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Question about a rule in little league baseball

Home ▸ Archive ▸ Serious Business ▸ Question about a rule in little league baseball
T

thavoice

Senior Member

14,376 posts
May 8, 2012 11:56 AM
WebFire;1165090 wrote:Good teaching moment totally screwed up by that coach. Those are the types you don't want coaching your kids.
It totally frustrates me watching them play. What tops it off was this play happened when he had a kid do a straight steal of home. The catcher caught it, stood up, took a step out to get ready for the slide and kid ran him over. A straight steal of home? He tries to do that often and it rarely works.

I am only a step dad, and I also said i would never be that dad who was a jerk as I had a few of them when I coached, but when they dont teach fundamentals drives me insane. Last game went to was bases loaded. Hit to center field. CF field it throws into home plate. Who is there as the cutoff guy? The pitcher. Where was the first baseman? Picking his ass. Ball ends up getting passed the catcher so there was no one backing it up..no one where they are suppsed to be. So what does the coach do...comes out and blasts the players for the bad throws. NOTHING about having NONE of the kids in the right positions.

We always, as coaches, said that mistakes will happen, but at least be where you are supposed to be. Bad throw? Sucks, but they happen.
May 8, 2012 11:56am
J

jmog

Senior Member

6,567 posts
May 8, 2012 11:57 AM
justincredible;1165066 wrote:Yeah, this is my problem with it. I'm glad baseball hadn't been pussified before I stopped playing.
Justin...you are younger than me I believe and this has been the rule for long before I played LL.
May 8, 2012 11:57am
C

Con_Alma

Senior Member

12,198 posts
May 8, 2012 11:57 AM
jmog;1165097 wrote:Doesn't have to have the ball but has to be in the process of receiving the ball. As in the throw is almost home. You can block the plate without the ball but the ball better be on the way to you from an infielder or the catcher can be called for obstruction.
Not in little league you can't...although it's a judgement call and I wouldn't imagine in the spirit of the game an umpire would call a catcher for obstruction if he was just about to receive the ball.
May 8, 2012 11:57am
T

thavoice

Senior Member

14,376 posts
May 8, 2012 11:58 AM
sleeper;1165100 wrote:Here's a Q:

Why don't high school teams just getting a 300lb person to sit on home plate? No runs will ever be scored, ever.
Sure there would be. If he blocks the plate without the ball the umpire should warn him about it and then can start awarding the runs on obstrction.

PLus....every player who got one would be stealing second and third. And I bet his blocking skills would suck so passed balls would score even more runs.
May 8, 2012 11:58am
J

jmog

Senior Member

6,567 posts
May 8, 2012 11:59 AM
sleeper;1165100 wrote:Here's a Q:

Why don't high school teams just getting a 300lb person to sit on home plate? No runs will ever be scored, ever.
You don't understand the rules if you believe this. Obstruction rules still apply to the catcher.
May 8, 2012 11:59am
sleeper's avatar

sleeper

Legend

27,879 posts
May 8, 2012 11:59 AM
thavoice;1165108 wrote:Sure there would be. If he blocks the plate without the ball the umpire should warn him about it and then can start awarding the runs on obstrction.

PLus....every player who got one would be stealing second and third. And I bet his blocking skills would suck so passed balls would score even more runs.
He's 300lb. The ball would absorb into his body.
May 8, 2012 11:59am
T

thavoice

Senior Member

14,376 posts
May 8, 2012 11:59 AM
jmog;1165097 wrote:Doesn't have to have the ball but has to be in the process of receiving the ball. As in the throw is almost home. You can block the plate without the ball but the ball better be on the way to you from an infielder or the catcher can be called for obstruction.
Typically what a catcher will do is place himself in front of the plate, just to the 3rd base side of it. WHen the ball is in flight to home you plant your foot at the front corner of the plate and catch and tag
May 8, 2012 11:59am
sleeper's avatar

sleeper

Legend

27,879 posts
May 8, 2012 11:59 AM
jmog;1165110 wrote:You don't understand the rules if you believe this. Obstruction rules still apply to the catcher.
I think I understand perfectly, thanks.
May 8, 2012 11:59am
T

thavoice

Senior Member

14,376 posts
May 8, 2012 12:01 PM
sleeper;1165111 wrote:He's 300lb. The ball would absorb into his body.
The bad pitches would get past him. DOnt be a fucktard.
May 8, 2012 12:01pm
J

jmog

Senior Member

6,567 posts
May 8, 2012 12:01 PM
Con_Alma;1165105 wrote:Not in little league you can't...although it's a judgement call and I wouldn't imagine in the spirit of the game an umpire would call a catcher for obstruction if he was just about to receive the ball.
Yes you can. If the ball is imminant or close.
May 8, 2012 12:01pm
S

