eyes r burning;1273172 wrote:Not a coach as you are, BUT if i was going to put this one o-line, maybe i would go power I, left, right up the middle, power left, power I right, mix in the pass. That way you have a couple extra blockers to create the crease, when the decide to put 9 or 10 in the box to stop it THROW, love talking with, its really pretty simple, but so am I, maybe you sould walk over to the fence sometime!

and you also rin a sweep out of this! but lets go in motion and hand the ball off that way, supprise!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I don't know all the issues, but I've seen the team, Urban Meyer would have a hard time going 3-7 with the line play I saw.

wcalfan;1273156 wrote:Not that it looks a whole lot better but your numbers are wrong. 7th/8th have won a game each (both vs. Rittman) and the 9th graders are 2-1.

What about these current 9th graders that didn't lose a game in middle school? They were running "the system" and it seemed to work for them. Hmmmm. It all goes back to the simple fact that you must have good players to win games. There is no other way around it and right now we just don't have enough of them in the upper grades.

Great we beat Rittman, your digging your own hole here. Winning breeds winning, losising does the same, if we are waiting on the next great class, who are we kidding?

I have heard about kids quitting and what not but I never get a true answer. It's always some lame horrible excuse. If the only reason kids are quitting is because the coach is a "jerk"... what are you going to do then? I can honestly say I don't see much of a difference in his style and louie/erich. They all care about the program and kids. They all get on the kids and try to get the best out of them. Erich is on the more wound up and in your face style... Louie is the zen master... Z is somewhere in between. I just don't understand how he is running them off but it is something that I keep hearing people say. I would love to hear specific and valid reasons

iced earth;1273182 wrote:I don't know all the issues, but I've seen the team, Urban Meyer would have a hard time going 3-7 with the line play I saw.

Ice are you kidding me! If you not have a line POWER I its pretty simple, lets just run the same thing and blame it on the line.

Jmar25;1273185 wrote:I have heard about kids quitting and what not but I never get a true answer. It's always some lame horrible excuse. If the only reason kids are quitting is because the coach is a "jerk"... what are you going to do then? I can honestly say I don't see much of a difference in his style and louie/erich. They all care about the program and kids. They all get on the kids and try to get the best out of them. Erich is on the more wound up and in your face style... Louie is the zen master... Z is somewhere in between. I just don't understand how he is running them off but it is something that I keep hearing people say. I would love to hear specific and valid reasons

Pretty sure you have come acrosse this type of person before, if not in sports in business it never works

eyes r burning;1273172 wrote:Not a coach as you are, BUT if i was going to put this one o-line, maybe i would go power I, left, right up the middle, power left, power I right, mix in the pass. That way you have a couple extra blockers to create the crease, when the decide to put 9 or 10 in the box to stop it THROW, love talking with, its really pretty simple, but so am I, maybe you sould walk over to the fence sometime!

Sounds nice in theory but the fact is you need some power to run power. They are better off in a spread offense where line blocking is more technique than anything. Even a triple option offense where it's dive dive dive chuck it and forces the defense to play on it's heels and it's responsibilities. Al la air force or georgia tech

eyes r burning;1273069 wrote:You are very right on this one, it takes time erode a progarm and as you said it would be hard for someone to work into a program that is bordering on collaspe, just ask Mr. Wolf. We are almost there another year or two.
And I read something else you mentioned this senior class has never won from want I heard some parents say is the class won all leauge games as freshmen but they are missing some who decide football was not for them OR they have no respect for Z.
Z was a heck of a football player really enjoyed watcing him play, but that does not make you a great coach or even a good one, if you have boys giving up sports because of a coach that is a problem in sports and bussiness, and if your talking about one or two kids but we are not its many. Love chatting with you!!

Bordering on collapse? Seriously? Are you really comparing us to Chippewa? He won 2 league titles recently and 3 playoff appearances. 2 years ago was rough, last year was 6-4 and this year is rough. It's not like we will lose 20+ league games in a row though. Next year should be a little better and then the following 2 years should be very good. As long as these 9th grade parents don't listen to and follow parents like yourself.

