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BR1986FB
Posts: 24,104
Dec 16, 2015 2:24pm
I'll remember that when they draft their next QB. "We don't want him to improve.....improving is useless."sleeper;1769792 wrote:This isn't high school or college. Improving is useless.
sleeper
Posts: 27,879
Dec 16, 2015 4:54pm
I don't see players like Andrew Luck or Cam Newton improving. Manziel having one okay game against trash tier competition is irrelevant. He's not talented enough to win at a high level against relevant teams.BR1986FB;1769802 wrote:I'll remember that when they draft their next QB. "We don't want him to improve.....improving is useless."
Cut him and let's move on.
like_that
Posts: 26,625
Dec 16, 2015 5:05pm
Lolwut?sleeper;1769826 wrote:I don't see players like Andrew Luck or Cam Newton improving.
sleeper
Posts: 27,879
Dec 16, 2015 5:07pm
They are top tier QBs who can play in the NFL from day 1. Manziel on the other hand sat behind after runs and has beens because he's not good enough to play in the NFL.like_that;1769830 wrote:Lolwut?
Not complicated. Manziel isn't going to magically improve to be a competent NFL QB. Time to cut him and move in a different direction.
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friendfromlowry
Posts: 6,239
Dec 16, 2015 5:09pm
It's almost too coincidental one user is so absurdly far up Manziel's ass while another is the extreme opposite.
SportsAndLady
Posts: 35,632
Dec 16, 2015 5:43pm
One of the dumbest things said on this thread, and that's including fw's posts.like_that;1769830 wrote:Lolwut?
Laley23
Posts: 29,506
Dec 16, 2015 5:57pm
Lol. Sleeper didn't watch Cams first year, or subsequent years leading to this season.
Heretic
Posts: 18,820
Dec 16, 2015 6:02pm
Sleeper is basically a younger Footwedge. Says stupid hot taek stuff and then double-downs on it no matter what anyone says to the contrary. I find it fun, because you just never know what the fuck's gonna come out of their minds next.
lhslep134
Posts: 9,774
Dec 16, 2015 6:06pm
Difference: Sleeper is acutely aware he's trolling and Footwedge is just plain stupid.Heretic;1769842 wrote:Sleeper is basically a younger Footwedge. Says stupid hot taek stuff and then double-downs on it no matter what anyone says to the contrary. I find it fun, because you just never know what the fuck's gonna come out of their minds next.
like_that
Posts: 26,625
Dec 16, 2015 6:39pm
Pretty much this. I think I know where sleeper was trying to go with his comment, but it was just a poor delivery this time around. Cam has done nothing but improve every season. Hell he has improved significantly since he almost died a year ago in that car accident.lhslep134;1769843 wrote:Difference: Sleeper is acutely aware he's trolling and Footwedge is just plain stupid.
HitsRus
Posts: 9,206
Dec 16, 2015 6:55pm
LOL at the most dysfunctional organization in pro football… SMH.
Darius Jennings cut so that we could pick up another cast off running back?
Wait! Did our RBs do pretty good last week? Didn't Brian Hartline go down with a broken collarbone?
Darius Jennings cut so that we could pick up another cast off running back?
Wait! Did our RBs do pretty good last week? Didn't Brian Hartline go down with a broken collarbone?
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Con_Alma
Posts: 12,198
Dec 16, 2015 7:03pm
Not that it's any more logical but he needed 1 more game on the roster to get credit for the season.
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BR1986FB
Posts: 24,104
Dec 17, 2015 7:51am
And this is what pisses me off because Jennings was actually more productive than that paycheck stealing Bowe.Con_Alma;1769851 wrote:Not that it's any more logical but he needed 1 more game on the roster to get credit for the season.
j_crazy
Posts: 8,372
Dec 17, 2015 7:52am
cam is lucky more than anything. Hear me out:
He was immensely talented from day 1. The body and ability of an NFL QB from the time he left Blinn college, but he was not an elite NFL QB until about week 12 of last year. He got by and had limited success in his first 2 years on shear ability. Then in year 3 he got it, made some improvements on it last year but the little injuries he got just kept dinging him up. Now this year it seems like he's finally got the mental part of being an elite QB down. If he would have had a major injury in those first 2 years, I don't think he'd have gotten the chance to really make that improvement. It's sort of like the opposite of RG3, but RG3 doesn't have a big enough body to play the running QB game in the NFL (a problem I could see Manziel having at some point too).
He was immensely talented from day 1. The body and ability of an NFL QB from the time he left Blinn college, but he was not an elite NFL QB until about week 12 of last year. He got by and had limited success in his first 2 years on shear ability. Then in year 3 he got it, made some improvements on it last year but the little injuries he got just kept dinging him up. Now this year it seems like he's finally got the mental part of being an elite QB down. If he would have had a major injury in those first 2 years, I don't think he'd have gotten the chance to really make that improvement. It's sort of like the opposite of RG3, but RG3 doesn't have a big enough body to play the running QB game in the NFL (a problem I could see Manziel having at some point too).
like_that
Posts: 26,625
Dec 17, 2015 10:18am
I heard you out, and think this is fucking stupid.j_crazy;1769888 wrote:cam is lucky more than anything. Hear me out:
He was immensely talented from day 1. The body and ability of an NFL QB from the time he left Blinn college, but he was not an elite NFL QB until about week 12 of last year. He got by and had limited success in his first 2 years on shear ability. Then in year 3 he got it, made some improvements on it last year but the little injuries he got just kept dinging him up. Now this year it seems like he's finally got the mental part of being an elite QB down. If he would have had a major injury in those first 2 years, I don't think he'd have gotten the chance to really make that improvement. It's sort of like the opposite of RG3, but RG3 doesn't have a big enough body to play the running QB game in the NFL (a problem I could see Manziel having at some point too).
