BoatShoes;953914 wrote:Again. You don't seem to understand what the unemployment statistic means. It means that if every single unemployed individual magically became a hard working true conservative willing to take any job whether it be cleaning up poo or wiping down toilets there would not be enough available jobs for everyone.

I call BS. If we fired all of the illegal immigrants in this country, we'd have labor shortages. Americans don't want those jobs because they are too good for them. Kick out the illegals, and take away unemployment/welfare and we get finally get people back to work.

BoatShoes;953914 wrote:Again. You don't seem to understand what the unemployment statistic means. It means that if every single unemployed individual magically became a hard working true conservative willing to take any job whether it be cleaning up poo or wiping down toilets there would not be enough available jobs for everyone.

You act like this is some pie that can only be divvied up by the central government and only the central governments policy can change that percentage. Like individuals have no hope and are doomed to be one of the percentage of unemployed. I mean only government policy can create a job. Surely a dumb schlub that did not even graduate high school could never do that on his own. Well my Dad did it twice. He tried to find work but could not. Instead he used his skills and what little resources he had and found a way to create himself a job. He did not even have to clean shitters or wipe poo.

I know just a micro-level story. Merely an anomaly. The real shit happens at the macro-level. The elitist bureaucrats with their vast amounts of wisdom. Drawing up these great plans creating countless jobs for the masses. Tax and spend. Economic utopia has to be right around the corner somewhere. Or maybe its the next corner. Well maybe its one of these corners. Just give the elitist bureaucrats a little more money and they will eventually find it.

Cleveland Buck;953925 wrote:I wasn't talking about the whole economy. You are talking about specific fields. If the economy is booming and you graduate with an accounting degree but that field is filled up, how are you going to create an environment that forces businesses to hire more accountants?

Well if the economy is booming there is likely many other jobs of a similar pedigree to be had. But the economy is decidedly not booming.

And again you keep saying "force businesses to hire" which isn't what I've said or mean. Make it so they need to hire because of demand/imminent increase in business if they do is what I've said.

Could be as simple as certain cities having problems providing tax incentives for companies to hire employees making at least $xx or something. Though don't think that's a blanket statement. I just mean that I think there are ways to make adding to a companies work force more attractive for that company.

http://abcnews.go.com/blogs/headlines/2011/11/occupy-oakland-protesters-tear-gassed-by-police/

The conflict came hours after thousands of Occupy Oakland protesters marched on the Port of Oakland, disrupting operations at the nation’s fifth largest port and causing all maritime operations in the city to be shut down.
Officials at the Port of Oakland said Wednesday that they hope to resume normal operations in the morning after protesters marched through the city all day and into the night on a “general strike” that saw banks and stores picketed and disrupted the flow of traffic.
Demonstrators began marching to the port at 4 p.m. Wednesday, and by 5 p.m. all work had been halted at the port. A message on the website OccupyOakland.org said that the goal was “to stand in solidarity with the longshore workers and shut down the evening shift of the port.”

“Maritime operations remain effectively shut down. And the port is working to ensure that all workers in the harbor area can get home safely. … It is our hope that the work day can resume tomorrow and port workers will be allowed to get to their jobs without incident,” Benjamin said.
“Continued missed shifts represent economic hardship for maritime workers, truckers and their families as well as lost jobs and lost tax revenue for our region,” he added.

[Several banks were vandalized and a dozen windows were shattered at the Wells Fargo branch, while an area of Whole Foods was vandalized after rumors spread that employees who participated in the strike would be fired, according to ABC News affiliate KGO.
Conflict among protesters arose as some scrubbed graffiti from a branch of Wells Fargo bank and a group of protesters attempted to stop another from vandalizing a Whole Foods, KGO reported. A police spokesperson said that five businesses were vandalized throughout the day.

the leaders of this group should be arrested and jailed.

No they shouldn't. People who vandalize should be arrested though.

The groups of protesters who were scrubbing away graffiti and tried to stop the vandals should be heralded though. It's upsetting when dickheads give a bad name to a good thing.

I Wear Pants;955895 wrote:No they shouldn't. People who vandalize should be arrested though.

The groups of protesters who were scrubbing away graffiti and tried to stop the vandals should be heralded though. It's upsetting when dickheads give a bad name to a good thing.

so them organizing a demonstration that shut down a major port is ok and doesnt deserve punishment? everything they did falls under the definition of a riot to me.

Glory Days;955913 wrote:so them organizing a demonstration that shut down a major port is ok and doesnt deserve punishment? everything they did falls under the definition of a riot to me.

You're a cop. You think everything is a riot.

Glory Days;955807 wrote:http://abcnews.go.com/blogs/headlines/2011/11/occupy-oakland-protesters-tear-gassed-by-police/

the leaders of this group should be arrested and jailed.

These groups of people are just like the Tea Party protesters. Can't tell the difference one iota. :rolleyes:

What would we do without the media to give us such unbiased information?

The media has been biased against OWS to be honest. Because they have an interest in them being batshit crazy people without a point lest people actually look into who runs things in this country (hint it isn't the people at large).

