hoops23;1155898 wrote:So, do QB's decide Super Bowls? What decides Super Bowls? Eli Manning has two Super Bowl rings, but people always credit the run game and defense for both his wins, mixed in with some timely throws by Eli.

Peyton is arguably the best QB of our generation and he has 1 ring to show for it....

As I said before, Rivers, Ryan, Flacco, Sanchez, Cutler, Romo, Vick, Young, Leinert, etc... None of them have really made much noise in the postseason...


So what decides Super Bowls?

Trent Richardson was a no brainer. No way that pick should get anything less than an A. And so what if we gave up ATL's 4th, our 5th and 7th? We basically got the 4th back.

People will bitch when the Browns trade down, such as last year when we traded down and selected Phil Taylor. They bitched because we didn't draft Julio.

When the Browns actually move up to get their guy, people still bitch.

It's amazing.

And who the fuck is Pete Prisco? He sounds like a dumb shit.

well, Peter King is much more respected kinda said the same thing. He had stats that showed that most the playoff teams didn't have an elite 3 down back. But he did fail to mention that these teams did have very good running "by committee". Anyhow, I like the Richardson pick, but I would have been fine with Blackmon as well. The NFL is def geared towards passing now...but I think Trich helps us out there...since he is a very good receiving back.

Probably why Baltimore hasn't been to a Super Bowl... Ray Rice is holding them back.

hoops23;1155903 wrote:Probably why Baltimore hasn't been to a Super Bowl... Ray Rice is holding them back.

lol

hoops23;1155898 wrote:So, do QB's decide Super Bowls? What decides Super Bowls? Eli Manning has two Super Bowl rings, but people always credit the run game and defense for both his wins, mixed in with some timely throws by Eli.

Peyton is arguably the best QB of our generation and he has 1 ring to show for it....

As I said before, Rivers, Ryan, Flacco, Sanchez, Cutler, Romo, Vick, Young, Leinert, etc... None of them have really made much noise in the postseason...


So what decides Super Bowls?

Trent Richardson was a no brainer. No way that pick should get anything less than an A. And so what if we gave up ATL's 4th, our 5th and 7th? We basically got the 4th back.

People will bitch when the Browns trade down, such as last year when we traded down and selected Phil Taylor. They bitched because we didn't draft Julio.

When the Browns actually move up to get their guy, people still bitch.

It's amazing.

And who the fuck is Pete Prisco? He sounds like a dumb shit.

I'm very probably too drunk to reasonably answer you right now... but here goes:

Pete Prisco is a national writer for CBS Sports. I admittedly typed "NFL draft grades" into google to look for unbiased opinions, and clicked the first link that was a) not bleacher report, and b) not for day 1 only (I was looking at his grades for round 2 (B+ I think) and 3 (C+ maybe? Which is way too high)), but I checked day 1 too out of curiosity, and it fit into S&L's point.

There have pretty clearly been 2 things to decide Super Bowls over the last decade: defenses and QBs. You either need a great QB (Brady, Peyton, Brees, Rodgers), a great D (Baltimore, Tampa), or be very solid in both (Pittsburgh, Giants). I'm not a big Eli fan, but I don't deny his playoff numbers. He's been awesome in the postseason. The Giants D sucked for most of the year, but plenty of people talked over the last 2-3 weeks of the season and the playoffs about how much better the Giants defense was playing, and they carried them for a lot of the 1st Super Bowl run.

The issue wasn't the picks that were given up, it was giving up picks at all. Let alone 3 of them. For 1 spot. For a position that isn't make or break in the NFL anymore.

If you think an RB will put the Browns over the top, I would ask for 1 example of that happening in the last 10 years. C is definitely low, but A is definitely high in my opinion. The league is different now then it was even when AP was drafted.

I know this comment wasn't directed right at me, but I've been saying for months that I didn't think there was great value to be had at #4 and my ideal scenario was to trade down and add another 2nd round pick.

Also, why bring up Young (backup), Leinart (backup), Sanchez (running out of chances), or Cutler (hugely overrated from the time he was drafted)? They were high picks, but not good players. Just because some QBs bust doesn't mean QB isn't a position that can put a team over the top. Only 1 team wins the Super Bowl every year, but Vick is 53-37-1 as a starter, Rivers is 63-33, and Romo is 47-30, so even the legitimate QBs that aren't winning are putting their teams in position to at least compete more often then not.

By my math, 8 of the top 10 QBs in passing yards made the playoffs last year, and 9/10 went 8-8 or better (Cam Newton the only one who didn't at 6-10).

5 of the top 10 in rushing yards missed the playoffs (as did 11, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, and 18). Steven Jackson, MJD, and Marshawn Lynch won 2, 5, and 7 games. You need to be able to run some, but a stud running back hasn't been a difference maker in so long that I don't know how you could possibly argue that.

I can't believe how bad we've drafted. I mean, you could hire me as GM and I honestly would have done a better job than these asshats

So at the end of this 5 year plan are we supposed to be in Super Bowl contention or was the plan to get us to 8-8? Using a 3 rounder for depth when we still need starters is inexplicable.

