I hesitate to chime in, but here goes. High school teams win with leadership on the team (usually from seniors) and good coaching. Lets look at the Class of 2013 for Waynedale.
Football - nuff said. Is there any leadership at all?
Boys Soccer - two years ago this class was written up in the paper as the Super Sophmores. They have finished in the bottom half of the league the last two years.
Girls Soccer - .500 team at best
Volleyball - ZERO girls even on the team.
Basketball - other than a transfer in (Kick kid) nothing
Girls Basketball - there will be 1 senior out for the team
Wrestling - some nice leadership here and look at the results.
Baseball - nothing else needs to be said
Softball - Could be a rough year again but there is some talant.
Track - not sure but it is Waynedale Track.
When you have few athletes in an entire class what do you expect the coaches to do?

Havin Fun;1292934 wrote:I hesitate to chime in, but here goes. High school teams win with leadership on the team (usually from seniors) and good coaching. Lets look at the Class of 2013 for Waynedale.
Football - nuff said. Is there any leadership at all?
Boys Soccer - two years ago this class was written up in the paper as the Super Sophmores. They have finished in the bottom half of the league the last two years.
Girls Soccer - .500 team at best
Volleyball - ZERO girls even on the team.
Basketball - other than a transfer in (Kick kid) nothing
Girls Basketball - there will be 1 senior out for the team
Wrestling - some nice leadership here and look at the results.
Baseball - nothing else needs to be said
Softball - Could be a rough year again but there is some talant.
Track - not sure but it is Waynedale Track.
When you have few athletes in an entire class what do you expect the coaches to do?

Reps!

ouch! that is a eye opener of sorts! is it not?

wcalfan;1292973 wrote:Reps!

Havin Fun;1292934 wrote:I hesitate to chime in, but here goes. High school teams win with leadership on the team (usually from seniors) and good coaching. Lets look at the Class of 2013 for Waynedale.
Football - nuff said. Is there any leadership at all?
Boys Soccer - two years ago this class was written up in the paper as the Super Sophmores. They have finished in the bottom half of the league the last two years.
Girls Soccer - .500 team at best
Volleyball - ZERO girls even on the team.
Basketball - other than a transfer in (Kick kid) nothing
Girls Basketball - there will be 1 senior out for the team
Wrestling - some nice leadership here and look at the results.
Baseball - nothing else needs to be said
Softball - Could be a rough year again but there is some talant.
Track - not sure but it is Waynedale Track.
When you have few athletes in an entire class what do you expect the coaches to do?

This goes well with what i said on the other thread... Outside of Wrestling... there has been no success recently... Looks like we need to fire Mr. C, Erich, Shultzman, ECT,,,

Just a question here, do your underclassmen- both boys and girls learn to lose? So a great freshman class is coming up. Are they prone to repeat what they have seen from the classes ahead of them? So it would strengthen the argument that coaches are not judged on what they can do with a great group of kids, but what they can do with a below average class.

Jmar25;1293004 wrote:This goes well with what i said on the other thread... Outside of Wrestling... there has been no success recently... Looks like we need to fire Mr. C, Erich, Shultzman, ECT,,,

I think the class talent thing goes in cycles and a poor class does not always breed continued losing. Some examples and lights of hope for the future.
- The Volleyball team has learned to overcome any class of 2013 involvement for two years. The result? Best record in school history and 100% of the team back next year.
- Boys basketball will have a strong year in my opinion this winter. Cotrill, Hawkins and Ludeman will be the core of a Junior led team. Some seniors will contribute like Kick but this team should be very good for years to come.
- Girls basketball will be lead by 3 juniors who are some of the best players in the league. McConnell will be the lone senior and the only one from her class who has played for several years. The results of this will be opportunity for some freshman and sophomores to fill the gaps and be a strong team.
- Wrestling team is stacked. No shortage of strong senior leadership or talent here.
Last year Waynedale finished either 2'nd or 3'rd for the All Sports Award. Football is in a down-cycle. So what. If you want to think things could not be worse, look at what Rittman and Chippewa have endured for 10+ years.