Automatik
Posts: 14,632
Dec 17, 2015 10:35am
I'm not sure what the argument is, but Cam just has "it." He had it at Auburn. He's a leader and apparently a hard worker in all facets of the game.
Do you think RG3's teammates in Washington gave a fuck what he had to say ever? No, because he has a bitch personality.
Do you think RG3's teammates in Washington gave a fuck what he had to say ever? No, because he has a bitch personality.
Laley23
Posts: 29,506
Dec 17, 2015 10:40am
How is that "lucky" lol. He is lucky cause he didn't get hurt?? That's ridiculous. Dude has worked extremely hard to become the player he is.
sleeper
Posts: 27,879
Dec 17, 2015 10:40am
Amazing how beating a shitty team changes everyone's minds about a player that sat back up to a has been all year.
Back to reality this week. The Browns need a QB not a distraction pretending to be QB. I'd rather have T. Pryor back there slinging noodle arm passes than watch another minute of this waste of space.
Back to reality this week. The Browns need a QB not a distraction pretending to be QB. I'd rather have T. Pryor back there slinging noodle arm passes than watch another minute of this waste of space.
sleeper
Posts: 27,879
Dec 17, 2015 10:41am
RGIII is also terrible and injury prone. He's still better than anything we have in Cleveland.Automatik;1769933 wrote:I'm not sure what the argument is, but Cam just has "it." He had it at Auburn. He's a leader and apparently a hard worker in all facets of the game.
Do you think RG3's teammates in Washington gave a fuck what he had to say ever? No, because he has a bitch personality.
j_crazy
Posts: 8,372
Dec 17, 2015 11:31am
No doubt, but I think if Cam had been forced to sit a year out, his attitude wouldn't be the same and when he got back he'd play a little differently and that would snowball on him and he'd be a much different player.Automatik;1769933 wrote:I'm not sure what the argument is, but Cam just has "it." He had it at Auburn. He's a leader and apparently a hard worker in all facets of the game.
Do you think RG3's teammates in Washington gave a fuck what he had to say ever? No, because he has a bitch personality.
Maybe lucky isn't the right word, because Cam and RG3 are so different physically, Cam's body can take a lot more punishment than RG3, but my point was that if he had a year out i think he would regress to a point where he wouldn't be able to ever get to where he is now.
EDIT:
Watch Luck next year, he essentially lost this whole year because of injuries. So my point may yet be proven by him. I could see him regressing a lot going into next year because he's seen how vulnerable his body is.
lhslep134
Posts: 9,774
Dec 17, 2015 11:34am
j_crazy;1769949 wrote:but my point was that if he had a year out i think he would regress to a point where he wouldn't be able to ever get to where he is now.
We, being like_that, auto, and laley, all understand what your point is. We just think it's a fucking dumb scenario to be talking about.
Automatik
Posts: 14,632
Dec 17, 2015 11:46am
It's all speculation.
Injury time of doesn't ultimately mean regression. Who's to say they can't improve after taking the time off to study/learn the position further?
Injury time of doesn't ultimately mean regression. Who's to say they can't improve after taking the time off to study/learn the position further?
Laley23
Posts: 29,506
Dec 17, 2015 11:52am
It's just dumb to say lucky. He isn't lucky cause he stayed healthy. That's like saying, LeBron is really lucky he is considered so great. He could've easily had a career ending injury as a rookie and never made it back on the court.
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BR1986FB
Posts: 24,104
Dec 17, 2015 11:54am
Disagree with the first part. Nobody has "changed their minds" about Manziel over them beating a shitty Niners team. It was your dumbass "zero improvement" comment that prompted the discussion.sleeper;1769938 wrote:Amazing how beating a shitty team changes everyone's minds about a player that sat back up to a has been all year.
Back to reality this week. The Browns need a QB not a distraction pretending to be QB.
I do agree with your second comment though. I don't think JFF can be trusted and will always be a distraction. Not that I'm sold on Josh Gordon changing his ways but, if he intends to, I'd think Manziel would be the LAST person he'd want to hang out with. Too many "bad choice" situations to get into with Manziel around.
like_that
Posts: 26,625
Dec 17, 2015 12:00pm
You can apply this to any player's career. This is just a reach.j_crazy;1769949 wrote:No doubt, but I think if Cam had been forced to sit a year out, his attitude wouldn't be the same and when he got back he'd play a little differently and that would snowball on him and he'd be a much different player.
Maybe lucky isn't the right word, because Cam and RG3 are so different physically, Cam's body can take a lot more punishment than RG3, but my point was that if he had a year out i think he would regress to a point where he wouldn't be able to ever get to where he is now.
EDIT:
Watch Luck next year, he essentially lost this whole year because of injuries. So my point may yet be proven by him. I could see him regressing a lot going into next year because he's seen how vulnerable his body is.