I know it's long, but my UM buddy sent me an email asking what my thoughts are/were, and I feel I put a LOT of thought, and made some great points, so I felt I would share it here with the Chatter. So here it goes...








I really think Pryor's gone, and I almost have to say good riddance. I feel terrible saying it, because a lot of OSU fans are throwing him under the bus, and he has done well for us in the past, but it's simply time; time to move on. If he's out 5 games next season, he stands ZERO chance of winning the Heisman (not that he has that good of a chance anyhow), an OSU likely ends their consecutive BCS bowl streak. Now you have a sub-par QB who was probably projected as a 3rd Rd QB AT BEST, more likely a late 4th Rd QB; and now you're tossing into the mix character issues and a dispelled senior season that so many scouts were highly anticipating. I would not be surprised to see him fall all the way to the late 4th / 5th rd this year. Plus, with everyone so worried about a potential lock out (... let me state for the record that I think there is about a 5% chance the League actually locks out), now you have to think this kid could REALLY get screwed over (if he misses his senior season AND doesn't even get to play (i.e., practice) in the NFL). The problem with Pryor is that he is SO egotistical that this kid probably thinks in his own mind that he IS actually a 1st Rd pick. Will he get drafted for certain? Yes. There is simply too much "potential" (something you and I know damn well the NFL salivates over) with Pryor. However, I think he gets drafted late (i.e., like I said, 4th / 5th Rd) and I think he has probably a shorter career than Tim Tebow (god I can't believe I said that).

Herron is the interesting one. Apparently Tressel has admitted that 1 of the guys in question filled out the paperwork already for the NFL, but he wouldn't say who. My bet is that it was Herron. His stock was probably at the highest it was ever going to be this past season, and yes it wasn't that high. Reason being, there are simply too many ponies in the stable - Jordan Hall, Jamaal Berry, Rod Smith, and Carlos Hyde. Plus, Tressel is notorious for tossing his guys into the doghouse and locking the door. I think this would be the case with / for Herron. I think Herron for sure jumps to the League because of this. And from everything I have ever read / heard, Herron is probably the nicest kid out of this bunch and the very "gentleman like" / humble. Seeing his name involved in this situation was a complete shock. I think the only guys I would have been more surprised would have been Dane Sanz', Tyler Moeller, Brandon Saine, and Ross Homan. So in conclusion, I think Herron is gone and I think he's drafted in the last couple Rds, if drafted at all. Tough break for this young man.

Posey. Everyone is lambasting this kid and saying "what a disappointment." I disagree here. I WANT to say what a disappointment, but really, the kid has been one of our best wide receivers. I know Sanz' had more yards and bigger plays, but I think a lot of that has to do with that fact that Posey was demanding over-the-top coverage. I think this kid would have been a great one if he actually had a quarterback who could get him the damn ball. I could see Posey going as high as the 3rd Rd and as low as the 4th Rd - with the odds more on going in the 3rd. So with that being said, I think he tests the waters and decides to leave early. I believe he would be the first Buckeye taken out of this bunch.

Adams. THIS guy has been a disappointment. He was suppose to be the next "what-Alex-Boone-was-suppose-to-be." ALL the size in the world (ala the Boone comparison), and no heart / determination to back it up. And from what I hear, he is about as dense as Alex was. With that lambasting being said, Adams was probably the guy coming on the most / showing the most signs of improvement. I was really looking forward to this guy's senior year. I COULD see him coming back, because I think his draft status as it is of now is probably 'late Rds to if-at-all,' therefore I think he could actually come back, play in a few games, and move himself up to a 4th Rd pick next season. I'd put his odds at about 55% he returns.

Solomon Thomas might actually be the one that hurts the most. Yes he's NOT a starter (this season), but he was LIKELY going to start next season - and with everything we are losing on defense, we are really going to need his presence (with our other DE Nathan Williams). Solomon Thomas will return for sure (unless he decides to transfer down a division - which I don't think is TOO likely) because if he leaves I can guarantee you he will not be drafted. So he will miss five games and then likely sub-in the 6th game, and probably start somewhere around the 7th-8th game of the season (assuming no one breaks out of nowhere like Thaddeus Gibson a couple years ago).

All in all... here's the breakdown...

