Don't want to say I told you so, but I said all along that Ferry was as much to blame as anyone. He just didn't put the Cavs in a good position and if Lebron leaves, the franchise is set back at least 5 years because of the current guys on the roster. There isn't one move that I can point to that Ferry made and say, "Yea, that was a good move."

The free agent signings, the trades, the resignings, the draft, he didn't perform well in any particular area.

And those who cite the regular season as evidence of Ferry doing a good job, you are wrong, that had more to do with Lebron than anyone. When you have the best regular season player in the NBA, who has never had an injury and people enjoy playing with, you are by default going to have a good team.

LOL...my old "bandwagon" stuff consists of Grant Hill jerseys from his Pistons days.

Sage;379245 wrote:That sound you heard? Cavs "fans" like SQ and 90% of their fanbase digging out their old bandwagon Bulls gear from the 90's.

Fuck that............90% of their fanbase? gimme a break

KR1245;379253 wrote:Fuck that............90% of their fanbase? gimme a break

+1...have been a fan LONG before Lebron was even an itch in his daddy's pants. That won't change unless the franchise folds or relocates.

looks like lebron is gonna get one of his high school boys to become gm

SQ_Crazies;379251 wrote:LOL...my old "bandwagon" stuff consists of Grant Hill jerseys from his Pistons days.

Those ugly, sea green ones with the horse on it? Why are you not wearing that like daily?

ts1227;379260 wrote:Those ugly, sea green ones with the horse on it? Why are you not wearing that like daily?

LMAO, yes! And do you remember how tiny I was when we were young? Doesn't fit my giant ass anymore.

my "old bandwagon" stuff consists of a blue mark price jersey, so suck my balls sage.

granted the jersey is a childs jersey, so i can't fit it anymore.

Interesting. Seems like hindsight is 20/20. The past couple years Ferry was considered a GREAT GM by the fans on this site. Each move he did was a great move yada yada yada. Now some of those same people are saying he should be gone. Nothing wrong with it, just funny to hear the tune change so quickly. He was a good GM. He made this a better team, just not the best. This makes me thinks the Cavs have a plan and that LBJ staying just increased. I don't see how firing your coach and GM helps sign back the MVP unless he gave it the okay. I also think LBJ should not give anymore advice into GM decisions. He isn't knocking them out of the park either. He's got himself to blame just as much as the FO guys.

SQ_Crazies;379236 wrote:LOL..

I can't even have a serious discussion with you people...

You have said several times on here that no trades happen unless Lebron gives the OK. If you wouldn't flip flop, spin everything and act you know more than anyone then maybe we could take you seriously. But I'm sure I will be met with your usual profanity laced response.

i think the FA randomizer thing on ESPN should be a GM somewhere, it just had bosh, wade, lebron to miami and amare, johnson, and nowitzki to NYK.

jpake1;379272 wrote:Interesting. Seems like hindsight is 20/20. The past couple years Ferry was considered a GREAT GM by the fans on this site. Each move he did was a great move yada yada yada. Now some of those same people are saying he should be gone. Nothing wrong with it, just funny to hear the tune change so quickly. He was a good GM. He made this a better team, just not the best. This makes me thinks the Cavs have a plan and that LBJ staying just increased. I don't see how firing your coach and GM helps sign back the MVP unless he gave it the okay. I also think LBJ should not give anymore advice into GM decisions. He isn't knocking them out of the park either. He's got himself to blame just as much as the FO guys.

I'll give Ferry a "pass" for his first free agency spending spree. Paxson fucked us over and left us in a terrible position.

Ferry's first "splash" was the Larry Hughes deal. I gotta give him a pass on that one. Regardless of how he tried to spin it with his "Hughes was our #1 target" bullshit, Hughes was the 4th option after getting snubbed by Redd, Ray Allen & Joe Johnson. He pretty much HAD to do something to get LBJ's "Robin."

Some of the other acquisitions were "oooh/aaah" big name signings but they didn't necessarily fit what Potato Head was trying to do, defensively.

Skyhook79;379273 wrote:You have said several times on here that no trades happen unless Lebron gives the OK. If you wouldn't flip flop, spin everything and act you know more than anyone then maybe we could take you seriously. But I'm sure I will be met with your usual profanity laced response.

Exactly what I'm talkin' about..

Admittedly, I don't follow the NBA that much, but what about Phil Jackson taking over as co-GM/Coach handling the player personel decisions? It really sounds like Gilbert is going for broke here, so maybe he makes Phil an offer he can't refuse.

Of course Gilbert is going for broke, because if he doesn't, LeBron leaves and the franchise goes broke.