MOUNTAINBEAR;1293365 wrote:Just a question here, do your underclassmen- both boys and girls learn to lose? So a great freshman class is coming up. Are they prone to repeat what they have seen from the classes ahead of them? So it would strengthen the argument that coaches are not judged on what they can do with a great group of kids, but what they can do with a below average class.

I agree with a lot of that philosophy. Peers influence their peers more than the "authority" influences. There is validity in that statement. What will bode well for the freshmen group is they are similar to many of the great classes before them... They tend to hangout with each other all the time and surround themselves with each other instead of those with the bad habits you speak of. I think their bonds to each other override the classes before them. I can think of one group who was very similar to this. Surrounded by nothing ahead and nothing behind except the incoming freshmen class and they were ALWAYS TOGETHER... Were highly successful in all sports as well.


The freshman class is talented. In football it takes talent in other classes that surround to be successful. This class may not show up until their senior year. Ahead of them I don't see a lot of help. They might have some minor success until the junior year. I don't think that any kid is ready for varsity football until their senior year. Physically they aren't ready until junior year but it takes a year to adjust to the speed and ferosity of the varsity level.

The other problem I can foresee is size. Most of the kids we are talking about in that class..... Are "skill" players. Similiar to this years team. I haven't seen the JV play so I will be up front and say I don't know what this class has up front. It does however sound like the freshmen have more "football" players than this senior class. I am interested in how it will shake out the next few years for this freshmen group. I think in the smaller/individual sports this class will surely shine... Football.... might not be as great as we think.

Well... all our coaches haven't had success in the last 4 or 5 years except for Louie Stanley.... they must be bad then. That is the logical conclusion from your statement. Would I be correct with that conclusion?

I have been reading this and the other thread for a while and could no longer fight the urge to comment. I am a bear fan but I do not have, as is so commonly put on this board "a dog in the flight". I am frustrated with the current state of where we are at, but I am not ready to pin this on one person or group of people. I am not trying to insult anyone or indicate that I think their opinion is wrong. I am just offering my insight and opinion, so please disagree with class if you so choose.

The largest argument seems to be the disagreement between who is at fault for the current state of the program's tailspin. Is it the coaches? Is it the players? Is it the parents coddling their kids? Is it the administration? My opinion is that is a little bit of each. Whenever a proud and tradition-laden program such as Waynedale football goes into a losing skid, everything gets magnified. I am sure the coaches can probably improve in motivation and game decisions. The kids can work harder and hold themselves and one another more accountable. I do not want to comment on the parents because I am a parent and I know it is sometimes hard to step back and be objective. The administration is being supportive of its coaches, as they should be. Coaching is difficult and having an administration that has your back is important.

Putting the hopes of turning this around should not be placed on one class of kids. It is unfair and sets up unrealistic and sometimes difficult expectations to live up to. The freshmen class is talented, but I agree that one class of players will not "fix" everything. I do not know how much talent is in each class. But I have seen in the past that the biggest time for improvement is in the off-season. Once the season is over, I think the coaching staff will step back and evaluate what improvements need to be made so that we begin to move in the right direction. Does that mean Coach Z has to change the way he interacts with the kids? Does that mean that the kids need a bit more space? Does that mean we need to double the effort? Does that mean we need to have an in-school recruiting session to increase numbers? I don't know the right path, but I trust that steps will be made to move in the right direction. Coach Z can not be pleased with the current state of his program. I feel that he has too much pride and passion to let it continue.

I am discouraged to see what the losing is doing to the community. I know that not everyone in the community cares about Waynedale football. But this community has always been one that has shown support to our young people, no matter how difficult. We pass levies even though it strains our wallets to do so. We pay admission to watch and cheer. We give money to fundraisers, to the booster club, to the PTO, to the band, to choir, or whatever group needs support. We give our time to show our young people that they are important to us, regardless of how they are doing. This support is one of the things that makes me proud to be a part of. I am proud to be a bear! I am proud that my kids go to school in Southeast Local Schools. As adults, as parents, as alumni, whatever we may be, we need to show our young people that we care and support them regardless of the record. No one wants dirt kicked in their face when they are already on the ground. Let's pick up and support our young people and coaches. As crazy as this sounds, it is good to see so much frustration from people. It shows that we still care.