Who replaces Pryor? Is it Kenny Guiton or do we throw a true freshman into the fire in Braxton Miller. My money is on Tressel sticking with Guiton. Tressel is so loyal to his upper classmen (at times I almost want to scream blindly loyal), but I'm beginning to see the reason why - it's so you don't have situations like THIS down the Rd. The biggest mistake Tressel made was starting Pryor in game 3 of his Frosh yr. The kid came in thinking he was the shit and he clearly is not. He's been starting since his freshman year and he now has the arrogance that he is OWED things. You aren't owed sh!t Pryor. You have to EARN it. And THAT is why Tressel is so loyal to his seniors (upper classmen). I think Guiton is a VERY solid QB, but my preference would be Miller. I know this goes against everything I JUST got done saying, but honestly, their first 2 games are against Akron and Toledo (games OSU should win no matter who's playing QB). I think these would be solid prep' games for Miami (week 3) - so they lose, okay... 1 loss - then you have Colorado (a very solid win that could be easy), and then MSU. Let's take the worst case scenario and say they lose to MSU (even though I think this is likely a highly winnable game since it's AT OSU), now the team is down 2 wins but at least their QB of the future has some SOLID experience and playing time heading into the Nebraska game. It's clear Miller is the future. Might as well get him the experience now. (I'd be perfectly fine, however, with Guiton starting tho because I think he will do perfectly fine; I just don't see him beating Nebraska and I think Miami is a toss-up if he plays).

RB we will be fine at. If Rod Smith is HALF as good as people are talking him up to be (as of late), he will be CLOSE to Chris Wells-ish - think running style without the whiny injuries every game; maybe not quite the numbers tho. Plus, I've been VERY impressed with Jordan Hall. I think he enters the season as the starter - and for good reason.

WR is going to hurt - seeing as how there is a lack of experience / proven playmaker there - but I think we will be alright. With breaking in a new QB (whether it's Kenny or Braxton), we won't be passing that much, therefore having a big playmaker WR isn't as important (I don't think). Corey Brown will be that bigtime playmaker tho I think. Also, I'm VERY excited to see James Louis - the speedster from Florida. Word is he's a clone of Santonio Holmes (ironic, because they're both from Florida). Also expect Chris Fields to make some solid contributions. And I wonder what Duron Carter is up to these days (insert smerk face)... He could end up coming back as well.

LT will likely be filled my Marcus Hall. He was out this season (due to grades I think), but I think he has the inside track to the position. The bigger question here will be who fills the void of Justin Boren and Bryant Browning (although filling Browning's shoes won't be hard at all seeming how terrible he was).

And again... I think you could make a legitimate argument that the biggest loss / setback out of this whole situation is Solomon Thomas. As for filling Thomas' spot, it will likely be Goebel (will-be-junior) or Darryl Baldwin (will-be-Sophomore). I'd rather see Baldwin get the nod. This is a big-time hurt considering all that we are losing on defense - DT Larimore (although he will be nicely replaced by Jonathan Hankins), DE Heyward, WLB Homan, MLB Rolle, CB Chekwa, FS Hines, and CB Torrence (who I think will be nicely replaced by Travis Howard).

As for the schedule...

Akron Win
Toledo Win
@ Miami Toss-up
Colorado Win
MSU Toss-up
@ Nebraska Loss
@ Illinois Win
bye
Wisconsin Win
Indiana Win
@ Purdue Win
Penn State Win
@ Michigan Toss-up

At best I see us going 10 - 2 and at worst I see us going 8 - 4. Couldn't be more perfect time for a Big Ten title game than this season. I'll leave you with those thoughts

Literally almost the exact conversation I had with my dad, so kudos on feeling the same way I do.

The only thing I disagree with is that I think Mike Adams was a beast this year and was easily the 2nd best LT in the league next to Carimi. Did it take him "too long" to develop? It's arguable, but dude's only a junior.

I see the same 10-2, 8-4. Agree on the analysis too. It won't be like 2004, but at times it may feel like it.

Throw Braxton Miller in there and go with it. The kid is a stud. Guiton is NOT the future. Some even say that Graham is better then Guiton right now. Everyone else is replacable with talented guys waiting to step in. The QB spot is the major issue.

I'm kind of in the same boat, let Miller get in and get it done. Pretty sure he's enrolling early so he'll have a whole spring plus fall camp under his belt and hopefully being around the older QB's during the summer will give him a chance to learn the nuiances of the offense

What about the defense for next year?
I know the secondary is still young, and the LB will probably be solid, but what about the Dline? Can they replace Cam?