I don't want to say no professional sports team has ever been in this situation before, but it sure seems like it. You have the superstar of all superstars up for free agency after failing to accomplish your goal the last couple years, no coach, no GM and a roster that desperately needs to get better to make it more appealing for the superstar.

Who is in a position to pull the trigger on a trade right now?

Sage;379245 wrote:That sound you heard? Cavs "fans" like SQ and 90% of their fanbase digging out their old bandwagon Bulls gear from the 90's.

LOL, I think there's a better chance of that happening for Lakers fans when Kobe retires. Kinda like right before Shaq and Kobe came....

"What are you talking about! Shaq and Kobe came the season after Magic and Kareem wons the title!!!"


Sure the LeBron fans will follow LeBron but there will always be Cavs fans. There were for 30 years before LeBron, there will be for 30 years after......Not to mention even if LeBron leaves he left his mark on creating a new generation of Cavs fans this millennium. Bandwagons are for teams like the Lakers, Celtics, Yankees, Patriots, Cowboys etc....



As for Ferry I thought he did a good job. He brought in some good players and made a lot of trades that brought quality players for practically nothing on the Cavs side. Compared to his predecessor, Jim Paxon, who will go down in history as one of the worst GM's in the history of sports....I'd say he did pretty good.

krazie45;379319 wrote:LOL, I think there's a better chance of that happening for Lakers fans when Kobe retires. Kinda like right before Shaq and Kobe came....

"What are you talking about! Shaq and Kobe came the season after Magic and Kareem wons the title!!!"


Sure the LeBron fans will follow LeBron but there will always be Cavs fans. There were for 30 years before LeBron, there will be for 30 years after......Not to mention even if LeBron leaves he left his mark on creating a new generation of Cavs fans this millennium. Bandwagons are for teams like the Lakers, Celtics, Yankees, Patriots, Cowboys etc....



As for Ferry I thought he did a good job. He brought in some good players and made a lot of trades that brought quality players for practically nothing on the Cavs side. Compared to his predecessor, Jim Paxon, who will go down in history as one of the worst GM's in the history of sports....I'd say he did pretty good.

So many things wrong with this post I don't even know where to start.

First off, the Celtics and Lakers are two of the most storied franchises in all of professional sports, so I'm not sure how a fan of either could be called a bandwagon, as they've always been good.

And I keep reading everyone say that they will be Cavs fans even without Lebron, well guess what, statistics would prove otherwise. What kind of support do the Indians get? How about the Cavs prior to Lebron? If Lebron leaves, the Q will be half full on every game. That alone tells me that Cavs fans do care. Sure you say you will still be a fan, but will you be watching as many games on TV without Lebron as you would if they have him? No.

Lastly, I don't want to say Ferry did a bad job, but I certainly don't think he did a good job. He got lucky by inheriting Lebron. And to say he brought in quality players for practically nothing, isn't necessarily true. He might not have given up much in what would be considered quality players, but he sacraficed the salary cap and flexibility that the team has. I don't think anyone understands how bad off the Cavs are if Lebron leaves. They could possibly go from the best regular season team, to the worst in one year. And they have no cap room, and at this time, have no GM to even make a move to clear up some cap space.

Ferry got screwed. Not his first time tho...

I cheered for Bob Sura, Tractor Traylor and Trajon Langdon (The Alaskan Assassin) among others... I hope he stays, but I will always be a Cavaliers fan.

However, I see that as Gilbert basically giving LeBron the keys to the franchise to keep him in Cleveland. I think Ferry could see it coming and decided it was time to get out.

Grant is the GM now.. isn't he guys?

Apparently Grant is the GM, but is he the permanent replacement? If not, how much power does he have to negotiate and deal with other teams?

thedynasty1998;379326 wrote:So many things wrong with this post I don't even know where to start.

First off, the Celtics and Lakers are two of the most storied franchises in all of professional sports, so I'm not sure how a fan of either could be called a bandwagon, as they've always been good.

And I keep reading everyone say that they will be Cavs fans even without Lebron, well guess what, statistics would prove otherwise. What kind of support do the Indians get? How about the Cavs prior to Lebron? If Lebron leaves, the Q will be half full on every game. That alone tells me that Cavs fans do care. Sure you say you will still be a fan, but will you be watching as many games on TV without Lebron as you would if they have him? No.

