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I guess Peyton Manning is no Ben Roethlisberger

Home ▸ Archive ▸ Pro Sports ▸ I guess Peyton Manning is no Ben Roethlisberger
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killer_ewok

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Feb 8, 2010 12:09 PM
Pick6 wrote:
killer_ewok wrote:
trep14 wrote:
rock_knutne wrote: For visual effect and to piss the haters off even more:

ummm...there is a picture out there of Trent Dilfer doing the exact same thing.
But after only one Super Bowl win. ;)

Is there any video of Trent orchestrating a game winning drive and throwing a TD pass late in the game to win the Super Bowl?
No, but there is with Eli Manning. Trent Dilfer and even Sean King actually blew out a team in the super bowl, so he didnt have to.
Eli is better than Trent was. I think Eli is a pretty good QB. It seemed like you were trying to place Ben in the same category as Dilfer and I disagree with that. Sean King? WTF? LOL.

I haven't read through the whole thread but I think most would agree that Peyton Manning is better than Ben. Brady and P. Manning are tops and then you have a group that includes (IMO) Brees, Rivers, Rodgers, Ben and a few others. I think it's ridiculous that some people still talk as if Ben is a game manager. He is above that and I think his play in crunch time and overall has proven that. The whole "he has a great team around him" line is overplayed as well. Sure, Ben has some key players on his team. The same thing could be said for pretty much all successful QB's. It's like they are saying that Manning, Brady and some other all-time greats like Montana did it mostly on their own. I disagree with that big time.

Did Ben suck in Super Bowl XL? Yep. Does that team make it there without him? NO. And I think he played pretty well in Super Bowl 43. He came up big in crunch time on the biggest stage in sports. "Game managers" don't do that.

To recap.....I know that Ben isn't as good as Brady, P. Manning and maybe a couple others......but I honestly think that he's underappreciated to an extent outside of Steeler fans. JMO.
Feb 8, 2010 12:09pm
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killer_ewok

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Feb 8, 2010 12:12 PM
buckeyes_woowee wrote: WOW I can not believe how ignorant you Steeler fans are. You really think that because someone is a Browns fan they can't be critical of any player in the league? I'm pretty sure you fucks are the only ones stupid enough to think Ben is better then Peyton.

I have a question for those who see the Steelers in the Superbowl next year......What makes you think this? Is it hope? Is it being a homer? They are on the decline folks!
Yeah, because we're ALL saying that. :rolleyes:

Anyways, I do think that the Steelers have a pretty good shot to go to the Super Bowl next season. Why not? They have the pieces in place and they've been there before. As automatik said, barring major injuries......they're in the discussion.

I mean.....the Browns finally beat the Steelers this past season so anything is possible. ;)
Feb 8, 2010 12:12pm
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buckeyes_woowee

Senior Member

512 posts
Feb 8, 2010 12:41 PM
This whole thread is about Ben being better then Peyton and take a look at the Super bowl prediction thread....pretty sure about half the picks has the Steelers and pretty sure its all Steeler fans
Feb 8, 2010 12:41pm
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DeyDurkie5

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11,324 posts
Feb 8, 2010 12:49 PM
enigmaax wrote: Shaub is consistently in the league lead for passing yards and touchdowns? Because one year is consistency?

Shaub had a better statistical season than Roethlisberger in 08, but BR won a Super Bowl. BR had better stats in 07 and here's a few things about this season:

Roethlisberger = more yards per pass, more TDs per pass, less INTs per pass, better TD-Int ratio, higher pass efficiency rating
I already admitted I was wrong in that sense artard...
Feb 8, 2010 12:49pm
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DeyDurkie5

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Feb 8, 2010 12:52 PM
Automatik wrote: Who said Ben was better than Peyton?

I discredit the majority of Browns fans because they get their jollies off of ragging on Pittsburgh. Its like clockwork.

Pittsburgh could very well make a deep run in the playoffs next year. Their defense was the main cause for their average season last year. Do you honestly think they will repeat that season performance next year? Smith and Polamalu will both be back. With a nice draft and barring any injuries I definitely think Pittsburgh has a shot. They have the pieces in place to win another Super Bowl.....hell I'm sure even some Cleveland fans can recognize that.