They also may have to play Saine at WR in some games and let Berry, Hall and Smith get carries...depending on who is doing the best. If the buckeyes could somehow get Clowney (DE #1 prospect in the country)...that would help out the D-Line situation..wishful thinking but just saying. I think we will get to see plenty of Guiton in the Sugar Bowl, so we'll see what he has and go from there about the QB situation.

ptown_trojans_1;612642 wrote:What about the defense for next year?
I know the secondary is still young, and the LB will probably be solid, but what about the Dline? Can they replace Cam?

While it will be VERY tough to "replace" Heyward, and I don't think we will, Solomon Thomas was in position to definitely fill, and fill well, the void that Heyward was going to be leaving. Now... I don't know who's going to fill that role. I HOPE it's Baldwin as I think he's going to be talented, but who knows.

Our d-tackles are going to be some of the best in a LOOOOONG time. Simon is a beast, an Hankins has been showing signs of brilliance. I think we will be VERY pleased here. With 3 of the 4 spots taken care of (Nathan Williams, Simon, and Hankins), I don't think it will be TOO hard to find a 4th.

zach24oz;612660 wrote:They also may have to play Saine at WR in some games...

Uhmm... Saine is gone after this season.

I agree with most of what you say except the fact that OSU fans are throwing Pryor under the bus after all he did for Ohio State. I believe Pryor couldn't care less about OSU, he cares about himself. This has been evident since day 1 (with all the hype around his announcement of what college to everyone murders people to the recent Twitter and newspaper reports on his thoughts of him being a beast in other offenses). I have never been a believer of Pryor's ability to be a NC caliber QB. This solidifies it. He's not a leader, has no character and doesn't have the mental fortitude to lead a team to the NC. I would love to see Pryor head for the NFL as would many fans right now.

Herron- I don't even think he is the best RB on the team, so he can leave for the NFL as well. Bring on Berry, Hall and Smith.

Posey- OSU is weak at WR and Posey would help in that area next season, but I think Posey has progressively gotten worse as a player. I also think he will enter the draft as he probably has the best odds of getting drafted (although none of them will go high, if at all).

Adams- I think Adams will be back. I don't think he gets drafted if he enters this year. His best bet will be to take the suspension and perform in the second half of the season.

As for the team. I could see them going anywhere from 10-2 to 8-4. 9-3 is probably the most realistic (Losses to Nebraska, Wisconsin and Miami).

dwccrew;612743 wrote:9-3 is probably the most realistic (Losses to Nebraska, Wisconsin and Miami).

No way we lose to Wisconsin next year.

Scarlet_Buckeye;612886 wrote:No way we lose to Wisconsin next year.

Really? If we don't have Pryor I think we could lose to Wisky. They always have stud linemen and running backs. I think it is the least likely loss out of the 3 I listed, but it could happen. Who would have thought we'd lose to Purdue last season?

dwccrew;612743 wrote: He's not a leader, has no character and doesn't have the mental fortitude to lead a team to the NC. I would love to see Pryor head for the NFL as would many fans right now.

If our defense only plays halfway decent against Wisconsin, there is a good chance we are in the National Championship game where anything could happen. It seems to me we were not that far from getting an opportunity to get a NC. I think too many fans under appreciate what Pryor has done on the field(off the field is a different issue). I really think that if he does leave for the NFL, many fans will realize how much he truly meant to our offense and wish he was still around.

elbuckeye28;612946 wrote:If our defense only plays halfway decent against Wisconsin, there is a good chance we are in the National Championship game where anything could happen. It seems to me we were not that far from getting an opportunity to get a NC. I think too many fans under appreciate what Pryor has done on the field(off the field is a different issue). I really think that if he does leave for the NFL, many fans will realize how much he truly meant to our offense and wish he was still around.

I stand by my statement. He's not a leader. A leader would have rallied the troops when they were a FG away from tying the ball game. A leader would have fired the team up and not allowed them to go down 21-0 right away. Pryor is not a leader. You can see him get frustrated in games. There is no poise. And even if OSU did get to the title game, there is no guarantee they'd win. So the point is moot that they ALMOST got there, since they didn't. He is not a NC caliber QB.

Scarlet_Buckeye;612531 wrote:
Posey. Everyone is lambasting this kid and saying "what a disappointment." I disagree here. I WANT to say what a disappointment, but really, the kid has been one of our best wide receivers. I know Sanz' had more yards and bigger plays, but I think a lot of that has to do with that fact that Posey was demanding over-the-top coverage. I think this kid would have been a great one if he actually had a quarterback who could get him the damn ball. I could see Posey going as high as the 3rd Rd and as low as the 4th Rd - with the odds more on going in the 3rd. So with that being said, I think he tests the waters and decides to leave early. I believe he would be the first Buckeye taken out of this bunch.