Every time before they pick, they should just look at Kipers best available and pick him. It can't be much worse.

The Vikings are still laughing....

After Richardson this draft went downhill fast. I didn't have time to post much yesterday, but listening to the radio, I was flabbergasted listening to the guys on KNR gush over the Browns draft on day 1. Not sure what they were smoking....but it must have been good stuff. To listen to them gush over spending #22 on a 29 year old QB....WTF? Yeah, I know that Colt McCoy is probably not the long term answer, but drafting an old QB at #22 was a luxury this team could not afford.

Browsing thru this thread...the guy who made the most sense, suggested that we should have stocked the other postions and then searched for the 'franchise" QB in year 2 if McCoy proved inadequate. Even the Richardson pick wasn't really that good, as we gave up picks just to insure that we got him. A better strategy might have been just take the best player at #4 (probably Claibourne or Blackmon), maybe use the picks burned on TR on to move up from #22(or not, and just stay at #22).. and take the best player there.....then keep drafting the best player available. Then, after you have restocked the team in general, next year (year#2)you could target individual players according to the team's much smaller need.

By drafting Weeden at #22, the Browns 'waste' McCoy( if you could believe that) because now they must trade him (or worse, cut him). No one, is going to give the Browns anything for him ...not because McCoy sucks that bad(at worst, he'd be one of the best backup QB's in the league)...but because of the situation the Browns have put themselves in.

SMH. All these picks...all they had to do was not muck this up....yet somehow they managed to do just that.

derek bomar;1155928 wrote:I can't believe how bad we've drafted. I mean, you could hire me as GM and I honestly would have done a better job than these asshats

LOL GTFO :laugh:

Best available players left...

http://rotoworld.com/articles/nfl/40433/60/best-players-left-on-day-3

Lot of good players left. I like the Boise St. S , Marvin Jones WR , Joe "The Jet" Adams WR ,Chris Givens Wr, and Alfonzo Dennard cb

We need to be looking for WR, LB, CB today...

I didn't know the Browns turned the draft into their own personal charity...

Hughes: "Honestly, I invited all of my family to come over tomorrow morning to watch the draft, so I was thinking more fourth round."

http://www.cleveland.com/ohio-sports-blog/index.ssf/2012/04/john_hughes_selected_by_clevel.html

Yeah , I really didn't understand the Hughes pick at all

Wow...just read that Heckert would've taken Hughes at 67 but "rolled the dice" by trading down to 87 and still getting him?

Mr Miyagi;1155952 wrote:Lot of good players left. I like the Boise St. S , Marvin Jones WR , Joe "The Jet" Adams WR ,Chris Givens Wr, and Alfonzo Dennard cb

I have a feeling we may see two WR's with the next two picks.

Rotinaj;1155931 wrote:So at the end of this 5 year plan are we supposed to be in Super Bowl contention or was the plan to get us to 8-8? Using a 3 rounder for depth when we still need starters is inexplicable.

The 5 year plan is to make people like footwedge and QQpride excited by year 5!

BR1986FB;1155949 wrote:Best available players left...

http://rotoworld.com/articles/nfl/40433/60/best-players-left-on-day-3

What about Ronnel Lewis, OLB form Oklahoma?

I bet we draft a WR today!

HitsRus;1155961 wrote:I bet we draft a WR today!

At this point, I would take an OLB before a WR.

BR1986FB;1155948 wrote:LOL GTFO :laugh:

srsly. You GTFO if you think we've done well.

derek bomar;1155963 wrote:srsly. You GTFO if you think we've done well.

I'm just cracking up at ALL of the QQing on this thread. Before this draft Heckert was the "savior' (except for maybe Mulva who has been critical of this regime from the start) and had done "great' even though the 2010 draft, save Joe Haden, looks like it sucked and now he's a "bum" and everyone seems to think they can draft better than him. Quite comical. I'm enjoying it, tbh. Everyone who thought Heckert was awesome now seems to have turned on him.

Anyone know if there is a reason Joe Adams is still around? Injuries? He seemed like a solid WR for Arkansas. Wouldn't mind seeing the Browns draft him.

BR1986FB;1155964 wrote:I'm just cracking up at ALL of the QQing on this thread. Before this draft Heckert was the "savior' (except for maybe Mulva who has been critical of this regime from the start) and had done "great' even though the 2010 draft, save Joe Haden, looks like it sucked and now he's a "bum" and everyone seems to think they can draft better than him. Quite comical. I'm enjoying it, tbh. Everyone who thought Heckert was awesome now seems to have turned on him.

Yes, after the Weeden pick, I became less sure of his decision making. That's how you make your judgements on a GM. How else are we supposed to make a judgement? Base it on how fat he is become since he came to Cleveland lol?

I said it before, and I will say it again. If Weeden, and these other picks (i actually talked myself into schwartz) pan out, I will happily eat crow.

mucalum49;1155965 wrote:Anyone know if there is a reason Joe Adams is still around? Injuries? He seemed like a solid WR for Arkansas. Wouldn't mind seeing the Browns draft him.

I don't know, but I have the same question about Massie. Why is he still available?