Also, how is Pittsburgh on the decline? I'd love to hear this.
Just because I'm a browns fan doesn't mean I'm blind to what the Steelers have accomplished. They are a good football team, but IMO not a team that is capable of making it to the super bowl. Playoffs without a doubt, but I just don't see them making the super bowl next year. The reason is because the Colts, Chargers, and Patriots are more likely to go simple as that.
Feb 8, 2010 12:52pm
A

Al Capone

18-3 since 2000

1,727 posts
Feb 8, 2010 1:00 PM
Durkie. Your hatred of the Steelers reek with the smell of jealousy.
Feb 8, 2010 1:00pm
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killer_ewok

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Feb 8, 2010 1:01 PM
buckeyes_woowee wrote: This whole thread is about Ben being better then Peyton and take a look at the Super bowl prediction thread....pretty sure about half the picks has the Steelers and pretty sure its all Steeler fans
And not ALL of us who posted on this thread are arguing that.

And what is the problem with Steeler fans predicting that they go to the Super Bowl next season? They have a legit shot and the pieces are in place and many of these guys have been there and done that (twice in the last 5 years). Why is that so far fetched? I mean, I remember a lot of OSU fans predicting them to go to the BCS title game next season. So what? They have a legit shot so I don't have a problem with that. So I guess you should basically accuse them of being nothing more than blind homers as well.
DeyDurkie5 wrote:

Automatik wrote: Who said Ben was better than Peyton?

I discredit the majority of Browns fans because they get their jollies off of ragging on Pittsburgh. Its like clockwork.

Pittsburgh could very well make a deep run in the playoffs next year. Their defense was the main cause for their average season last year. Do you honestly think they will repeat that season performance next year? Smith and Polamalu will both be back. With a nice draft and barring any injuries I definitely think Pittsburgh has a shot. They have the pieces in place to win another Super Bowl.....hell I'm sure even some Cleveland fans can recognize that.

Also, how is Pittsburgh on the decline? I'd love to hear this.
Just because I'm a browns fan doesn't mean I'm blind to what the Steelers have accomplished. They are a good football team, but IMO not a team that is capable of making it to the super bowl. Playoffs without a doubt, but I just don't see them making the super bowl next year. The reason is because the Colts, Chargers, and Patriots are more likely to go simple as that.
Those teams all have great chances to get there and I'd throw the Steelers in that group as well. I stated why above. You have your opinion, I have mine.....and it's all good.

According to the MGM Mirage.......Indy is a 5-1 favorite to win it all next season and Pittsburgh is right behind them with 7-1 odds.
Feb 8, 2010 1:01pm
R

rock_knutne

Feb 8, 2010 1:04 PM
DeyDurkie5 wrote:Just because I'm a browns fan doesn't mean I'm blind to what the Steelers have accomplished. They are a good football team, but IMO not a team that is capable of making it to the super bowl. Playoffs without a doubt, but I just don't see them making the super bowl next year. The reason is because the Colts, Chargers, and Patriots are more likely to go simple as that.

Please elaborate, your reason makes no sense what so ever, especially seeing as the Steelers have defeated all those teams multiple times. Plus they beat both the Chargers and Colts in the playoffs, pretty handily if I might add. How one can say that the Steelers can't make it back to the Super Bowl with a team loaded with Super Bowl winners is baffling.
Feb 8, 2010 1:04pm
R

rock_knutne

Feb 8, 2010 1:06 PM
killer_ewok wrote: I mean, I remember a lot of OSU fans predicting them to go to the BCS title game next season. So what? They have a legit shot so I don't have a problem with that. So I guess you should basically accuse them of being nothing more than blind homers as well.
ewok, surely you know the rules and double standards when it comes to OSU on here.
Feb 8, 2010 1:06pm
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DeyDurkie5

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Feb 8, 2010 1:10 PM
Al Capone wrote: Durkie. Your hatred of the Steelers reek with the smell of jealousy.
I am not jealous of the steelers one bit...I'm proud I'm a browns fan and will be one till I die. I'll gladly make a bet with you capone on the steelers next year if you want
killer_ewok wrote:
buckeyes_woowee wrote: This whole thread is about Ben being better then Peyton and take a look at the Super bowl prediction thread....pretty sure about half the picks has the Steelers and pretty sure its all Steeler fans
And not ALL of us who posted on this thread are arguing that.

And what is the problem with Steeler fans predicting that they go to the Super Bowl next season? They have a legit shot and the pieces are in place and many of these guys have been there and done that (twice in the last 5 years). Why is that so far fetched? I mean, I remember a lot of OSU fans predicting them to go to the BCS title game next season. So what? They have a legit shot so I don't have a problem with that. So I guess you should basically accuse them of being nothing more than blind homers as well.
DeyDurkie5 wrote:

Automatik wrote: Who said Ben was better than Peyton?