Glory Days;955807 wrote:http://abcnews.go.com/blogs/headlines/2011/11/occupy-oakland-protesters-tear-gassed-by-police/








the leaders of this group should be arrested and jailed.

LOL at the idea that these asshats have leaders.

Valid point. There aren't really leaders per se so it'd be ridiculous to try to arrest someone other than a person caught in the act of vandalizing, etc.

I can sympathize a little with some of the protestors qualms, but anyone breaking the law(and I consider shutting down someone elses place of work breaking the law) should be thrown and jail and forced to pay a heavy fee. Free speech is fine, but do it in a way that doesn't harm others.

I can agree with that sleeper. If the goal is to gain traction and support of more people it probably won't be done by shutting down ports.

Parks and public squares and such? Great for protests. Ports, etc? Not so much.

I think these protestors should take up squatting on a container bound for China....

"Right this way, folks...all the way to the back....free coffee and high-speed internet in the back"

I Wear Pants;956005 wrote:I can agree with that sleeper. If the goal is to gain traction and support of more people it probably won't be done by shutting down ports.

Parks and public squares and such? Great for protests. Ports, etc? Not so much.

I agree to an extent. The problem is, public parks and squares are maintained by tax payers who will likely see a reduction in benefits(or a rise in taxes) from the damage being caused from the protestors.

With that said, I'd much rather than infiltrate public places then shut down private places of work.

gut;956011 wrote:I think these protestors should take up squatting on a container bound for China....

"Right this way, folks...all the way to the back....free coffee and high-speed internet in the back"

Lol, you think we ship things to China other than jobs and money.

I love the professed idea of "showing solidarity with the port workers". My guess would be the average port worker's thought would be along the line of "get a job, you smelly, lazy fucks".

sleeper;956014 wrote:I agree to an extent. The problem is, public parks and squares are maintained by tax payers who will likely see a reduction in benefits(or a rise in taxes) from the damage being caused from the protestors.

With that said, I'd much rather than infiltrate public places then shut down private places of work.

Parks and squares are where people are supposed to protest. I don't condone the damage to those places being done by protestors though. Doesn't need to happen. That said, sometimes it's hard to remember to throw your empty water bottle in the trash or recycle it if you're having flash bangs thrown at you, beaten by cops, or getting pepper sprayed.

I Wear Pants;956019 wrote:Parks and squares are where people are supposed to protest. I don't condone the damage to those places being done by protestors though. Doesn't need to happen. That said, sometimes it's hard to remember to throw your empty water bottle in the trash or recycle it if you're having flash bangs thrown at you, beaten by cops, or getting pepper sprayed.

Right because the cops are unprovoked and unjustified in trying to keep the crowd under control.

Here's a thought, why don't the protestors go home every night to sleep, shower, eat, then come back out in the morning? This way the still get their 'message' across and they don't damage public property.

I Wear Pants;956019 wrote:Parks and squares are where people are supposed to protest. I don't condone the damage to those places being done by protestors though. Doesn't need to happen. That said, sometimes it's hard to remember to throw your empty water bottle in the trash or recycle it if you're having flash bangs thrown at you, beaten by cops, or getting pepper sprayed.

The problem begins when the protesters can't seem to leave when their permit is up.

The park isn't just for protesters. When you overtake a park or public space you don't create an environment whereby others can use it also. That's not fair to the general public. They have just as much right to that space as protestors. That's why there are rules in place with regards to how and when a group can protest. It doesn't take away their right to protest but it does allow others to maintain their right to use the space also.

I Wear Pants;955919 wrote:You're a cop. You think everything is a riot.

true, i saw 4 guys playing basketball once. damn near beat them and arrested them on the spot.

sleeper;956030 wrote:Right because the cops are unprovoked and unjustified in trying to keep the crowd under control.

Here's a thought, why don't the protestors go home every night to sleep, shower, eat, then come back out in the morning? This way the still get their 'message' across and they don't damage public property.

Sometimes they are sometimes they aren't. I don't think that the cops are always unjustified in doing so but sometimes they are. I don't think provocation has anything to do with it though because just because I call an officer a bad name or something doesn't make it legal or right for him to beat/taze/etc me. Likewise every time one of those things is done by an officer doesn't mean it was done maliciously or illegally. People get too caught up in taking either the cops side or the other side every time rather than actually thinking about the situation.

Con_Alma;956042 wrote:The problem begins when the protesters can't seem to leave when their permit is up.

The park isn't just for protesters. When you overtake a park or public space you don't create an environment whereby others can use it also. That's not fair to the general public. They have just as much right to that space as protestors. That's why there are rules in place with regards to how and when a group can protest. It doesn't take away their right to protest but it does allow others to maintain their right to use the space also.

thats exactly what is happening in cleveland right now. some of the parks had permits reserved for other events/groups and the protestors are pissed they are being kicked out now.

Glory Days;956058 wrote:true, i saw 4 guys playing basketball once. damn near beat them and arrested them on the spot.

Probably would have done it if you were already finished with your donuts right?

Glory Days;956063 wrote:thats exactly what is happening in cleveland right now. some of the parks had permits reserved for other events/groups and the protestors are pissed they are being kicked out now.

Not the first example where they seem to want their rights to be "more equal" than those of everyone else.