LeBron leaving and leading the Knicks to a title and then the Clippers would give him a boost.

sleeper;1801017 wrote:None of this matters to Jordan fans. How do you measure clutch? How do you measure killer instinct?

That's what seperates MJ from Lebron. Intangibles that cannot be measured and cannot be bested.

Game winning shots in the last few seconds of a playoff game/finals.

Everyone remembers that shot against the Jazz and Cavs at the end to win those huge games and how well he ups his game when it matters.

Jordan avg 30.1/game in his career, and 33.4 in the playoffs so he upped it by over 3/game.
LBJ is 27.2 and 28.0

Whats your point here?

That block will go down in NBA history...a fucking BLOCK.

thavoice;1801020 wrote:Game winning shots in the last few seconds of a playoff game/finals.

Everyone remembers that shot against the Jazz and Cavs at the end to win those huge games and how well he ups his game when it matters.

Jordan avg 30.1/game in his career, and 33.4 in the playoffs so he upped it by over 3/game.
LBJ is 27.2 and 28.0

Lebron has already done this numerous times.... Next

sleeper;1801017 wrote:None of this matters to Jordan fans. How do you measure clutch? How do you measure killer instinct?

That's what seperates MJ from Lebron. Intangibles that cannot be measured and cannot be bested.

Jordan never played in a game 7....that's a bit of a killer instinct I'd say.

For me....having watched both all of their playoff years, I wouldn't argue with anyone that said Jordan was better but also wouldn't argue with anyone saying LeBron is. Neither are stoppable when they put their mind to it. Jordan didn't have as many passive moments but LeBron is part Magic also, he just is.

Regardless, I know one damn thing. Jordan could electrify and give you chills with his relentless determination and skill....LeBron just did the same thing this finals series.

Maybe there isn't a fancy metric for "killer instinct"...but I can't fathom a person alive that watched a majority of Jordan's career and didn't think he was the best with the "killer instinct"

Hate that I'm old but love the fact I got to fully witness Jordan and LeBron...Kobe and Shaq were neat to get to watch but not the same level IMO.

thavoice;1801020 wrote:Game winning shots in the last few seconds of a playoff game/finals.

Everyone remembers that shot against the Jazz and Cavs at the end to win those huge games and how well he ups his game when it matters.

Jordan avg 30.1/game in his career, and 33.4 in the playoffs so he upped it by over 3/game.
LBJ is 27.2 and 28.0

LBJ likely has him in assist, rebounds and blocks....pretty important

Spock;1801001 wrote:THere isnt one Euro player that would make an impact in the 80-90's that is playing today.

You really don't know wtf you are talking about.

Dirk will easily go down as a top 50 player of all time. He easily would make an impact on that era. Also, you don't think Marc Gasol would have an impact on the game in that era where it was "SOOOOO MUCH MOAR FISICAL?" My guess is you don't even know who i am talking about because you haven't watched the NBA since the 90s.


Just stop posting, everyone is laughing at you.

like_that;1801026 wrote:You really don't know wtf you are talking about.

Dirk will easily go down as a top 50 player of all time. He easily would make an impact on that era. Also, you don't think Marc Gasol would have an impact on the game in that era where it was "SOOOOO MUCH MOAR FISICAL?" My guess is you don't even know who i am talking about because you haven't watched the NBA since the 90s.


Just stop posting, everyone is laughing at you.

Dirk is probably top 25 isn't he?

Pau Gasol similar to Kevin McHale.

like_that;1801026 wrote:You really don't know wtf you are talking about.

Dirk will easily go down as a top 50 player of all time. He easily would make an impact on that era. Also, you don't think Marc Gasol would have an impact on the game in that era where it was "SOOOOO MUCH MOAR FISICAL?" My guess is you don't even know who i am talking about because you haven't watched the NBA since the 90s.


Just stop posting, everyone is laughing at you.

Actually, that should be a reason for him to keep posting. It's the offseason now, so it's fun to have a total clown trying to give his opinion, regardless of how comically stupid it is. I mean, Dirk, both Gasols, Noah, Tony Parker, Giannis the Greek Freak, Porzingis and Ibaka all are former, current and/or future high-quality players.

Ironman92;1801027 wrote:Dirk is probably top 25 isn't he?

Pau Gasol similar to Kevin McHale.

Likely. He really changed what a 7 footer does on the court. Not many before him were any sort of a deep or ball handling threat.

thavoice;1801020 wrote:Game winning shots in the last few seconds of a playoff game/finals.

Everyone remembers that shot against the Jazz and Cavs at the end to win those huge games and how well he ups his game when it matters.

Jordan avg 30.1/game in his career, and 33.4 in the playoffs so he upped it by over 3/game.
LBJ is 27.2 and 28.0

The # of possessions per game have substantially declined since the Jordan area. I'll do the math if you want(or you can google it) but adjusting Lebron's numbers for Jordan's # of possessions would likely result in MJ looking like Larry Hughes next to Lebron.

like_that;1801026 wrote:You really don't know wtf you are talking about.

Dirk will easily go down as a top 50 player of all time. He easily would make an impact on that era. Also, you don't think Marc Gasol would have an impact on the game in that era where it was "SOOOOO MUCH MOAR FISICAL?" My guess is you don't even know who i am talking about because you haven't watched the NBA since the 90s.


Just stop posting, everyone is laughing at you.

Dirk, Marc, Pau, Boozer, Deng, Ibaka, Z, Horford, Peja, Yao, Ginobli, Parker, Nash, Duncan, Irving(?), Bogut.