I discredit the majority of Browns fans because they get their jollies off of ragging on Pittsburgh. Its like clockwork.

Pittsburgh could very well make a deep run in the playoffs next year. Their defense was the main cause for their average season last year. Do you honestly think they will repeat that season performance next year? Smith and Polamalu will both be back. With a nice draft and barring any injuries I definitely think Pittsburgh has a shot. They have the pieces in place to win another Super Bowl.....hell I'm sure even some Cleveland fans can recognize that.

Also, how is Pittsburgh on the decline? I'd love to hear this.
Just because I'm a browns fan doesn't mean I'm blind to what the Steelers have accomplished. They are a good football team, but IMO not a team that is capable of making it to the super bowl. Playoffs without a doubt, but I just don't see them making the super bowl next year. The reason is because the Colts, Chargers, and Patriots are more likely to go simple as that.
Those teams all have great chances to get there and I'd throw the Steelers in that group as well. I stated why above. You have your opinion, I have mine.....and it's all good.

According to the MGM Mirage.......Indy is a 5-1 favorite to win it all next season and Pittsburgh is right behind them with 7-1 odds.
I agree they are definately in that group, as I said they will definately be in the playoffs...But I just don't see them beating any of those teams in the playoffs when it comes down to it and that is just my opinion.
rock_knutne wrote:
DeyDurkie5 wrote:Just because I'm a browns fan doesn't mean I'm blind to what the Steelers have accomplished. They are a good football team, but IMO not a team that is capable of making it to the super bowl. Playoffs without a doubt, but I just don't see them making the super bowl next year. The reason is because the Colts, Chargers, and Patriots are more likely to go simple as that.

Please elaborate, your reason makes no sense what so ever, especially seeing as the Steelers have defeated all those teams multiple times. Plus they beat both the Chargers and Colts in the playoffs, pretty handily if I might add. How one can say that the Steelers can't make it back to the Super Bowl with a team loaded with Super Bowl winners is baffling.
Yeah they did 2-4 years ago. Like I said, they are going to be a playoff team and will definitely be in the playoffs, but when it comes down to it I just don't see them beating any of those teams next year. You can lambast me all you want but that is just my personal opinion on the matter. Don't get all worked up because one person thinks the steelers won't be in the super bowl.
Feb 8, 2010 1:10pm
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Al Capone

18-3 since 2000

1,727 posts
Feb 8, 2010 1:17 PM
What's the bet on? How about the Steelers having twice the wins that the Browns have.
Feb 8, 2010 1:17pm
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DeyDurkie5

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Feb 8, 2010 1:18 PM
Al Capone wrote: What's the bet on? How about the Steelers having twice the wins that the Browns have.
No, Steelers winning the super bowl or hell even making it
Feb 8, 2010 1:18pm
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rock_knutne

Feb 8, 2010 1:19 PM
DeyDurkie5 wrote:Yeah they did 2-4 years ago. Like I said, they are going to be a playoff team and will definitely be in the playoffs, but when it comes down to it I just don't see them beating any of those teams next year. You can lambast me all you want but that is just my personal opinion on the matter. Don't get all worked up because one person thinks the steelers won't be in the super bowl.
No, I'm not worked up at all, I just think you're opinion is way off base because of the teams you mentioned, only one of them has won more Super Bowls in the last ten years than Pittsburgh, while one of them hasn't even made it to the game let alone win one.
Feb 8, 2010 1:19pm
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Al Capone

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Feb 8, 2010 1:23 PM
I didn't think you would want anything to do with the Browns winning anything.
Feb 8, 2010 1:23pm
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Heretic

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Feb 8, 2010 1:48 PM
With the Steelers next year, the main key is health...particularly with certain defensive players (Polamalu, Aaron Smith) who are starting to develop a real reputation for being frail. Without Polamalu, the entire secondary is exposed. Without Smith, the key ingredient for their run-stopping success is gone. It seemed like for a good portion of the season, their defense folded in clutch situation and a lot of their wins seemed to come from the offense putting up more points in a shootout (which isn't Steeler football).

A secondary key would be vastly improved special teams play. By the middle of the year, I was finding myself tucking into the fetal position and closing my eyes every single time they either kicked off or punted the ball.

If they can do those things, they have as good of a shot as anyone to win things. Ben's shown he can carry a team. If Arians can implement a better rushing attack, that will help, too, as I think part of the defensive struggles could be attributed to the offense going from a ball control unit to a more quick-strike one...but since we're talking Arians, I'm not counting on that.
Feb 8, 2010 1:48pm
G

gut

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Feb 8, 2010 1:51 PM
GOONx19 wrote: Big Ben's missed the playoffs more times in the last four years than Peyton has in the last eleven. That's what really matters.
And yet Ben has two rings and Peyton has one. Going to the playoffs more and not sealing the deal just means a couple of extra games.