Really disagree with you here. First of all, Pryor did not have many problems getting Posey the ball as Posey had pretty good stats. In fact, he only had 3 less receiving yards than Ted Ginn had his last season. The main problems with Posey are he dropped a good amount of passes(Iowa being the huge one), and most troubling, he would not give full effort in a lot of games and give up on routes and passes. Anyways, this draft is likely to be extremely deep with wide receivers and he just isn't anywhere near the top if AJ Green, Julio Jones, and Justin Blackmon enter the draft.

dwccrew;612948 wrote:I stand by my statement. He's not a leader. A leader would have rallied the troops when they were a FG away from tying the ball game. A leader would have fired the team up and not allowed them to go down 21-0 right away. Pryor is not a leader. You can see him get frustrated in games. There is no poise. And even if OSU did get to the title game, there is no guarantee they'd win. So the point is moot that they ALMOST got there, since they didn't. He is not a NC caliber QB.

Are you really saying that Pryor's lack of leadership contributed to the special teams giving up a TD and our defense getting shredded? Anyways, once we got it within 3, our defense couldn't get off the field and gave up a 10 play 73 yard drive. You can't blame Pryor for the defense not getting off the field. Do you think Colt McCoy, Sam Bradford, Peyton Manning, Troy Smith etc., were not National Championship QB's because didn't win a NC? Now I'm not trying to say Pryor is as good as any of them, but it's just unfair to put all the blame of not winning a NC Pryor in the ultimate TEAM sport that involves a great deal of luck to achieve a NC.

elbuckeye28;612954 wrote:Are you really saying that Pryor's lack of leadership contributed to the special teams giving up a TD, and our defense getting shredded? Anyways, once we got it within 3, our defense couldn't get off the field and gave up a 10 play 73 yard drive. You can't blame Pryor for the defense not getting off the field. Do you think Colt McCoy, Sam Bradford, Peyton Manning, Troy Smith etc., were not National Championship QB's because didn't win a NC? Now I'm not trying to say Pryor is as good as any of them, but it's just unfair to put all the blame of not winning a NC Pryor in the ultimate TEAM sport that involves a great deal of luck to achieve a NC.

I don't blame the defensive breakdowns on Pryor, but I do blame him for not putting more than 3 points on the board in the first half. A gigantic hole that was too much to climb out of. And I don't think the players you listed were not NC caliber, but they were better QB's. So if they couldn't get it done, it most certainly means Pryor can't, thus he is not a NC caliber QB.

dwccrew;612957 wrote:I don't blame the defensive breakdowns on Pryor, but I do blame him for not putting more than 3 points on the board in the first half. A gigantic hole that was too much to climb out of. And I don't think the players you listed were not NC caliber, but they were better QB's. So if they couldn't get it done, it most certainly means Pryor can't, thus he is not a NC caliber QB.

I agree about our offense playing poorly can be on Pryor(besides Shugarts horrible block that led to a sack and an eventual missed FG). But do you really think that players like Tee Martin, Matt Flynn, Greg McCelroy are NC QBs but Colt McCoy, Peyton Manning, Tom Brady, Sam Bradford are not NC caliber qbs? I think you are discounting how much luck plays a role in a NC. Some teams got lucky, and some teams did not. I mean Craig Krenzel is no different of a QB if Michael Jenkins drops the 4th and 12 pass in OT of the NC game, but since he catches and we win the game, is he all of a sudden a NC caliber QB where he wouldn't have been otherwise?

Yesterday I was pissed as hell. But today, I am very optimistic (maybe it's just the Christmas cheer getting to me?) Anyways, I'm excited at our outlook. I'm excited that the era of a new QB at OSU is soon to be underway, whether it's Guiton, Graham, or Miller.

With Pryor, it feels like those times when you get broken up with by that super, super hott girl who is whiny and has a nose for drama and bullshit. The only thing that kept you in the relationship was solely because of their looks.. Of course it sucks starting over and losing something that was nice to look at, but then again, it's exciting to get to start something with someone else. They might not be as attractive, but you know they'll be easier to get along with and won't cause you as many problems. They'll be someone that you'll admire for what they actually are rather than what they possibly could be.

elbuckeye28;612962 wrote:I agree about our offense playing poorly can be on Pryor(besides Shugarts horrible block that led to a sack and an eventual missed FG). But do you really think that players like Tee Martin, Matt Flynn, Greg McCelroy are NC QBs but Colt McCoy, Peyton Manning, Tom Brady, Sam Bradford are not NC caliber qbs? I think you are discounting how much luck plays a role in a NC. Some teams got lucky, and some teams did not. I mean Craig Krenzel is no different of a QB if Michael Jenkins drops the 4th and 12 pass in OT of the NC game, but since he catches and we win the game, is he all of a sudden a NC caliber QB where he wouldn't have been otherwise?