Sonofanump

May 8, 2012 12:01 PM
Knowing the rules is half the battle.
May 8, 2012 12:01pm
justincredible's avatar

justincredible

Nick Mangold

32,056 posts
May 8, 2012 12:02 PM
jmog;1165103 wrote:Justin...you are younger than me I believe and this has been the rule for long before I played LL.
I don't remember ever getting ejected from games and I know I was involved in a few collisions at the plate.
May 8, 2012 12:02pm
T

thavoice

Senior Member

14,376 posts
May 8, 2012 12:02 PM
jmog;1165103 wrote:Justin...you are younger than me I believe and this has been the rule for long before I played LL.
Yeah, no shit. I Know when I played LL in the 80's you couldnt run over the catchers.
May 8, 2012 12:02pm
sleeper's avatar

sleeper

Legend

27,879 posts
May 8, 2012 12:03 PM
thavoice;1165115 wrote:The bad pitches would get past him. DOnt be a fucktard.
But he has the plate blocked. The pitcher could run to get the ball and toss it to him.

I think I'm going to sign up as a high school baseball coach and win multiple state championships.
May 8, 2012 12:03pm
T

thavoice

Senior Member

14,376 posts
May 8, 2012 12:04 PM
justincredible;1165119 wrote:I don't remember ever getting ejected from games and I know I was involved in a few collisions at the plate.
Not every collission results in an ejection. Matter of fact...I would think over all the seasons I coached I would say most didnt result in a kid getting kicked out. MOST are pretty much unavoidable with the throw leading the catcher into the basepath and the runner not having adequte time to slide/get outta they way
May 8, 2012 12:04pm
J

jmog

Senior Member

6,567 posts
May 8, 2012 12:05 PM
thavoice;1165113 wrote:Typically what a catcher will do is place himself in front of the plate, just to the 3rd base side of it. WHen the ball is in flight to home you plant your foot at the front corner of the plate and catch and tag
I always did it with my foot just on the 3rd base side of the plate. As I was receiving the ball I would catch/tag/drop my left knee to block the plate all in one motion.
May 8, 2012 12:05pm
McFly1955's avatar

McFly1955

Senior Member

1,441 posts
May 8, 2012 12:07 PM
I plowed (sort of) the catcher in 8th grade travel ball with the same type of no plowing the catcher rule, but I was not called out.

It was the summer league state championship game, I was the leadoff batter in the first inning (cool story, bro). I got a hit -- next batter hit a double, I'm rounding third and headed home, as I approach the catcher he comes up the line about 2-3 feet and jumps to catch a high throw to home, I lower my head and clip his thigh area and send him flipping. I tumble and roll next to the plate and slap it with my hand and am called safe. Other coach goes out to argue, we all LOL in the dugout, and we go on to lose.
May 8, 2012 12:07pm
T

thavoice

Senior Member

14,376 posts
May 8, 2012 12:09 PM
McFly1955;1165127 wrote:I plowed (sort of) the catcher in 8th grade travel ball with the same type of no plowing the catcher rule, but I was not called out.

It was the summer league state championship game, I was the leadoff batter in the first inning (cool story, bro). I got a hit -- next batter hit a double, I'm rounding third and headed home, as I approach the catcher he comes up the line about 2-3 feet and jumps to catch a high throw to home, I lower my head and clip his thigh area and send him flipping. I tumble and roll next to the plate and slap it with my hand and am called safe. Other coach goes out to argue, we all LOL in the dugout, and we go on to lose.
Very well could have been ruled kinda like I mentioned.....many collisions happen when the throw isnt online to the plate. The runner has an area that he typically will slide at, but when the throw comse up the line like that it makes it almost unavoidable.
May 8, 2012 12:09pm
C

Con_Alma

Senior Member

12,198 posts
May 8, 2012 12:10 PM
Maybe I'm just not interpreting it correctly.