And if Ben goes to the playoffs 8 more times and manages just 1 win, he will have equaled Peyton to-date, but with one more ring. That's what really matters.
Feb 8, 2010 1:51pm
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gut

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Feb 8, 2010 1:57 PM
LTrain23 wrote:
Non wrote: I think another poster hit the nail on the head. Big Ben has missed the playoffs more times in these last 4 years than Peyton has in the last 11.
I didn't know one-and-done in the playoffs was such a great accomplishment.

They've both missed the playoffs twice in their career, granted one was Peyton's rookie year but one for Ben was after going thru a windshield. Ben is entering his prime and you don't know if he won't reel off 6 straight trips to match the number of playoff appearances Peyton has to-date.
Feb 8, 2010 1:57pm
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DeyDurkie5

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Feb 8, 2010 2:03 PM
rock_knutne wrote:
DeyDurkie5 wrote:Yeah they did 2-4 years ago. Like I said, they are going to be a playoff team and will definitely be in the playoffs, but when it comes down to it I just don't see them beating any of those teams next year. You can lambast me all you want but that is just my personal opinion on the matter. Don't get all worked up because one person thinks the steelers won't be in the super bowl.
No, I'm not worked up at all, I just think you're opinion is way off base because of the teams you mentioned, only one of them has won more Super Bowls in the last ten years than Pittsburgh, while one of them hasn't even made it to the game let alone win one.
Yeah, and previous years don't matter you dipshit...Notre Dame won a lot of championships back in the 40's and 50's so does that mean they are goign to win it next year? NO The Saints never won a super bowl so that means they shouldn't have won last night, you have a flawed sense of what it means to predict things...I think those teams I mentioned are going to be just as good if not better than the steelers. and if the steelers do make the playoffs, which I believe they WILL, then I don't see them losing to the steelers.
Feb 8, 2010 2:03pm
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DeyDurkie5

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Feb 8, 2010 2:04 PM
Al Capone wrote: I didn't think you would want anything to do with the Browns winning anything.
Yeah I know I don't because it would be a dumb bet lol, and you don't want anything to do with the steelers winning/making it to the super bowl because it is also a dumb bet.
Feb 8, 2010 2:04pm
R

rock_knutne

Feb 8, 2010 2:14 PM
DeyDurkie5 wrote: Yeah, and previous years don't matter you dipshit...Notre Dame won a lot of championships back in the 40's and 50's so does that mean they are goign to win it next year? NO The Saints never won a super bowl so that means they shouldn't have won last night, you have a flawed sense of what it means to predict things...I think those teams I mentioned are going to be just as good if not better than the steelers. and if the steelers do make the playoffs, which I believe they WILL, then I don't see them losing to the steelers.

Who's the dip shit here? The teams you selected to have a better chance at making the Super Bowl ahead of Pittsburgh have a lot of the same players who have been with said team for a long time. Your argument makes NO sense what so ever. Why wouldn't the Steelers have just as much a chance as the teams you mentioned when they ALSO have many players who have WON two Super Bowls on their roster.

BTW, nice ND reference again, you have no argument so you bring ND in to the mix thinking it may tick me off. I wouldn't expect anything less from someone who has the brain capacity of a worm. I'm sure that at some point and time you will reference a teams prior accomplsihment and hang your hat on it, it's the nature of your game.
Feb 8, 2010 2:14pm
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DeyDurkie5

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Feb 8, 2010 2:17 PM
rock_knutne wrote:
DeyDurkie5 wrote: Yeah, and previous years don't matter you dipshit...Notre Dame won a lot of championships back in the 40's and 50's so does that mean they are goign to win it next year? NO The Saints never won a super bowl so that means they shouldn't have won last night, you have a flawed sense of what it means to predict things...I think those teams I mentioned are going to be just as good if not better than the steelers. and if the steelers do make the playoffs, which I believe they WILL, then I don't see them losing to the steelers.

Who's the dip shit here? The teams you selected to have a better chance at making the Super Bowl ahead of Pittsburgh have a lot of the same players who have been with said team for a long time. Your argument makes NO sense what so ever. Why wouldn't the Steelers have just as much a chance as the teams you mentioned when they ALSO have many players who have WON two Super Bowls on their roster.