These seniors played 4 WCAL teams their freshmen year, so let's not crown them league champs that year quite yet. Not every school fielded a team. Get your facts straight. Plus, let's be honest here. Freshman WCAL championships (in any sport) don't mean a heck of a lot since a lot of schools move up their best players. That happens a lot in this league since we are talking about a small school league and roster numbers aren't huge. Don't get too excited their big guy.

What seniors are we missing that would really help us on Friday nights? Please enlighten me! My favorite quote from you is this..."if you have boys giving up sports because of a coach that is a problem in sports and bussiness (sp!)" That's a problem alright...it's called a parental problem. Just a poor excuse for not wanting to work hard and reap the rewards of that hard work. That's a cop out! Plain and simple and it is becoming a familiar theme throughout our society. It is sad! Us "old timers" all played for coaches we may not have liked, but you know what? That just made us work harder and become a TEAM. That "hatred" was our motivation to stick together and make things happen.

Please, keep chatting with me.

eyes r burning;1273192 wrote:Pretty sure you have come acrosse this type of person before, if not in sports in business it never works

What type of person is that?

eyes r burning;1273183 wrote:Great we beat Rittman, your digging your own hole here. Winning breeds winning, losising does the same, if we are waiting on the next great class, who are we kidding?

Not digging a hole at all...I listed Rittman in my post for a reason and even said "Not that it looks a whole lot better..."

Finally, I do agree with something you said...winning breeds winning and losing does the same. Schools our size have to wait on good classes. We have to have something to work with. We can't go out and recruit good players. You play with the hand you are dealt with.

eyes r burning;1273192 wrote:Pretty sure you have come acrosse this type of person before, if not in sports in business it never works

Well I've never seen that type of person before within coach z. I'm not there all the time but I find it really hard to believe he is this monster that is such a jerk to kids that makes them all hate him. THEN QUIT. (what a lesson in life that is) If that was the case I'm surprised he still has a team.

Maybe he just expects a higher level of discipline, attitude, work ethic, and common sense that these kids just aren't used to at school. Maybe he doesn't let the inmates run the prison like parents, some teachers, and coaches do?

Yes... I am saying I feel like there is a serious attitude problem kids these days... It's not like how itused to be...even 10 years ago... This problem has slowly been invading southeast local... That I can say is a fact. Lots of egos and baby'n. Not enough reinforcement of proper attitude at home...

Jmar25;1273205 wrote:Well I've never seen that type of person before within coach z. I'm not there all the time but I find it really hard to believe he is this monster that is such a jerk to kids that makes them all hate him. THEN QUIT. (what a lesson in life that is) If that was the case I'm surprised he still has a team.

Maybe he just expects a higher level of discipline, attitude, work ethic, and common sense that these kids just aren't used to at school. Maybe he doesn't let the inmates run the prison like parents, some teachers, and coaches do?

Yes... I am saying I feel like there is a serious attitude problem kids these days... It's not like out used to be...even 10 years ago... This problem has slowly been invading southeast local... That I can say is a fact. Lots of egos and baby'n. Not enough reinforcement of proper attitude at home...

Big time Reps Jmar....amen brother!

eyes r burning;1273172 wrote:Not a coach as you are, BUT if i was going to put this one o-line, maybe i would go power I, left, right up the middle, power left, power I right, mix in the pass. That way you have a couple extra blockers to create the crease, when the decide to put 9 or 10 in the box to stop it THROW, love talking with, its really pretty simple, but so am I, maybe you sould walk over to the fence sometime!

Not a coach here either...just a true Golden Bear. Nice guess though.

I thought I was a true golden bear.....until you informed me I wasn't.:rolleyes:

1_beast;1273212 wrote:I thought I was a true golden bear.....until you informed me I wasn't.:rolleyes:

You are beast...you are

I actually sat through the entire Norwayne/Rittman game on Friday night. It’s hard to take too much away from this game but here are a few thoughts.

Norwayne was not running up the score. The 4[SUP]th[/SUP] string running back was getting 5 to 10 yards per carry up the gut. They could have run the ball boys and scored.