I think the place to start in fixing the problem is at the foundation. We need to work with our youth football players and teach them what being a Golden Bear football player means. (This goes for all sports, but the focus is football in this thread). We need to teach fundamentals, like how to line up in a stance, how to fire off and block on the snap, how to wrap up and tackle with good fundamentals that emphasize safety. We also need to re-teach our youth to compete! We need to teach them that football is an aggressive sport and it is ok to play with passion and ferocity. They need to learn to expect success every time they step on the field. We need to teach them to expect to win, but to accept losing with sportsmanship and understand that losing is a part of athletics. However, we need to teach our kids not to be satisfied with losing or failure, but rather to let it serve as motivation for improvement. Win with class, lose with class, but play with passion and emotion. We need to teach our youth about the tradition of Waynedale football and what it means to be a Golden Bear football player. Our kids need to embrace the tradition so that they can better understand why they are working to be excellent. If anyone wants to be part of the solution, then volunteer to coach the youth! As these kids grow, learn and improve they continue to feed the high school program with players that are prepared to be successful. We can not wait until they are in middle school or freshmen to begin molding them.

I will step off my soap box and prepare for the backlash of insult that is headed my way. I have big shoulders and I can handle it. Please be classy though. I will leave you all with this....The best cure for all that ails is a win! Let's hope that tonight is the night against the Huskies. Good luck to both teams. Play hard, be safe and GO BEARS!!!!!!

PC123526;1293469 wrote:I have been reading this and the other thread for a while and could no longer fight the urge to comment. I am a bear fan but I do not have, as is so commonly put on this board "a dog in the flight". I am frustrated with the current state of where we are at, but I am not ready to pin this on one person or group of people. I am not trying to insult anyone or indicate that I think their opinion is wrong. I am just offering my insight and opinion, so please disagree with class if you so choose.

The largest argument seems to be the disagreement between who is at fault for the current state of the program's tailspin. Is it the coaches? Is it the players? Is it the parents coddling their kids? Is it the administration? My opinion is that is a little bit of each. Whenever a proud and tradition-laden program such as Waynedale football goes into a losing skid, everything gets magnified. I am sure the coaches can probably improve in motivation and game decisions. The kids can work harder and hold themselves and one another more accountable. I do not want to comment on the parents because I am a parent and I know it is sometimes hard to step back and be objective. The administration is being supportive of its coaches, as they should be. Coaching is difficult and having an administration that has your back is important.

Putting the hopes of turning this around should not be placed on one class of kids. It is unfair and sets up unrealistic and sometimes difficult expectations to live up to. The freshmen class is talented, but I agree that one class of players will not "fix" everything. I do not know how much talent is in each class. But I have seen in the past that the biggest time for improvement is in the off-season. Once the season is over, I think the coaching staff will step back and evaluate what improvements need to be made so that we begin to move in the right direction. Does that mean Coach Z has to change the way he interacts with the kids? Does that mean that the kids need a bit more space? Does that mean we need to double the effort? Does that mean we need to have an in-school recruiting session to increase numbers? I don't know the right path, but I trust that steps will be made to move in the right direction. Coach Z can not be pleased with the current state of his program. I feel that he has too much pride and passion to let it continue.

I am discouraged to see what the losing is doing to the community. I know that not everyone in the community cares about Waynedale football. But this community has always been one that has shown support to our young people, no matter how difficult. We pass levies even though it strains our wallets to do so. We pay admission to watch and cheer. We give money to fundraisers, to the booster club, to the PTO, to the band, to choir, or whatever group needs support. We give our time to show our young people that they are important to us, regardless of how they are doing. This support is one of the things that makes me proud to be a part of. I am proud to be a bear! I am proud that my kids go to school in Southeast Local Schools. As adults, as parents, as alumni, whatever we may be, we need to show our young people that we care and support them regardless of the record. No one wants dirt kicked in their face when they are already on the ground. Let's pick up and support our young people and coaches. As crazy as this sounds, it is good to see so much frustration from people. It shows that we still care.

