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This weeks Sports Illustrated Cover

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cbus4life

Ignorant

2,849 posts
Jul 15, 2010 6:58 PM
vball10set;424430 wrote:I didn't realize Bryant Gumbel was a Cavs fan...

Lol, exactly what i was thinking.
Jul 15, 2010 6:58pm
ytownfootball's avatar

ytownfootball

Bold faced liar...

6,978 posts
Jul 15, 2010 7:00 PM
I think it is pretty apparent that there indeed was collusion among the three to end up in Miami. Though, hindsight is obviously 20/20. The three year deals they signed all points to there being a similar mindset. I think it was Cuban who brought up the fact that it was going to be brought up in the owners talks, which I would be very interested to be a fly on the wall for those discussions, but I really believe they're going to not do anything. The whole issue of actually PROVING there was collusion is what will prevent them from doing anything actually, not that they nor the fans would want to stop it. The actual mechanisms that would need be in place to stop any of it would rival that of J. Edgar Hoovers attempts at proving communist tendencies...that won't, and can't, imo happen. That's why I say it is what it is, it won't change, still don't mean I have to like it.:D
Jul 15, 2010 7:00pm
jordo212000's avatar

jordo212000

Senior Member

10,664 posts
Jul 15, 2010 7:16 PM
Even if the NBA wanted to stop this so-called "collusion" from happening again, they couldn't. The only way they could is if Stern had all of the players' cell phones tapped and had a tracking device implanted into their bodies. (I wouldn't be surprised if Stern is somewhere trying to figure out how to tap cell phones. The dude is a twerp).
Jul 15, 2010 7:16pm
ytownfootball's avatar

ytownfootball

Bold faced liar...

6,978 posts
Jul 15, 2010 7:21 PM
jordo212000;424702 wrote:Even if the NBA wanted to stop this so-called "collusion" from happening again, they couldn't. The only way they could is if Stern had all of the players' cell phones tapped and had a tracking device implanted into their bodies. (I wouldn't be surprised if Stern is somewhere trying to figure out how to tap cell phones. The dude is a twerp).

I think that is what I said, could be wrong tho.
Jul 15, 2010 7:21pm
2quik4u's avatar

2quik4u

Senior Member

4,388 posts
Jul 15, 2010 7:42 PM
wayne brady makes bryant gumbel look like malcom x
Jul 15, 2010 7:42pm
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enigmaax

Senior Member

4,511 posts
Jul 15, 2010 7:53 PM
ytownfootball;424695 wrote:I think it is pretty apparent that there indeed was collusion among the three to end up in Miami. Though, hindsight is obviously 20/20. The three year deals they signed all points to there being a similar mindset. I think it was Cuban who brought up the fact that it was going to be brought up in the owners talks, which I would be very interested to be a fly on the wall for those discussions, but I really believe they're going to not do anything. The whole issue of actually PROVING there was collusion is what will prevent them from doing anything actually, not that they nor the fans would want to stop it. The actual mechanisms that would need be in place to stop any of it would rival that of J. Edgar Hoovers attempts at proving communist tendencies...that won't, and can't, imo happen. That's why I say it is what it is, it won't change, still don't mean I have to like it.:D

I'm asking because I really don't know, not trying to argue anything. Isn't "collusion" something specifically called out in the labor agreement? But doesn't it only apply to team reps and players interacting? There is no such thing as "collusion" amongst players, in the legal sense as defined by the labor agreement - right or wrong?
Jul 15, 2010 7:53pm
jordo212000's avatar

jordo212000

Senior Member

10,664 posts
Jul 15, 2010 8:57 PM
enigmaax;424722 wrote:There is no such thing as "collusion" amongst players, in the legal sense as defined by the labor agreement - right or wrong?

Correct. Stern has already clarified that.
Jul 15, 2010 8:57pm
ytownfootball's avatar

ytownfootball

Bold faced liar...

6,978 posts
Jul 15, 2010 9:09 PM
enigmaax;424722 wrote:I'm asking because I really don't know, not trying to argue anything. Isn't "collusion" something specifically called out in the labor agreement? But doesn't it only apply to team reps and players interacting? There is no such thing as "collusion" amongst players, in the legal sense as defined by the labor agreement - right or wrong?

