BoatShoes;455119 wrote:Suppose they're just insensitive to something they don't consider themselves involved in....suppose they say, "No, we want to build it anyways, we just want to worship Allah at this piece of property we have. We don't feel like a few evil terrorists had anything to do with us."

What if they just don't care about us being sensitive? Should it be stopped against their will?

There is no legal ground to stop them.....unfortunately.

Just points out that 'they' enjoy thumbing their nose at us and our way of life without regard. Also shows that they have no moral compass.....whatsoever.

Belly35;455153 wrote:Wake the Fuck-up Liberal and America or this is what your faith will be

Belly, you are a one-trick pony. Can't you ever post something articulate without spewing "You Liberals!" ??? This is a much deeper conversation, please take off your political-allegiance blinders and use that thing between your ears.

PS Belly, dispite not seeing eye-to-eye with you on most issues, your posts are starting to grow on me. You seem like a good guy, who happens to sit on the polar opposite of most of my viewpoints haha ... I guess that is what makes Ohio Chatter such an appealing place.

Did not know that among all the things that Belly is an expert at we can now add Islamic religion. Heil Belly!, Heil Belly!

Bigdogg;455175 wrote:Did not know that among all the things that Belly is an expert at we can now add Islamic religion. Heil Belly!, Heil Belly!

Thank you I am good at many things some better than others.

It takes little effort to start to translate the Qur'an same can be done for Old Testament or New Testament with a Concordance, Thesaurus of the Language of the Bible Hebrew and Aramaic Roots, Words, Proper Names, Phrases and Synonyms with today computers and software. You should try it could be a learning moment in your life.

If you have passion to do what is right, to know who your enemies are, and over come your weakness you take the time to learn more.

Belly35;455211 wrote:Thank you I am good at many things some better than others.

It takes little effort to start to translate the Qur'an same can be done for Old Testament or New Testament with a Concordance, Thesaurus of the Language of the Bible Hebrew and Aramaic Roots, Words, Proper Names, Phrases and Synonyms with today computers and software. You should try it could be a learning moment in your life.

If you have passion to do what is right, to know who your enemies are, and over come your weakness you take the time to learn more.

It takes a lot of effort, actually, and I'm speaking from experience. As someone who had to translate the Sura of Joseph, grammatically, it is harder than hell. Most of the translations are crap really as they do not take into account grammar.

I completely disagree with your rant above, but will only refer you to AJ Arberry.

If you want the best English translation of the Qur'an, here ya go: Aj Arberry's.
http://www.mlivo.com/translations/Arberry.htm

As an aside, my favorite passage of the Qur'an:
God is the Light of the heavens and the earth; the likeness of His Light is as a niche wherein is a lamp (the lamp in a glass, the glass as it were a glittering star) kindled from a Blessed Tree, an olive that is neither of the East nor of the West whose oil wellnigh would shine, even if no fire touched it; Light upon Light; (God guides to His Light whom He will.) -24:35

Belly35;455211 wrote:Thank you I am good at many things some better than others.

It takes little effort to start to translate the Qur'an same can be done for Old Testament or New Testament with a Concordance, Thesaurus of the Language of the Bible Hebrew and Aramaic Roots, Words, Proper Names, Phrases and Synonyms with today computers and software. You should try it could be a learning moment in your life.

If you have passion to do what is right, to know who your enemies are, and over come your weakness you take the time to learn more.

Sorry Belly I disagree with about 99% of what you say. But unlike you and your fellow Tea party brothers, I will defend your right to say what you want and where you want to say it at (as long as it don't violate any zoning or local laws LOL)

Your interpretations of Islam are just plane wrong. I would advise you to see your own priest/father/rabbi let the experts show you the way. Your soul seems lost right now.

As for reading up on the subject, I suggest Holy Land, Whose Land? Modern Dilemma, Ancient Roots by Dorothy Weitz Drummond. Very good book to help you understand what going on.

Islam forbids its adherents to follow "man-made" laws and that would include our US Constitution and its Bill of Rights. Islamic "ummah" if given an opportunity would seek sharia system to its followers even in western democracies as evidenced in Canada, UK, France and Netherlands to name a few all supposedly on a "voluntary" basis. Somehow, the sharia stuff happens to pertain to womens' rights in these countries.


So to Gibby, Big Dog and PT1 you want to take away the Right of Women in this great American Country?

Belly35;455297 wrote:Islam forbids its adherents to follow "man-made" laws and that would include our US Constitution and its Bill of Rights. Islamic "ummah" if given an opportunity would seek sharia system to its followers even in western democracies as evidenced in Canada, UK, France and Netherlands to name a few all supposedly on a "voluntary" basis. Somehow, the sharia stuff happens to pertain to womens' rights in these countries.


So to Gibby, Big Dog and PT1 you want to take away the Right of Women in this great American Country?

That is your interpretation of one interpretation of Islam. There are others. Islam is like Christianity in the sense it has many different aspects and differences that are not widely agreed on. I'll just leave it at that.

Belly35;455297 wrote:Islam forbids its adherents to follow "man-made" laws and that would include our US Constitution and its Bill of Rights. Islamic "ummah" if given an opportunity would seek sharia system to its followers even in western democracies as evidenced in Canada, UK, France and Netherlands to name a few all supposedly on a "voluntary" basis. Somehow, the sharia stuff happens to pertain to womens' rights in these countries.


So to Gibby, Big Dog and PT1 you want to take away the Right of Women in this great American Country?