Norwayne carries themselves like a championship team. A lot of confidence but I wouldn’t say overly cocky. They played a very clean game especially since Rittman was very dirty….a lot of late hits and cheap shots.

Norwayne threw very little but they could have thrown for 1000 yards if they wanted to. The OC was actually very gracious by not throwing. I read in the paper Saturday morning that Dreher only completed 11 passes but threw for 260yards. I know at least 2 of those passes were to back up receivers. It was a boring night for the 1[SUP]st[/SUP] stringers but they did all score

Zimmerly is a freight train but then again so was the number 2 guy. Rittman’s defenders were literally moving out of the way of those 2 guys when they carried the ball. It was sad

I’ve now seen Norwayne, Hillsdale, Northwestern and Smithville play. Here are my mid season awards (1 game early)

Best line goes to Norwayne. They are big and experienced and really maintain their blocks. They were only playing Rittman so this could change by the end of the year.

Quarterback. I give the nod to Noletti on this one with Dreher a close second. Noletti is far more athletic and is a threat to run and throw although Dreher is a much better passer. I believe a lot of Norwayne’s passing success is because of the line and the receiving corps

RB – I’m going to go with Tyler Smith on this. He is very versatile and can also catch the ball. Zimmerly is good but anyone can run through gaping holes and I here he doesn’t catch well. Hillsdale also has some quality backs.

Receiver – I don’t see how you don’t go with Brady Berger here. He is big, strong and fast. Rittman doubled teamed him but it didn’t work. I think he only caught 3 passes but they didn’t need him Friday. He’s got huge numbers for a WCAL WR. That’s rare. Norwaynes other 2 receivers are both very good but much smaller

Best defensive player goes to John Zimmerly. He is a beast coming off the edge. He’ll be load for any tackle or TE to block

At this point I don’t see anyone beating Norwayne. They have too many weapons. They are strong in just about every position and they can throw which most teams cant. I’m looking forward to the tail end of the season.

I really thought that both, Dalton and Waynedale would start to turn the corner this year. There is such a huge parity between the top 4 and the bottom 4 in the league. I also believe that we will see some parity between the top 4 very soon. Hillsdale is at Smithville this week and the Smithies have not beaten them in 5 years. Over the last 10 years Hillsdale has won 6 and lost 4 to the Smithies. I think that Smithville will have to play above their abilities to have a chance. I can't seem to get a handle on this years Smithies, they looked very bad against loudonville and Mogadore, then looked much improved against Fairless and Waynedale, but the last 2 teams have been struggling this year. I guess this game will show us if they have improved.

oldsmithie;1273440 wrote:I really thought that both, Dalton and Waynedale would start to turn the corner this year. There is such a huge parity between the top 4 and the bottom 4 in the league. I also believe that we will see some parity between the top 4 very soon. Hillsdale is at Smithville this week and the Smithies have not beaten them in 5 years. Over the last 10 years Hillsdale has won 6 and lost 4 to the Smithies. I think that Smithville will have to play above their abilities to have a chance. I can't seem to get a handle on this years Smithies, they looked very bad against loudonville and Mogadore, then looked much improved against Fairless and Waynedale, but the last 2 teams have been struggling this year. I guess this game will show us if they have improved.

This is very similar to my thoughts, which will be blogged tomorrow after tonight's MNF game (last game of the week 4 pick'em). WCAL is getting very interesting!

oldsmithie;1273440 wrote:I really thought that both, Dalton and Waynedale would start to turn the corner this year. There is such a huge parity between the top 4 and the bottom 4 in the league. I also believe that we will see some parity between the top 4 very soon. Hillsdale is at Smithville this week and the Smithies have not beaten them in 5 years. Over the last 10 years Hillsdale has won 6 and lost 4 to the Smithies. I think that Smithville will have to play above their abilities to have a chance. I can't seem to get a handle on this years Smithies, they looked very bad against loudonville and Mogadore, then looked much improved against Fairless and Waynedale, but the last 2 teams have been struggling this year. I guess this game will show us if they have improved.

thePITman;1273457 wrote:This is very similar to my thoughts, which will be blogged tomorrow after tonight's MNF game (last game of the week 4 pick'em). WCAL is getting very interesting!