Just off the top of my head. Jordan had Kukoc on his team and had to play against Mutumbo, Wilkins, Ewing, and Olajuwon. That's just the stars though; mostly I'm talking about the bench depth and Jordan getting to play against weak D1 prospects instead of benches full of quality international talent.

Olympics are still a formality for the US but it seems most teams have NBA talent on them now. Not in the case in Jordan's dream team.

Everyone talks about the Cavs shot for MJ, nobody mentions the Magic shot for LBJ. Why? Because they had the same importance at the end of the season, neither won a title. My guess is cause people love MJ so they use those shots to bolster argument, but they hate LBJ, so they ignore all of LBJs clutch moments. It's stupid and tired argument. LBJ is clutch.

Laley23;1801063 wrote:Everyone talks about the Cavs shot for MJ, nobody mentions the Magic shot for LBJ. Why? Because they had the same importance at the end of the season, neither won a title. My guess is cause people love MJ so they use those shots to bolster argument, but they hate LBJ, so they ignore all of LBJs clutch moments. It's stupid and tired argument. LBJ is clutch.

I don't know what that first sentence means.

Ironman92;1801069 wrote:I don't know what that first sentence means.

[video=youtubeCv4Ew-HyQ0][/video]

I got it, but did have to read it 3x

Laley23;1801063 wrote:Everyone talks about the Cavs shot for MJ, nobody mentions the Magic shot for LBJ. Why? Because they had the same importance at the end of the season, neither won a title. My guess is cause people love MJ so they use those shots to bolster argument, but they hate LBJ, so they ignore all of LBJs clutch moments. It's stupid and tired argument. LBJ is clutch.

One was a SERIES winning shot on the road against a team who had a better record to finish the upset in the set.

The other was a game winning shot in game 2 of a series at home.


One of those is a just a liiitttlllee bit bigger of a deal and more memorable in my opinion.

Lebron also hit a buzzer beater against the bulls last year with a hobbled lineup, and he hit a buzzer beater layup against the pacers in the ECF a few years ago. Anyone who thinks Lebron isn't clutch is a dumbass. Even when I hated him on the heat I knew he was clutch.

Not to mention plenty of game winning shots for Lebron in the playoffs that weren't buzzer beaters. I.E. Game 5 vs the pistons in 07 when he scored 24 of the last 25 points. MJ is amazing, but the MJ nut huggers are the worst, especially the ones around my age who only legitimately remember MJ from 95-98.

There are definitely legitimate arguments for MJ, do not get me wrong, but CC and not thavoice are completely looking like morons here. I still have MJ #1 FWIW. If Lebron has a couple more titles then I think its over for the MJ #1 talk.

like_that;1801075 wrote:Not to mention plenty of game winning shots for Lebron in the playoffs that weren't buzzer beaters. I.E. Game 5 vs the pistons in 07 when he scored 24 of the last 25 points. MJ is amazing, but the MJ nut huggers are the worst, especially the ones around my age who only legitimately remember MJ from 95-98.

There are definitely legitimate arguments for MJ, do not get me wrong, but CC and not thavoice are completely looking like morons here. I still have MJ #1 FWIW. If Lebron has a couple more titles then I think its over for the MJ #1 talk.

That...but he's lost 4 finals isn't a negative with me at all. MJ never lost a finals....but he also "only" made it to 6. I have MJ #1 and LeBron #2.....another championship and it'll probably be #1 and #1a....mix in another finals showing and then the probable scoring record, top 5 assists etc....the #1 and #1a might flip flop.

Ironman92;1801109 wrote:That...but he's lost 4 finals isn't a negative with me at all. MJ never lost a finals....but he also "only" made it to 6. I have MJ #1 and LeBron #2.....another championship and it'll probably be #1 and #1a....mix in another finals showing and then the probable scoring record, top 5 assists etc....the #1 and #1a might flip flop.

Probably the most accurate description/opinion on this debate. Nice job.

Ironman92;1801109 wrote:That...but he's lost 4 finals isn't a negative with me at all. MJ never lost a finals....but he also "only" made it to 6. I have MJ #1 and LeBron #2.....another championship and it'll probably be #1 and #1a....mix in another finals showing and then the probable scoring record, top 5 assists etc....the #1 and #1a might flip flop.

It's a team game man.

Lebron also never lost in the first round of the playoffs. Jordan lost 3 times in R1; where was that "Killer instinct" then?

Lebron shouldn't be punished for taking dog shit teams far in the playoffs.

Also Lebron will probably end his career #1 in points, top 10 in assists, and top 20 in steals.

He will also be for the playoffs, #1 in points, #2 in assists, #1 in steals, top 5 in rebounds, and top 15 in blocks.

For the Finals, #1 in points, #1 in steals, #2 in assists, top 5 in blocks, and top 5 in rebounds.

Tell me more about Jordan though!

Twice.

sleeper;1801154 wrote:Also Lebron will probably end his career #1 in points, top 10 in assists, and top 20 in steals.

He will also be for the playoffs, #1 in points, #2 in assists, #1 in steals, top 5 in rebounds, and top 15 in blocks.

For the Finals, #1 in points, #1 in steals, #2 in assists, top 5 in blocks, and top 5 in rebounds.

Tell me more about Jordan though!

Dude, everyone understands. Basically everyone in this thread, except for ccrunner, loves LeBron. Both LBJ and MJ are all-time greats. Everyone is entitled to their opinion, but literally one person is this thread is disagreeing with you and he probably doesn't even believe what he's typing.