Lastly, I don't want to say Ferry did a bad job, but I certainly don't think he did a good job. He got lucky by inheriting Lebron. And to say he brought in quality players for practically nothing, isn't necessarily true. He might not have given up much in what would be considered quality players, but he sacraficed the salary cap and flexibility that the team has. I don't think anyone understands how bad off the Cavs are if Lebron leaves. They could possibly go from the best regular season team, to the worst in one year. And they have no cap room, and at this time, have no GM to even make a move to clear up some cap space.

There's even more wrong with these statements than your perception of what's wrong with mine....I guess I'll crack at this one at a time

How could their fans be called bandwagoners? Hmmm.....let me see. If you all of a sudden start rooting for a team because they're winning you are a bandwagon fan. I've seen more Celtics fans in the last few years than I ever have before (yes they have been a great franchise but were practically NOTHING in the 90s and early 00s). The Lakers have also have their down periods. Are there bandwagon Cavs fans? Sure....any time a team wins it'll have a few bandwagon fans but to say that 90% of a fanbase is bandwagon is just an asinine statement.

What statistics? Where are these statistics that will prove that there will be no Cavs fans without LeBron? You're just pulling shit out of your ass. Unless LeBron leaves and we see it in person there is NO way you can make that claim. What are you going to compare it to the few years before LeBron? When Gund was the owner? When the roster was 1000 times worse than it is now? When the colors were fucking baby blue, orange, and black? THOSE ARE YOUR "STATISTICS" LOL. The Indians are another sport and completely irrelevant to this topic so I'm not sure why you'd bring them up other than to make yourself look stupid. Not to mention they have one of the worst owners in sports that has no ambition for winning games compared to Gilbert who has done everything in his power to win. Fans go to see teams that at least TRY to win, the Indians under Dolan's tenure has not proven to do that. The Browns have been terrible since 99 yet they still seem to fill their stadium for the most part. That's irrelevant too but since you brought up the Indians it's a fair argument under your rules.

Would the Cavs be as popular without LeBron? Probably not. That happens when any superstar leaves a team. It even happened to the almighty Bulls when Jordan left. My point was that LeBron's tenure in Cleveland introduced a new generation of fans (kids and teenagers) to the Cavs and helped make them more passionate fans. If you live in Ohio and you root for the Cavs you are not a bandwagon fan...it makes perfect sense for that to happen. To say they will go to the worst team in the NBA next year is laughable. I can name at least 10 teams that have worse rosters than a LeBron-less Cavs. Fact is that the Cavs would not have won 60+ games in back to back seasons with just LeBron and a bunch of scrubs. He's great but he's not THAT great. We saw it in his first two years where it WAS him and a bunch of scrubs and the Cavs didn't even make the playoffs let alone have the best record in the league.

Ferry did his job which was surrounding the franchise player with pieces capable of winning a championship. They didn't get it done ultimately but they had the ability to. All Ferry can do is put them in a Cavs uni. He doesn't coach them. He doesn't play defense for them. He doesn't shoot shots for them. Compare the roster of his first year to the current roster and it's NIGHT and DAY. Not to mention the success left the Cavs picking at the bottom of the draft every year. Ferry wasn't picking Luke Jackson, Trajan Langdon, and Desagna Diop. He did a good job but not enough to get over the top.

And yes the Cavs do have a GM in Grant. And how the hell do you know how much "power" he has? He's the GM of the team. He's been the co-GM for several years, it's not like he's some random bum off the street. People around the league know him. Gilbert obviously has faith in him or he wouldn't have given him the job.

Cavs fans may still "support" the Cavs, but they won't be going to the games. I'm sure most of Cleveland "supports" the Indians...but they're not going to games, buying merchandise, etc.

Small market teams in baseball can survive due to revenue sharing from TV contracts and such...but in the NBA? No, because they don't have that kind of revenue sharing. The Cavaliers were going to leave Cleveland before LeBron came, which is why David Stern fixed the lottery in the first place.

I can't find it now, but I saw a side by side comparison to the pre Lebron Cavs and the post Lebron Cavs. Attendance was significantly more with Lebron.

And you said, would the Cavs be as popular without Lebron? Probably not.

To answer that question correctly, absolutely not. They are not getting on TV without Lebron, they are not selling the corporate packages, they are not selling out the Q. Those are facts of life without Lebron.

The Indians might not have been the best example, but the Indians were a leader in attendance back at their height, but now no one goes. It proves that there are bandwagon fans in Cleveland who will write off the Cavs without Lebron.

And I don't see 10 rosters worse than the Cavs minus Lebron. Jamison and Mo Williams are your two best players, and then who? It could get really ugly.


If Ferry wanted to keep his job, he should have done whatever he needed to do to bring in Stoudemire and to stay away from Jamison.