of with a whimper. Push the envelope a bit and take some chances because they have nothing to lose.

BR1986FB;1256280 wrote:And the idiots over on cleveland.com think it's because he's won the starting job...

He is going to play well, and it is going to open a rift in the fan base further than already exists.

Look at the OBR (where they should know better) and the McCoy supporters are out in droves right now.

We all see where this is going, and I think management foolishly thinks they can keep a lid on it as I am getting the feeling they are less and less likely to move him as time goes on.

Teams around the league know having him on the roster is untenable (at least for a normal team it would be) so I think that is why the offers blow right now.

IggyPride00;1256285 wrote:He is going to play well, and it is going to open a rift in the fan base further than already exists.

Look at the OBR (where they should know better) and the McCoy supporters are out in droves right now.

We all see where this is going, and I think management foolishly thinks they can keep a lid on it as I am getting the feeling they are less and less likely to move him as time goes on.

Teams around the league know having him on the roster is untenable (at least for a normal team it would be) so I think that is why the offers blow right now.

I agree with this. The longer he stays on the squad, the worse it's gonna get.

I'll be fine with the growing pains this year as long as I don't have to watch the check down offense and throwing the ball short of the first down marker....that I my biggest complaint, and what drives me nuts!!

BR1986FB;1256280 wrote:And the idiots over on cleveland.com think it's because he's won the starting job...

After you posted this, I was waiting for this:

IggyPride00;1256285 wrote:He is going to play well, and it is going to open a rift in the fan base further than already exists.

Look at the OBR (where they should know better) and the McCoy supporters are out in droves right now.

We all see where this is going, and I think management foolishly thinks they can keep a lid on it as I am getting the feeling they are less and less likely to move him as time goes on.

Teams around the league know having him on the roster is untenable (at least for a normal team it would be) so I think that is why the offers blow right now.

Iggy never fails to disappoint. LOL.

like_that;1256362 wrote:After you posted this, I was waiting for this:



Iggy never fails to disappoint. LOL.

So the fact that we drafted a QB in the first round and are doing everything possible to undercut him and make his transition more difficult in keeping a popular player who also happened to start at that same position the past year and a half doesn't bother you?

I am tired of QB controversies. When you draft a QB in the first round, he is your guy. You do everything possible to put him in the best position to succeed.

Keeping McCoy around is setting Weeden up to fail, and as a Browns fan it doesn't make sense to me.

It feels alot like the situation with the Indians management and the offense last year. Everyone and their mother in this city knew they needed help except the guys writing the checks who thought they knew better. A wasted season later we are no better off.

If Colt is on this roster to start the year there will be a QB controversy this season, which will only set the franchise back that much further. We all know it is coming, and management doesn't seem the least bit bothered to cut if off before it happens. Just like Shapiro and his gang they think they are smarter than everyone else and will manage it. Sure.

I want Brandon Weeden to be put in the best possible position to win. Period. Laying the foundation for a QB controversy is not achieving that goal.

Do you not want to see this franchise turn the corner finally?

You guys area all so crazy with this Weeden vs McCoy stuff….do you realize that McCoy did not start the 4th preseason game last year? It's just normal operating procedure. No trade showcasing, no trying to stir up a QB debate….just doing the same thing they (and many other teams) usually do for the 4th preseason game.

going in a slightly different tangent: I agree this is the way "it's always been" not starting the 1st string qb in the final preseason game. I don't think there's any qb controversy brewing.But how smart is that? what does weeden--and his receivers--need more of than ANYTHING? reps. playing experience. snaps. mgiht he get hurt? of course he MIGHT. Just like he might get hurt the 1st play of scrimmage in the first game. If it happens, then you play your backup. Play him and the receivers a half to get them some experience they desperately need.

BR1986FB;1256288 wrote:I agree with this. The longer he stays on the squad, the worse it's gonna get.

are you saying you dont have faith in Weeden? I dont see it getting worse as long as Weeden is proving that he should be the starter.

Wally;1256435 wrote:You guys area all so crazy with this Weeden vs McCoy stuff….do you realize that McCoy did not start the 4th preseason game last year? It's just normal operating procedure. No trade showcasing, no trying to stir up a QB debate….just doing the same thing they (and many other teams) usually do for the 4th preseason game.

we know.