Husted's biggest argument for not having ID (at least in the article I saw today) was: what happens if you lose your ID the day of voting?

Then he goes on to say it's easier for people to come up with a utility bill and argues that people aren't going to just go out and turn on utilities so they can vote.

No, but they might STEAL a bill quite easily from someone's trash and use it to vote fraudulently.

I would say it is far, far more likely that someone steals a utility bill than it is that someone just happens to lose ALL their photo IDs on election day.

There is NO LOGICAL REASON for not tightening the integrity of the system of a most basic right -- that of voting.

Writerbuckeye;736134 wrote:Husted's biggest argument for not having ID (at least in the article I saw today) was: what happens if you lose your ID the day of voting?

Then he goes on to say it's easier for people to come up with a utility bill and argues that people aren't going to just go out and turn on utilities so they can vote.

No, but they might STEAL a bill quite easily from someone's trash and use it to vote fraudulently.

I would say it is far, far more likely that someone steals a utility bill than it is that someone just happens to lose ALL their photo IDs on election day.

There is NO LOGICAL REASON for not tightening the integrity of the system of a most basic right -- that of voting.

u think its far, far more likely that i could time the day you throw your utility bill in the trash and dig through your trash all for one vote, than if i lose my drivers license on the day of the election? im not really for or against this bill as i dont think it matters either way but that makes no sense

Bigdogg;736097 wrote:http://election2010.illumen.org/latest-news/husted-opposes-photo-id-mandate

Now I rest my case.

You rest your case that someone shares your opinion. Congratulations?

Gblock;736138 wrote:u think its far, far more likely that i could time the day you throw your utility bill in the trash and dig through your trash all for one vote, than if i lose my drivers license on the day of the election? im not really for or against this bill as i dont think it matters either way but that makes no sense

Maybe not dig in my trash for one vote, but if I'm an unscrupulous local candidate running for office, I might pay several people $20 per vote they cast. In my area, I PROMISE you there would be people digging through all the trashcans on the street the night before trash day.

Honestly, the best argument I've heard against this is from the Amish community, many of whom claim they have no driver's license or state ID for religious purposes. However, I agree that it is far more likely for someone unscrupulously trying to sway the vote to get a hold of a bank statement or utility bill from someone's trash than it is for me to lose my state ID on that particular day.

We need a statistician with some free time here.

and i thought i was the conspiracy theorist on here! lol...but seriously that wouldnt be a cost effective crime for 20 dollars. first the time involved to find the utility bills and the luck involved along with how disgusting it would be. second you would have to travel around to different areas to get the bills so that you didnt have to go back to the same polling center. gas is 3.85 a gallon. i mean how many votes could you cast? and then you have to travel to how many polling centers.. and is it enough to make a difference in any election? idk but i would think you would be better off stealing utility bills from the electric company or bribing someone to print you duplicate copies. this way you could get many many bills and save on gas...but someone stealing utility bills and voting i would say is rare imo

Gblock;736152 wrote:first the time involved to find the utility bills

If you're unemployed, making $0/hr ... the time isn't an issue. Tax-free, short-term hustles are often more difficult than a normal 9-5, but for some reason, people seem to go after them in droves around me.

Gblock;736152 wrote:and the luck involved

Chances * time = success.

Gblock;736152 wrote:along with how disgusting it would be.

This would be enough to stop me, and apparently you as well. However, not everyone cares about this as much, because many people live in conditions similar to my trash can. Hell, one of my neighbors put out a rug that reeked of dog piss by their trash, and you could smell it from 20 feet away. However, a car actually stopped in front of their house, and the driver got out, looked at the rug, and put it on the laps of whoever was in the back seat (I couldn't tell who they were or how old but there were three people in the back seat. Watched it happen, and I was dumbfounded.

Point is, that doesn't bother some as much as others. It's kinda humbling to watch someone who is apparently so desperate for a rug that they don't notice, or don't mind, the overpowering stench of stale dog urine that has soaked clean through it (there were big yellow-brown stains all over the back of the rug).

Gblock;736152 wrote:second you would have to travel around to different areas to get the bills so that you didnt have to go back to the same polling center. gas is 3.85 a gallon. i mean how many votes could you cast? and then you have to travel to how many polling centers..

Not necessarily. Again, if you're homeless, then you've got no place to go. You've got the day. Start in the morning, and just dress and look different every time you show up. Maybe lose some facial hair or even head hair with a pair of buzz clippers. The people at the polls see too many people every day to try to pick out the same guy eight different times, when a total of 500 votes go through that day at that voting location.

Gblock;736152 wrote:and is it enough to make a difference in any election? idk

Done once? Possibly, but not likely. However, if you can find two people to vote 10 times or more at each of several voting locations, then I'd say it could, depending on the size of the election.

Gblock;736152 wrote:but i would think you would be better off stealing utility bills from the electric company or bribing someone to print you duplicate copies. this way you could get many many bills and save on gas...but someone stealing utility bills and voting i would say is rare imo

I agree that it would be rare. However, it's not difficult to play on someone's desperation. If I was to promise 10 unemployed people in my neighborhood $20 per vote, and they averaged 6 votes, that could add up for such a small area. Some may say no, but desperation is a powerful thing, and $120 in a day is a lot of money to some people.