BTW, nice ND reference again, you have no argument so you bring ND in to the mix thinking it may tick me off. I wouldn't expect anything less from someone who has the barin capacity of a worm.
I have admitted that the Steelers have a chance and WILL BE IN THE PLAYOFFS....but IN MY FUCKING OPINION won't beat the teams I listed because I see them being better than the Steelers next year. It's not a hard concept to understand and doesn't have anything to do with logic or super bowl rings. I think the steelrs will be good, but won't make it to the super bowl....Mark it down and when it happens you can kiss my ass and pay me 1,000,000 dollars for being a hard-headed dumbass steelers fan who can't have an intelligent conversation because it doesn't involved licking the steelers nutsack
Feb 8, 2010 2:17pm
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killer_ewok

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Feb 8, 2010 2:26 PM
DeyDurkie5 wrote:
rock_knutne wrote:
DeyDurkie5 wrote:Yeah they did 2-4 years ago. Like I said, they are going to be a playoff team and will definitely be in the playoffs, but when it comes down to it I just don't see them beating any of those teams next year. You can lambast me all you want but that is just my personal opinion on the matter. Don't get all worked up because one person thinks the steelers won't be in the super bowl.
No, I'm not worked up at all, I just think you're opinion is way off base because of the teams you mentioned, only one of them has won more Super Bowls in the last ten years than Pittsburgh, while one of them hasn't even made it to the game let alone win one.
Yeah, and previous years don't matter you dipshit...Notre Dame won a lot of championships back in the 40's and 50's so does that mean they are goign to win it next year? NO The Saints never won a super bowl so that means they shouldn't have won last night, you have a flawed sense of what it means to predict things...I think those teams I mentioned are going to be just as good if not better than the steelers. and if the steelers do make the playoffs, which I believe they WILL, then I don't see them losing to the steelers.
You're entitled to your opinion so I'm not debating what you think about them but the ND 40's and 50's logic is flawed. A Steelers fan saying that the Steelers have players who are currently on the team that have played in and won 1 or 2 Super Bowls is relevant to the discussion. I think that it's reasonable to bring that up in this debate. ND winning a bunch of titles back in the 40's and 50's has very little to do with how successful they will be now as that was decades ago. Not nearly the same as some of us citing the Steelers still having players on their roster who not only know what it takes to get to the Super Bowl....but what it takes to win one or two. It's an extreme and unreasonable point that you were attempting to make there. I award you no points and may God have mercy on your soul. ;)
Feb 8, 2010 2:26pm
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Pick6

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14,946 posts
Feb 8, 2010 2:27 PM
OK Brad Johnson, not Sean King that won the Super Bowl for the Buccaneers. But it proves my point that just because you win a super bowl, does not mean your qb is great. And yes, i think Ben is better than Johnson and Dilfer.
Feb 8, 2010 2:27pm
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rock_knutne

Feb 8, 2010 2:28 PM
DeyDurkie5 wrote:I have admitted that the Steelers have a chance and WILL BE IN THE PLAYOFFS....but IN MY FUCKING OPINION won't beat the teams I listed because I see them being better than the Steelers next year. It's not a hard concept to understand and doesn't have anything to do with logic or super bowl rings. I think the steelrs will be good, but won't make it to the super bowl....Mark it down and when it happens you can kiss my ass and pay me 1,000,000 dollars for being a hard-headed dumbass steelers fan who can't have an intelligent conversation because it doesn't involved licking the steelers nutsack
You're a flip flopper now too:
DeyDurkie5 wrote:Just because I'm a browns fan doesn't mean I'm blind to what the Steelers have accomplished. They are a good football team, but IMO not a team that is capable of making it to the super bowl. Playoffs without a doubt, but I just don't see them making the super bowl next year. The reason is because the Colts, Chargers, and Patriots are more likely to go simple as that.
Make up your mind, you're starting to contradict yourself. BTW, I can clearly see that your opinion has zero logic to it, no need to remind me.
Feb 8, 2010 2:28pm
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killer_ewok

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Feb 8, 2010 2:30 PM
Pick6 wrote: OK Brad Johnson, not Sean King that won the Super Bowl for the Buccaneers. But it proves my point that just because you win a super bowl, does not mean your qb is great. And yes, i think Ben is better than Johnson and Dilfer.
And just because a QB plays like shit in one of the Super Bowls that he made it to doesn't mean that he's not great/very good either. Just because he has a good supporting cast doesn't take away from him either IMO. It's not like Montana, Aikman, etc. were playing with bums. I'm not saying he's in their category but just making that point.
Feb 8, 2010 2:30pm