You can keep bringing up other players from the past, but that is not relevant about this topic. Pryor is not a leader, has character issues and is selfish (which is now evident). He is not a NC caliber QB. PLayers like McCoy, Martin, McCelroy, etc. had class, character and were about the team. Some won titles, some didn't. But they had something in common, they were about the team. Pryor is not, he is about Pryor. He will never be a NC caliber QB because of this. Other QB's that didn't win were not NC caliber QB's because of other reasons.

charliehustle14;612967 wrote:Yesterday I was pissed as hell. But today, I am very optimistic (maybe it's just the Christmas cheer getting to me?) Anyways, I'm excited at our outlook. I'm excited that the era of a new QB at OSU is soon to be underway, whether it's Guiton, Graham, or Miller.

With Pryor, it feels like those times when you get broken up with by that super, super hott girl who is whiny and has a nose for drama and bullshit. The only thing that kept you in the relationship was solely because of their looks.. Of course it sucks starting over and losing something that was nice to look at, but then again, it's exciting to get to start something with someone else. They might not be as attractive, but you know they'll be easier to get along with and won't cause you as many problems. They'll be someone that you'll admire for what they actually are rather than what they possibly could be.

I'm glad you are optimistic about the next era of QBs, and I am optimistic about Miller becoming a great QB too. That said, if any of the QBs you stated have to play the whole season, people will start to wish that Pryor was still here. It won't be any fault of their own, other then their lack of experience(and maybe ability depending on the QB). I just remember sitting at the SDSU game after we lost to Texas. This was Smith's first full game back from the suspension(an infraction that is probably worse than what these players did but everyone was quick to forgive that) and we were not playing well. People in the stands were calling for Zwick to be put in(there was actually a Boeckman chant in there too). Imagine if they got their wish and Smith sat the bench. So we just have to be careful what we wish for as the result will likely not be as positive as expected.

elbuckeye28;612976 wrote:I'm glad you are optimistic about the next era of QBs, and I am optimistic about Miller becoming a great QB too. That said, if any of the QBs you stated have to play the whole season, people will start to wish that Pryor was still here. It won't be any fault of their own, other then their lack of experience(and maybe ability depending on the QB). I just remember sitting at the SDSU game after we lost to Texas. This was Smith's first full game back from the suspension(an infraction that is probably worse than what these players did but everyone was quick to forgive that) and we were not playing well. People in the stands were calling for Zwick to be put in(there was actually a Boeckman chant in there too). Imagine if they got their wish and Smith sat the bench. So we just have to be careful what we wish for as the result will likely not be as positive as expected.

I agree with you on this post. I think the Buckeyes will struggle without Pryor, however, I'd rather play with integrity and lose than have someone like TP on the team anymore. This is his 3rd season and he still has questionable character issues. This will not change. Out with the old, in with the new.

elbuckeye28;612976 wrote:I'm glad you are optimistic about the next era of QBs, and I am optimistic about Miller becoming a great QB too. That said, if any of the QBs you stated have to play the whole season, people will start to wish that Pryor was still here. It won't be any fault of their own, other then their lack of experience(and maybe ability depending on the QB). I just remember sitting at the SDSU game after we lost to Texas. This was Smith's first full game back from the suspension(an infraction that is probably worse than what these players did but everyone was quick to forgive that) and we were not playing well. People in the stands were calling for Zwick to be put in(there was actually a Boeckman chant in there too). Imagine if they got their wish and Smith sat the bench. So we just have to be careful what we wish for as the result will likely not be as positive as expected.

Miller enrolling early will help a lot.

Basically, I'd rather see us lose games with Miller, Guiton, Graham, or whoever than watch us win with Pryor. I just want the POS out of the program.

charliehustle14;612980 wrote:Miller enrolling early will help a lot.

Basically, I'd rather see us lose games with Miller, Guiton, Graham, or whoever than watch us win with Pryor. I just want the POS out of the program.

This. And hopefully they will build and improve even if they struggle. I also hope that Miller is a much better character than Pryor.