There are stupid interpretations to Christianity too. You don't see people claiming that the Westboro Baptist's interpretation of the Bible is the de-facto one do you?

Religion of Islam …..is not a religion, not mention in the Qur’an as a religion no where to be found ……Liars

So because you say something isn't a religion...it isn't?

Manhattan Buckeye;454965 wrote:Can't has nothing to do with it - it is should. But to your point, if a nutso anti-abortion guy bombed an abortion clinic and killed many doctors, employees and citizens, how well would an idea to build a National Right to Life Center near the place of incident go over? My guess - not well. I lived in NYC for nearly a decade, I've been to that area of Manhattan often, it isn't that well populated, particularly by Muslims (that tend to live in Jersey or Queens). I'd question the sanity of any religion that wants to build any type of facility there, let alone one of this magnitude. One has to be an ignoramus to NOT question the motives.

Perhaps. But I doubt there would be a stink if some Christian organization wanted to build a community center there a decade after it happened.

Here's an AP article claiming to state the facts about the Mosque. I think it chooses some of the most far out statements by conservatives so unfair to them I think but I think it discusses the good and bad sides of the Imam pretty fairly.

http://www.heraldonline.com/2010/08/18/2391545/fact-check-islam-already-lives.html

ptown_trojans_1;455308 wrote:That is your interpretation of one interpretation of Islam. There are others. Islam is like Christianity in the sense it has many different aspects and differences that are not widely agreed on. I'll just leave it at that.

PT1 I respect you and many of your comment are thought provoking .... But your is reply is weak and avoided to question... One would think you're a Obama faithful...

Would that be like passing a Bill to finding out what in it ..... after the fact ?

You know I kinda like to know more about something that just what the interested party wants to tell me.

I Wear Pants;455423 wrote:There are stupid interpretations to Christianity too. You don't see people claiming that the Westboro Baptist's interpretation of the Bible is the de-facto one do you?



So because you say something isn't a religion...it isn't?

I provide documentation to justify my comment.....

So you provide documentation in the Qur'an where the Religion of Islam is mention in any format.... OK

So if something doesn't have a book that says "THIS IS A RELIGION YO!" it isn't one?

Belly35;455476 wrote:PT1 I respect you and many of your comment are thought provoking .... But your is reply is weak and avoided to question... One would think you're a Obama faithful...

Would that be like passing a Bill to finding out what in it ..... after the fact ?

You know I kinda like to know more about something that just what the interested party wants to tell me.

It was sort of a lame response, but then again, I just don't feel like debating the issue and I have other stuff to do haha. Besides, I doubt we could come to any sort of agreement, so I just left it at that.

Oh and you failed to provide any links to your little rant. I'd greatly appreciate links and information on where you obtained those translations of the Qur'an.

Belly35;455482 wrote:I provide documentation to justify my comment.....

So you provide documentation in the Qur'an where the Religion of Islam is mention in any format.... OK

No you don't.
Second, your second sentence makes no sense. Provide documentation of what?

Regardless of the way you feel on the subject, the democrats are once again being douche bags. Pelosi wants investigation on how anti-mosque groups are being funded. Seriously?

I have waded through six pages of this topic, with some well-thought-out posts and with some out and out ignorant posts, but I have only one question for all of you:


If the efforts to have this place moved are successful (through either legal, moral or illegal means), who's next? Where do we stop? I understand the whole thing about the feelings of the 9/11 families, but we're on a very slippery slope here. If we abandon the principles upon which our great country was founded then it's no longer America.

iclfan2;455571 wrote:Regardless of the way you feel on the subject, the democrats are once again being douche bags. Pelosi wants investigation on how anti-mosque groups are being funded. Seriously?

First: Pelosi is a stupid bitch.

Second: Why is wanting to know who's opposing the mosque anymore ridiculous than the posters who want to know who is promoting it?

I Wear Pants;455574 wrote:First: Pelosi is a stupid bitch.

Second: Why is wanting to know who's opposing the mosque anymore ridiculous than the posters who want to know who is promoting it?

Perhaps it's because the "someone" who wants to investigate those opposing it actually has her claws on power to do things that could hurt those groups or organizations using the force of government.

I'd say that's enough to make any sane person worry...especially when we're talking about Pelosi.

Posters wanting to know is one thing, a damn high up government official wanting to waste the governments time investigating the topic is comparing apples to oranges. It is just absurd to me how these dems have gotten so high up in the government, which makes me question the whole standards of the left.

It's because no one can look Pelosi in the eyes and tell her "no"...because she is so hideous if you did match her gaze you'd probably burst into flames or turn to stone or something.

I Wear Pants;455630 wrote:It's because no one can look Pelosi in the eyes and tell her "no"...because she is so hideous if you did match her gaze you'd probably burst into flames or turn to stone or something.

Very true. I'm more left than most on this site, but I look at her as the sort of joke in authority that offends my perception of how things should be. She's like an ugly left-wing Palin. Because I'd totally do Palin, I can understand why people would support her...but how can anyone like Pelosi having actual authority? She's crazy and can turn people to stone by looking at them.

Heretic;455847 wrote:Very true. I'm more left than most on this site, but I look at her as the sort of joke in authority that offends my perception of how things should be. She's like an ugly left-wing Palin. Because I'd totally do Palin, I can understand why people would support her...but how can anyone like Pelosi having actual authority? She's crazy and can turn people to stone by looking at them.

1. San Francisco

2. Gibby

An interesting article from the American Muslim prospective.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2010/08/18/AR2010081806714.html?hpid=topnews