I think the place to start in fixing the problem is at the foundation. We need to work with our youth football players and teach them what being a Golden Bear football player means. (This goes for all sports, but the focus is football in this thread). We need to teach fundamentals, like how to line up in a stance, how to fire off and block on the snap, how to wrap up and tackle with good fundamentals that emphasize safety. We also need to re-teach our youth to compete! We need to teach them that football is an aggressive sport and it is ok to play with passion and ferocity. They need to learn to expect success every time they step on the field. We need to teach them to expect to win, but to accept losing with sportsmanship and understand that losing is a part of athletics. However, we need to teach our kids not to be satisfied with losing or failure, but rather to let it serve as motivation for improvement. Win with class, lose with class, but play with passion and emotion. We need to teach our youth about the tradition of Waynedale football and what it means to be a Golden Bear football player. Our kids need to embrace the tradition so that they can better understand why they are working to be excellent. If anyone wants to be part of the solution, then volunteer to coach the youth! As these kids grow, learn and improve they continue to feed the high school program with players that are prepared to be successful. We can not wait until they are in middle school or freshmen to begin molding them.

I will step off my soap box and prepare for the backlash of insult that is headed my way. I have big shoulders and I can handle it. Please be classy though. I will leave you all with this....The best cure for all that ails is a win! Let's hope that tonight is the night against the Huskies. Good luck to both teams. Play hard, be safe and GO BEARS!!!!!!

Reps! I completely agree with what you are saying and your plan to get his back on track but I can tell you this. A lot of this happens now and I don't mean to beat a dead horse here but we must ALL work together on this. This must be a TEAM effort. I won't point fingers but if you have read most of my posts you will realize where it must all start. Like you said..."at the foundation".

You tell me where that foundation starts?

wcalfan;1293479 wrote:Reps! I completely agree with what you are saying and your plan to get his back on track but I can tell you this. A lot of this happens now and I don't mean to beat a dead horse here but we must ALL work together on this. This must be a TEAM effort. I won't point fingers but if you have read most of my posts you will realize where it must all start. Like you said..."at the foundation".

You tell me where that foundation starts?

I think he did when right after he stated fixing it at the foundation, he started talking about what was needed to be done with the youth program.

Greatwhite;1293547 wrote:I think he did when right after he stated fixing it at the foundation, he started talking about what was needed to be done with the youth program.

I know what he was saying...however, I really think it starts WELL before our youth program.

Does the foundation start at home???

Who is running the youth program currently?

Not sure who excatly is running the program. There are some good dads that are working hard., but the more minds the better. I am sure that a young, energetic, former Waynedale football player that wants to be involved will be welcomed with open arms though.

was_that_it;1293592 wrote:Does the foundation start at home???

WINNER...WINNER...WINNER!!!

Keep the good chatter coming.

It beats the hell out of all the negativity. Construction criticism fixes things.

PC123526;1293601 wrote:Not sure who excatly is running the program. There are some good dads that are working hard., but the more minds the better. I am sure that a young, energetic, former Waynedale football player that wants to be involved will be welcomed with open arms though.

I'm sure there are a few floating around that area still.

NO! Not what I meant at all. I guess the sarcasm was missed. It was an attempt to rile the beast from his sleep. A follow up to the list that fun posted. As in do we replace 13 coaches because other then Mr. Stanley, that list is quite scary!

Jmar25;1293382 wrote:I agree with a lot of that philosophy. Peers influence their peers more than the "authority" influences. There is validity in that statement. What will bode well for the freshmen group is they are similar to many of the great classes before them... They tend to hangout with each other all the time and surround themselves with each other instead of those with the bad habits you speak of. I think their bonds to each other override the classes before them. I can think of one group who was very similar to this. Surrounded by nothing ahead and nothing behind except the incoming freshmen class and they were ALWAYS TOGETHER... Were highly successful in all sports as well.