Obstruction – Rule 2.00 and 7.06

Like interference, this is a tough call when there is no contact. If a runner has to slow down or stop because of a fielder's action OTHER THAN fielding a batted ball, you have obstruction. Examples of obstruction that are not so obvious:
A fielder boots the initial play, and then gets in the runner's way as he goes after the ball. No interference here on the runner because the fielder booted the ball. The fielder is only “protected” on the initial play, not a subsequent play after his error.
A batter-runner has to slow down on his way to first because the first baseman is standing on the base. This happens a lot in the lower divisions.
A fielder stands in the baseline or puts his leg down and blocks the base or plate well before he has the ball. A fielder cannot block the base while he is waiting for the throw to come in.
Remember that there are two types of obstruction: Type A, where the defense is making a play on the obstructed runner (immediate dead ball), and Type B where the runner is obstructed while play is going on elsewhere (play goes on).

It does say the following in the must slide section...
Must-slide rule (7.08a3):
There is no must-slide rule in Little League. Never has been. Never will be.
The runner has three options when the fielder HAS THE BALL AND IS WAITING TO MAKE THE TAG: slide, attempt to get around the fielder, or go back to the previous base. If the runner does neither and goes in standing up, he's out. But if he attempts to get around and successfully avoids the tag without going out of the baseline, he's safe.
Remember, the fielder must have the ball and be waiting to make the tag.
If the ball is on its way to the base, or the ball and runner get there simultaneously, and there's contact because the runner didn’t slide or attempt to get around, this is just a collision.
May 8, 2012 12:10pm
C

Con_Alma

Senior Member

12,198 posts
May 8, 2012 12:11 PM
thavoice;1165123 wrote:Not every collission results in an ejection. ...
Agreed.
May 8, 2012 12:11pm
sleeper's avatar

sleeper

Legend

27,879 posts
May 8, 2012 12:11 PM
I think we should wait for LJ to give an answer on this topic. I think he used to be an umpire for baseball before he went to 'nam.
May 8, 2012 12:11pm
J

jmog

Senior Member

6,567 posts
May 8, 2012 12:12 PM
McFly1955;1165127 wrote:I plowed (sort of) the catcher in 8th grade travel ball with the same type of no plowing the catcher rule, but I was not called out.

It was the summer league state championship game, I was the leadoff batter in the first inning (cool story, bro). I got a hit -- next batter hit a double, I'm rounding third and headed home, as I approach the catcher he comes up the line about 2-3 feet and jumps to catch a high throw to home, I lower my head and clip his thigh area and send him flipping. I tumble and roll next to the plate and slap it with my hand and am called safe. Other coach goes out to argue, we all LOL in the dugout, and we go on to lose.
Cool story bro!

Seriously though, as you describe it that was not barreling. Bad through brought the catcher up the base path and you appeared to try to duck under him jumping.

Ejectionable is when the catcher has the ball, is waiting, and you run them over like you see in MLB.
May 8, 2012 12:12pm
J

jmog

Senior Member

6,567 posts
May 8, 2012 12:15 PM
ConAlma, the part that says "well before" in your bolder is key.

When I umped at one rules interpretation meeting it was described as obstruction if the ball isn't at least halfway from a base 45 ft or so to home. Aka not imminent.

You can't be blocking if the ball is still in the outfield
May 8, 2012 12:15pm
T

thavoice

Senior Member

14,376 posts
May 8, 2012 12:16 PM
Con alma.....I think some operative phrase is blocks the plate WELL before he has the ball. The ball in flight probably isnt considered WELL before he has the ball.

I at times talk to umpires about a similiar situation at first base on throws from the pitcher. A number of first baseman put their foot on the side of the base to keep the runner from sliding back and touching the base safely. WHen this occurs I always brought it to the ump and he would instruct the first baseman that if he does that he can call the runner safe, but if he puts his foot there after the ball is thrown it wont get called.


and lets not forget...who usually are umpiring little league games? Most times I see HS kids or just outta HS
May 8, 2012 12:16pm
C

Con_Alma

Senior Member

12,198 posts
May 8, 2012 12:19 PM
I agree whcih is why I stated that maybe I was not inturpreting it correctly and then showed the rule stating that a collision when both are carrying out their position in the base path is just a collision.
May 8, 2012 12:19pm