No, I'm not arguing anything here either. There is no "collusion" under terms of the contract. There is collusion among players, and why it will be brought up at the owners meeting, they have to hate that they're being circumvented and this has to really piss them off, though nothing will come of it. They may try tweaking things but I doubt anything with teeth can come of it.
Jul 15, 2010 9:09pm
HitsRus's avatar

HitsRus

Senior Member

9,206 posts
Jul 15, 2010 9:23 PM
Like the entire rest of the NBA, who found no reason to push that issue?
I believe that it was reported that AT LEAST 5 owners complained to the commissioner about possible tampering and collusion. That the NBA chose not to pursue the issue does not mean that there was no evidence or that this type of behavior is okay.It means only that they had a reason not to push it. Gee, Can you imagine what that possibly might be?
Jul 15, 2010 9:23pm
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enigmaax

Senior Member

4,511 posts
Jul 15, 2010 10:52 PM
HitsRus;424787 wrote:I believe that it was reported that AT LEAST 5 owners complained to the commissioner about possible tampering and collusion. That the NBA chose not to pursue the issue does not mean that there was no evidence or that this type of behavior is okay.It means only that they had a reason not to push it. Gee, Can you imagine what that possibly might be?

Again, just trying to be sure of your stance - you think the Heat/Pat Riley was in on the whole thing ... or just the players?
Jul 15, 2010 10:52pm
ytownfootball's avatar

ytownfootball

Bold faced liar...

6,978 posts
Jul 15, 2010 10:59 PM
Plenty of evidence that would suggest, that Riley and the Heat knew something was headed their way. Note I said *suggest*...not prove. Were there proof, we might have something to talk about, but knowing the ramifications of this should be enough for them to cover their tracks well I would think. What I wonder is what Gilbert knows/has found out and if he plans on letting it leak. I would wager that Stern has warned him about doing so already and what his actions would be.
Jul 15, 2010 10:59pm
HitsRus's avatar

HitsRus

Senior Member

9,206 posts
Jul 15, 2010 11:13 PM
http://blog.mises.org/12822/nba-star-explains-the-economics-of-collusion/

I think it is pretty obvious that Pat Riley had intimate knowledge( thru Nick Arison) of what the three stars were plotting. He used that knowledge to position his franchise to do precisely what was necessary to bring it about. He knew exactly what these guys wanted and what buttons to push.
Jul 15, 2010 11:13pm
ytownfootball's avatar

ytownfootball

Bold faced liar...

6,978 posts
Jul 15, 2010 11:22 PM
That's a good link Hits.
Jul 15, 2010 11:22pm
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Footwedge

Senior Member

9,265 posts
Jul 16, 2010 12:31 AM
HitsRus;424892 wrote:http://blog.mises.org/12822/nba-star-explains-the-economics-of-collusion/

I think it is pretty obvious that Pat Riley had intimate knowledge( thru Nick Arison) of what the three stars were plotting. He used that knowledge to position his franchise to do precisely what was necessary to bring it about. He knew exactly what these guys wanted and what buttons to push.
Holy shit Hits. The Mises Institute? Pretty soon you'll turn into a full blown libertarian like me. LOL.
Jul 16, 2010 12:31am
jordo212000's avatar

jordo212000

Senior Member

10,664 posts
Jul 16, 2010 8:59 AM

Seems like there is a logical mistake in that article. The mistake seems to be early in the article when the writer discusses "eye doctors in Illinois." He says they got into trouble for price-fixing. However, I am assuming that they placed their prices above market value. However what Wade, James, and Bosh did was the opposite. They all conspired together to set their "prices" lower than what the market was willing to give them. Correct me if I am wrong but whoever heard of a business getting sued because they offered lower than market value prices?
Jul 16, 2010 8:59am
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enigmaax

Senior Member

4,511 posts
Jul 16, 2010 9:30 AM
Yeah, there's a fine line somewhere there and I don't know if anyone crossed it or not. I get that people are ticked because Riley kind of had an inside scoop. But is wasn't his idea and as far as I can tell, he wasn't the one having the discussions. Three guys wanted to play together and a few teams were trying to make it happen for them. Riley just happened to have the team that won. He did take a huge risk and sacrificed at least one entire season. The potential was there that he could've turned off his own biggest star.

Whatever the case, it is pretty clear that LeBron's will was to leave Cleveland. Some of the things I've read make it seem like Riley is the devil who stole LeBron's soul or something. Like he was controlling LeBron, personally. All of the finger pointing in the world isn't going to change the fact that LeBron didn't want to be in Cleveland. And if I was running a team and knew that, I'd certainly be lining up my best shot (the Knicks and Nets did the same thing).
Jul 16, 2010 9:30am
shook_17's avatar

shook_17

Senior Member

3,023 posts
Jul 16, 2010 10:03 AM
ha i threw that bitch right away when i got in the mail.
Jul 16, 2010 10:03am