The freshman class is talented. In football it takes talent in other classes that surround to be successful. This class may not show up until their senior year. Ahead of them I don't see a lot of help. They might have some minor success until the junior year. I don't think that any kid is ready for varsity football until their senior year. Physically they aren't ready until junior year but it takes a year to adjust to the speed and ferosity of the varsity level.

The other problem I can foresee is size. Most of the kids we are talking about in that class..... Are "skill" players. Similiar to this years team. I haven't seen the JV play so I will be up front and say I don't know what this class has up front. It does however sound like the freshmen have more "football" players than this senior class. I am interested in how it will shake out the next few years for this freshmen group. I think in the smaller/individual sports this class will surely shine... Football.... might not be as great as we think.

Well... all our coaches haven't had success in the last 4 or 5 years except for Louie Stanley.... they must be bad then. That is the logical conclusion from your statement. Would I be correct with that conclusion?

One more thing- where have all the big farm kids gone, Size, hard to compete when everyone is under 200 lbs. this freshmen class gonna beef up alittle?

Jmar25;1293382 wrote:I agree with a lot of that philosophy. Peers influence their peers more than the "authority" influences. There is validity in that statement. What will bode well for the freshmen group is they are similar to many of the great classes before them... They tend to hangout with each other all the time and surround themselves with each other instead of those with the bad habits you speak of. I think their bonds to each other override the classes before them. I can think of one group who was very similar to this. Surrounded by nothing ahead and nothing behind except the incoming freshmen class and they were ALWAYS TOGETHER... Were highly successful in all sports as well.


The freshman class is talented. In football it takes talent in other classes that surround to be successful. This class may not show up until their senior year. Ahead of them I don't see a lot of help. They might have some minor success until the junior year. I don't think that any kid is ready for varsity football until their senior year. Physically they aren't ready until junior year but it takes a year to adjust to the speed and ferosity of the varsity level.

The other problem I can foresee is size. Most of the kids we are talking about in that class..... Are "skill" players. Similiar to this years team. I haven't seen the JV play so I will be up front and say I don't know what this class has up front. It does however sound like the freshmen have more "football" players than this senior class. I am interested in how it will shake out the next few years for this freshmen group. I think in the smaller/individual sports this class will surely shine... Football.... might not be as great as we think.

Well... all our coaches haven't had success in the last 4 or 5 years except for Louie Stanley.... they must be bad then. That is the logical conclusion from your statement. Would I be correct with that conclusion?

So tonight's game is on CPI, eh? Cool! Looking forward to the replay. Good luck Waynedale!

Well........There may be hope for the future. I went and watched the JV play this morning. They lost 18 to 12 but it was like watching a completely different squad than what has played the last few weeks. Things seemed to click better. The boys were playing with unity, heart and aggression. Lester played well and Cottrill and Wirth really stepped it up this game! Reibe looked more comfortable and had some really nice passes. The Oand D line still looked weak but the linebackers came to play. The kicker even looked better. A loss is a loss but it was a much better looking loss. Just my opinion.

Buckz#1;1294451 wrote:Well........There may be hope for the future. I went and watched the JV play this morning. They lost 18 to 12 but it was like watching a completely different squad than what has played the last few weeks. Things seemed to click better. The boys were playing with unity, heart and aggression. Lester played well and Cottrill and Wirth really stepped it up this game! Reibe looked more comfortable and had some really nice passes. The Oand D line still looked weak but the linebackers came to play. The kicker even looked better. A loss is a loss but it was a much better looking loss. Just my opinion.

Didn't go this morning. Did Strausbaugh #2 play?

No. Dad said he was out with a possible concussion from the night before.

Heard a few "rumors" today. Lastnight one of the seniors walked off the field and quit the team. And Strausbaugh #2 is done for the year because of a concussion. Anyone else have an insight?

yes, he quit. not sure about concussion.

Buckz#1;1296825 wrote:Heard a few "rumors" today. Lastnight one of the seniors walked off the field and quit the team. And Strausbaugh #2 is done for the year because of a concussion. Anyone else have an insight?