You could very well be right about bribing the right person at the power company or something like that, but you're dealing with employees at that level, so the desperation may not be there like you'd want it to be elsewhere, meaning their ethics might be more difficult to overcome.

Either way, though, would be negated by utility bills and bank statements not being deemed viable for identity.

The kind of fraud I'm describing might not be likely, but under the current set-up, it's possible, and it wouldn't be that difficult, and that's enough to make me uneasy. I'm not saying it's happening. I'm saying it could, and it would be far too easy for my comfort.

LJ;736141 wrote:You rest your case that someone shares your opinion. Congratulations?

Well thank you. When the Secretary of State, who is also responsible for overseeing elections in the State of Ohio, agrees with me then I think I made my point. You too much of a Tard to post anything better then that? By the way, its not just Husted who shares my opinion you tard.Take a look at the co-sponsors.

Democrats who are sponsoring a bill to make it easier to bring busloads of homeless people to vote for Democrats is not quite compelling "evidence" to me that the bill is wrong. Democrats are always looking for ways to make it easier to bring in people who have never voted, and get them to vote for Democrats.

Don't say I'm wrong, because it happened during the election of Obama in Ohio. There were reports in Columbus and Cleveland, and one news crew had video of a woman who brought a busload of people (this was Columbus) and told the camera they were instructed to vote for Obama. There were even questions of residency raised from this -- issues that wouldn't exist if an ID is required.

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,433681,00.html

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,436022,00.html

fish82;723433 wrote:You have my initials backwards, tard. If you're still intent on revealing my identity, at least get it right. :rolleyes:

Yet this was OK? Nice LJ, you lose an argument and you retaliate by giving me an infraction for calling you the same thing I was called by another idiot on here and sent you a visitor message about. I specifically asked if this was name calling. Then you erase the evidence from your visitor message center. What a hypocrite!!

I can dish out what ever you 888888888888 throw my way.

Well thank you. When the Secretary of State, who is also responsible for overseeing elections in the State of Ohio, agrees with me then I think I made my point. You too much of to post anything better then that? By the way, its not just Husted who shares my opinion you .Take a look at the co-sponsors.

Bigdogg;736238 wrote:Yet this was OK? Nice LJ, you lose an argument and you retaliate by giving me an infraction for calling you the same thing I was called by another idiot on here and sent you a visitor message about. I specifically asked if this was name calling. Then you erase the evidence from your visitor message center. What a hypocrite!!

I can dish out what ever you 888888888888 throw my way.

You break the rules you get an infraction.

BTW, I didn't know we were having an "argument" nor did I know there was a "winner"?

Also, I erase all messages off of there.

Bigdogg;736238 wrote:Yet this was OK? Nice LJ, you lose an argument and you retaliate by giving me an infraction for calling you the same thing I was called by another idiot on here and sent you a visitor message about. I specifically asked if this was name calling. Then you erase the evidence from your visitor message center. What a hypocrite!!

I can dish out what ever you 888888888888 throw my way.

And yet you ran and tattled to the mod because someone called you a name. Yeah, you ooze machismo. :rolleyes:

Bigdogg;736243 wrote:Well thank you. When the Secretary of State, who is also responsible for overseeing elections in the State of Ohio, agrees with me then I think I made my point. You too much of to post anything better then that? By the way, its not just Husted who shares my opinion you .Take a look at the co-sponsors.

Husted was only half right. Sure, people are not registering for false utilities in order to commit fraud. But I could take the gas bill of a family member who I knew was not going to vote, go to their precinct, and since the name and address match the roll I can vote.

Bigdogg;736243 wrote:Well thank you. When the Secretary of State, who is also responsible for overseeing elections in the State of Ohio, agrees with me then I think I made my point.

Yes, you agree with a man who has been overseeing a broken, easily vulnerable system. Congratulations.

Bigdogg;736243 wrote:You too much of to post anything better then that? By the way, its not just Husted who shares my opinion you .Take a look at the co-sponsors.

I explained in several of my previous posts why neither a bank statement, nor a utility bill, mean I am who I say I am.

Next time I go get my license or tags renewed, I'm just bringing in a bank statement. Or hell, if I want to sign up for a credit card, I'll just bring in a utility bill. They're just as effective, after all, right?

[video=youtube;REElUors1pQ][/video]

fish82;736283 wrote:And yet you ran and tattled to the mod because someone called you a name. Yeah, you ooze machismo. :rolleyes:

[video=youtube;REElUors1pQ][/video]

fish82;736283 wrote:And yet you ran and tattled to the mod because someone called you a name. Yeah, you ooze machismo. :rolleyes:

Personally, I find the word you used offensive, but to be expected from someone like you. What I find funny was when I asked LJ if it was acceptable he was fine with it. Then I used it on him and he sends me two of his arbitrary rules violations because he POed about Husted and the rest of the Republicans rolling over on photo ID. Now sure why he has such a hard on about this topic, who cares anyway.

"Now sure why he has such a hard on about this topic, who cares anyway. "

Being originaly from Ohio, I care. How stupid is it to NOT require proof of ID? It begs for voter fraud - hell if people aren't committing voter fraud they aren't trying.

8 pages of discussion and I've yet to hear one rational reason why this is burdensome...especially if the state can issue an ID for free.

Bigdogg;736645 wrote:[video=youtube;REElUors1pQ][/video]

A Tattletale AND an ABBA fan? Yikes.