Azubuike24;1641502 wrote:Bailey is the one I'm LEAST concerned about being worth his contract. He's NOT an ace, but he has ace-stuff on a given night and despite a rough start, he's about a 3.4 ERA split since.

If he can put that together consistently next year, and just become maybe 5-10% smarter on the mound and deliver those striking blows better, he's worth his contract.

Lets face it. Votto and Phillips got paid for their past. Phillips even moreso. Given he got his big deal at 32, it's not at all a shock that his long-term deal extends into his declination period. Votto is still 29, and while he's been a bum for 2 years with the leg, it's still something that can be salvaged. His impact of even just a .300/.400 split hitter in the middle of your order transforms your entire offense.

Guessing Homer will be worth his contract about like Phillips

Both are infinitely better than Votto's contract

SportsAndLady;1641441 wrote:But does that matter?

When you're a small-to-mid-market team, it does. Especially if it means the potential of losing a superior pitcher (Cueto or Latos, at least pre-injury) because you broke the bank on him.

Reds have kind of hurt themselves due to essentially doing what teams have to do in rolling the dice to keep their core around. Votto has not been the same player in recent times and will have a ton of money still coming to him. Phillips has a big deal and still is great defensively, but has fallen off a bit offensively. And now Bailey is basically a decent starter getting very good/great starter money. If those guys aren't being reliable and putting up good numbers, the team is inherently in trouble because unlike the big-market teams, when you put a lot in somewhere, you're going cheap in other places, which means more marginal big-league talent on the roster getting more of the playing time.

Azubuike24;1641502 wrote:Bailey is the one I'm LEAST concerned about being worth his contract. He's NOT an ace, but he has ace-stuff on a given night and despite a rough start, he's about a 3.4 ERA split since.

If he can put that together consistently next year, and just become maybe 5-10% smarter on the mound and deliver those striking blows better, he's worth his contract.

Lets face it. Votto and Phillips got paid for their past. Phillips even moreso. Given he got his big deal at 32, it's not at all a shock that his long-term deal extends into his declination period. Votto is still 29, and while he's been a bum for 2 years with the leg, it's still something that can be salvaged. His impact of even just a .300/.400 split hitter in the middle of your order transforms your entire offense.

Agreed with BP, not about Votto.

Votto's ginormous deal was partly on his MVP season but taht kind of length and $$$ has more to do with the future than just his MVP season. They could not expect him to match it often but I dont think it was unrealistic for the Reds to expect an above 300 avg, very high OBP, and driving in 90-95+ most seasons. YOu dont give that $$$ for what he did in the past. Now..Larkin and Griffey Jr's last contracts were more for what they did in the past, but not Vott's. JV is a doubles hitter who at times elevates it and the ball goes out of the ballpark. If JV is right, he drives the gaps and the HR's follow when he gets a little bit of lift.

I am not too upset over Bailey's deal. Being a homegrown guy, with great stuff, top draft pick and improving each year had alot to do with it.

Azubuike24;1641502 wrote:Bailey is the one I'm LEAST concerned about being worth his contract. He's NOT an ace, but he has ace-stuff on a given night and despite a rough start, he's about a 3.4 ERA split since.

If he can put that together consistently next year, and just become maybe 5-10% smarter on the mound and deliver those striking blows better, he's worth his contract.

Lets face it. Votto and Phillips got paid for their past. Phillips even moreso. Given he got his big deal at 32, it's not at all a shock that his long-term deal extends into his declination period. Votto is still 29, and while he's been a bum for 2 years with the leg, it's still something that can be salvaged. His impact of even just a .300/.400 split hitter in the middle of your order transforms your entire offense.

If Latos would be 20-30% smarter on the mound the Reds would really have something!

mhs95_06;1641635 wrote:If Latos would be 20-30% smarter on the mound the Reds would really have something!

Agree, but where did you get that % from lol?

Ironman92;1641640 wrote:Agree, but where did you get that % from lol?

Same place AZ24 got his 5-10 for Homer!

mhs95_06;1641669 wrote:Same place AZ24 got his 5-10 for Homer!

Ok...fair enough lol