I honestly think this Smithies team has established itself as a decent team. So far, they've beat the teams that a decent team would beat. They've lost to the teams that a decent team would lose to. The opponents to whom they've lost are a combined 7-1. The opponents they've beaten are a combined 1-7 (the one win from Fairless being against my community's local team, Akron North, so it's not saying much).

This Hillsdale game is hopefully going to be a dogfight, but honestly, the team I think will pair up with Smithville the most evenly will be Northwestern. That may change, of course, depending on how games shape up, but I seem to see at least some tier between the top two in the conference and the next two in the conference. After that, a larger disparity between those next two and the bottom four.

I do have to say this: What I like to see is that the Wayne County Athletic League teams are REALLY working to beef up their non-conference schedule. This year, only one team entered league play unscathed, but in several cases, it wasn't because the league team was sub-par. It was because they scheduled a tough non-league schedule. I like that.

O-Trap;1273488 wrote: I do have to say this: What I like to see is that the Wayne County Athletic League teams are REALLY working to beef up their non-conference schedule. This year, only one team entered league play unscathed, but in several cases, it wasn't because the league team was sub-par. It was because they scheduled a tough non-league schedule. I like that.

if you want any hope in making the playoffs with the way the county is then you better play and beat some solid non league teams. your not getting any points from the both 4 teams. so situation the county is in. getting to be like the nba with the lakers, heat and okc. not much hope for the other teams. btw i cant stand the nba because of teams like that. i know for a fact the mean green know they can win this week. lets see if coach b and company can put in a good game plan and the boys can execute it. friday cant get here fast enough

eyes r burning;1272022 wrote:I would really like that, did wcalfan come to the meeting? Because I only want to have one meeting with both of the people in the district that thinks the program is just fine.

Beast can you set this up with coach Z and wcalfan?

By the way, tough guy, when would you like to meet with Coach Z? Why don't you say these things to his face? Will you? I don't need to be in the meeting...just Coach Z and the man with all the answers (aka YOU).

Jmar25;1273205 wrote:Well I've never seen that type of person before within coach z. I'm not there all the time but I find it really hard to believe he is this monster that is such a jerk to kids that makes them all hate him. THEN QUIT. (what a lesson in life that is) If that was the case I'm surprised he still has a team.

Maybe he just expects a higher level of discipline, attitude, work ethic, and common sense that these kids just aren't used to at school. Maybe he doesn't let the inmates run the prison like parents, some teachers, and coaches do?

Yes... I am saying I feel like there is a serious attitude problem kids these days... It's not like how itused to be...even 10 years ago... This problem has slowly been invading southeast local... That I can say is a fact. Lots of egos and baby'n. Not enough reinforcement of proper attitude at home...

I agree with you on some of this. The boys don't think coach Z is a jerk and they don't hate him but they have absolutly NO RESPECT for him! To me when you are in any coaching position that MUST come 1st! He does expect a higher level of discipline, attitude, work ethic, and common sense from the boys. But his expectations are TOO high. He expects the boys to be just like him when he was in school. For him that was how he was brought up from birth but these boys were not. He can't expect to turn them all around in 1 preseason!
I like Coach Z and so did my boys but I think he needs to adapt to the boys. He needs to stop trying to make them into him and work with who they are! They are teenagers and they rebel and that is what his team is doing! The harder he pushes the harder they push back! I'm not saying that he shouldn't expect all the things that he does but he need to not expect them at such a high level.
The biggest problem that we hear from the boys, his own coaches and the community is that he does not listen! It takes a whole team of coaches to run a team not just one man. This is evident when he comes to the JV, Freshman, and Jr High games and takes over. It's great that he and his players support the lower levels but that is all it should be...support!

Buckz#1;1273571 wrote:I agree with you on some of this. The boys don't think coach Z is a jerk and they don't hate him but they have absolutly NO RESPECT for him! To me when you are in any coaching position that MUST come 1st! He does expect a higher level of discipline, attitude, work ethic, and common sense from the boys. But his expectations are TOO high. He expects the boys to be just like him when he was in school. For him that was how he was brought up from birth but these boys were not. He can't expect to turn them all around in 1 preseason!
I like Coach Z and so did my boys but I think he needs to adapt to the boys. He needs to stop trying to make them into him and work with who they are! They are teenagers and they rebel and that is what his team is doing! The harder he pushes the harder they push back! I'm not saying that he shouldn't expect all the things that he does but he need to not expect them at such a high level.
The biggest problem that we hear from the boys, his own coaches and the community is that he does not listen! It takes a whole team of coaches to run a team not just one man. This is evident when he comes to the JV, Freshman, and Jr High games and takes over. It's great that he and his players support the lower levels but that is all it should be...support!

I actually disagree with the notion that a coach can expect too much. I think a coach should expect perfection. He should be your biggest fan when you reach it, but your biggest critic when you don't.

However, I agree that a head coach should do his best to hire a staff that is just as competent as he is, or more so. And when he does, he ought to listen to them, as well as the players.

A good head coach has a good enough staff that they can function pretty well in his absence.

Buckz#1;1273571 wrote:I agree with you on some of this. The boys don't think coach Z is a jerk and they don't hate him but they have absolutly NO RESPECT for him! To me when you are in any coaching position that MUST come 1st! He does expect a higher level of discipline, attitude, work ethic, and common sense from the boys. But his expectations are TOO high. He expects the boys to be just like him when he was in school. For him that was how he was brought up from birth but these boys were not. He can't expect to turn them all around in 1 preseason!
I like Coach Z and so did my boys but I think he needs to adapt to the boys. He needs to stop trying to make them into him and work with who they are! They are teenagers and they rebel and that is what his team is doing! The harder he pushes the harder they push back! I'm not saying that he shouldn't expect all the things that he does but he need to not expect them at such a high level.
The biggest problem that we hear from the boys, his own coaches and the community is that he does not listen! It takes a whole team of coaches to run a team not just one man. This is evident when he comes to the JV, Freshman, and Jr High games and takes over. It's great that he and his players support the lower levels but that is all it should be...support!

You have summed it up perfectly for us Buckz. I wouldn't be real excited to admit the things that you just did about our kids/parents.

Vince Lombardi said..."Perfection is not attainable, but if we chase perfection we can catch excellence." Where has the work ethic gone in our community? It is sad.....just like Jmar said, "Lots of egos and baby'n. Not enough reinforcement of proper attitude at home".

I do agree that a high school coach has to play the hand that they are dealt, so in a small school you need recruit all the CARDS you can get. If you have a problem relating to the kids you your only ever going to be playing with have a deck.

Have been leaning on the fence close to fifty years have seen a lot of football and many differnt offense ran, but truthfully I have no ideal what they are trying to do, but I'm and old man and I think this game has passed me by. But as I stand there and watch the game and look around it's not 3 or deep on the fence and the stands are pretty much down to those soft parants and soft kids (wcalfan words not mine). Sure someone will look into the revanue issue sometime must likely levy time and they can start to connect the dots.

Take a good hard look at the bears roster we have a handful of seniors, jrs, 10 graders and a boat load of freshmen. But these 3 classes ahead of this freshmen class fielded teams in the 7th, 8th, 9th grades. Football is about numbers to just not talent your never know how kids will develope. Are the dots starting to come together for anyone out there? Maybe we can go down to the jr. high and hire one of them to be a high school recuirting coordinator, lets hope this freshmen class and thier parents don't get soft (wcalfan words not mine)

wcalfan you have broke me, there will be one less at the games from now on, like I said this game has just passed me by, will still support my bears when they come knocking on my door looking to sale something, just like i always have for a very long time.

wcalfan, I have a son who married a couple years ago and is getting ready to start a family would really like him to come to your clinic I hope you are setting up, you know some kind of get take tough parent and get tough kid thing you will be doing for the district.

To my bears shock the world this Friday, you gotta believe, atack on defense, cant set back and get picked apart. Offensively ? not sure wcalfan will have something for you guys I'm sure hopefully it isn't fake punt 3 times and kick it away of 4th down.