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Dick Cheney--Idiot

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Q

QuakerOats

Senior Member

8,740 posts
Jun 24, 2014 1:22 PM
Yes, we were in a hell of a lot better shape when they ran the show, and you can pretty much confirm that with most world leaders.
Jun 24, 2014 1:22pm
G

gut

Senior Member

15,058 posts
Jun 24, 2014 1:48 PM
QuakerOats;1629315 wrote:Megan Kelly interviewed the deputy spokeswoman for national security last night. It is understandable why we are where we are right now; we have a bunch of inept, inexperienced, progressive millennials in charge of national security under the direction of a completely inept, inexperienced, marxist community activist.
I actually happened to see that. Along with the "Dude, where's my President" I was thinking WTF do these idiots bring to the table and why would they do more than get coffee for any POTUS?!?

There's a reason companies don't allow junior staffers or, well, pretty much any non-executive to talk to the press.
Jun 24, 2014 1:48pm
I

isadore

Senior Member

7,762 posts
Jun 24, 2014 2:56 PM
QuakerOats;1629420 wrote:Yes, we were in a hell of a lot better shape when they ran the show, and you can pretty much confirm that with most world leaders.
Gosh a ruddies
9/11
Screwed up the invasion and occupation of Afghanistan, allowed Bin Laden and Al Queda to escape, were not prepared to control the Taliban who carried out a long term insurgency, aided Karzai incoming to power who worked against American and Allied efforts.
Screwed up the invasion of Iraq, was not prepared to occupy the nation which allowed the rise of the Al queda, aided Maliki in coming to power who worked against American and Allied efforts, promised withdrawal by agreement without a residual force.
Weakened all our major alliances but
Bush on meeting Putin said
“I looked the man in the eye. I found him to be very straightforward and trustworthy. “
“
Jun 24, 2014 2:56pm
Q

QuakerOats

Senior Member

8,740 posts
Jun 24, 2014 4:02 PM
ccrunner609;1629490 wrote:you are an idiot if you believe any of that.

He either does believe it, or he is simply getting paid to post by the regime.
Jun 24, 2014 4:02pm
Q

QuakerOats

Senior Member

8,740 posts
Jun 24, 2014 4:04 PM
gut;1629445 wrote:I actually happened to see that. Along with the "Dude, where's my President" I was thinking WTF do these idiots bring to the table and why would they do more than get coffee for any POTUS?!?

There's a reason companies don't allow junior staffers or, well, pretty much any non-executive to talk to the press.

Yep. Unfortunately, while obama is out playing golf or campaigning during all these crisis, these are really the folks that are making decisions. Talk about a major feeling of insecurity -- geez. God help us.
Jun 24, 2014 4:04pm
G

gut

Senior Member

15,058 posts
Jun 24, 2014 4:12 PM
QuakerOats;1629496 wrote:Yep. Unfortunately, while obama is out playing golf or campaigning during all these crisis, these are really the folks that are making decisions. Talk about a major feeling of insecurity -- geez. God help us.
No one is a more loyal and dedicated true believer than a young person who hasn't learned better in a job they aren't qualified for trying to build a career. Good place to start if you are looking to surround yourself with people who will literally do anything asked of them.
Jun 24, 2014 4:12pm
I

isadore

Senior Member

7,762 posts
Jun 24, 2014 10:43 PM
ccrunner609;1629490 wrote:you are an idiot if you believe any of that.
I wrote the truth, all of it. But gosh a ruddies it is no surprise you can accept none of it. You and your ilk suffer from cognitive dissonance.
Jun 24, 2014 10:43pm
HitsRus's avatar

HitsRus

Senior Member

9,206 posts
Jun 24, 2014 11:05 PM
I wrote the truth, all of it.
Hardly.
Screwed up the invasion and occupation of Afghanistan, allowed Bin Laden and Al Queda to escape, were not prepared to control the Taliban who carried out a long term insurgency, aided Karzai incoming to power who worked against American and Allied efforts.
The invasion was not 'screwed up', and considering our lack of bases in the area, they put together a pretty good coalition pretty fast.
Bin laden and the Taliban escaped?....you must hate Bill Clinton too.
Screwed up the invasion of Iraq, was not prepared to occupy the nation which allowed the rise of the Al queda,
The invasion went smoothly....the occupation was blown (Hey you were right for once!)....when they left office .... Al qaida was nowhere to be found.....moreover, Barack himself proclaimed Iraq to be a "stable " nation...LOL
promised withdrawal by agreement without a residual force
that was Barry all the way.
Weakened all our major alliances
that was Barry all the way.
Bush on meeting Putin said
“I looked the man in the eye. I found him to be very straightforward and trustworthy. “
Russian adventurism was minimal during Bush II...eh, not so much lately.
Jun 24, 2014 11:05pm
cruiser_96's avatar

cruiser_96

Senior Member

7,536 posts
Jun 24, 2014 11:13 PM
isadore;1629658 wrote:I wrote the truth, all of it. But gosh a ruddies it is no surprise you can accept none of it. You and your ilk suffer from cognitive dissonance.
You said "cognitive dissonance". You and sleeper are lovers.

isadore and sleeper, sitting in a tree.
K-I-S-S-I-N-G
First comes love.
Then comes marriage.
Then comes sleeper with the baby carriage.
Jun 24, 2014 11:13pm
I

isadore

Senior Member

7,762 posts
Jun 25, 2014 8:26 AM
HitsRus;1629701 wrote:Hardly.



The invasion was not 'screwed up', and considering our lack of bases in the area, they put together a pretty good coalition pretty fast.
Bin laden and the Taliban escaped?....you must hate Bill Clinton too.



The invasion went smoothly....the occupation was blown (Hey you were right for once!)....when they left office .... Al qaida was nowhere to be found.....moreover, Barack himself proclaimed Iraq to be a "stable " nation...LOL



that was Barry all the way.



that was Barry all the way.



Russian adventurism was minimal during Bush II...eh, not so much lately.
In 2009 a US Senate report concluded that the failure to capture bin Laden "[laid] the foundation for today’s protracted Afghan insurgency and inflaming the internal strife now endangering Pakistan."
[23] Al-Qaeda forces began regrouping in the Shahi-Kot mountains of Paktia Province throughout January and February 2002.
American special force member (right) with Afghan mercenaries in Tora Bora, 2001.
In December 2009,
New Republic published Peter Bergen's "The Battle for Tora Bora"[24] Bergen had published Holy War, Inc: Inside the Secret World of Osama bin Laden in 2001 soon after 9/11.) In his critique of the battle, Bergen reconstructed the US allies engagement at Tora Bora. He said that General Tommy Franks, then US Army chief, refused to deploy 800 Army rangers from nearby bases to assault the complex of caves where bin Laden was supposedly hiding. Bergen characterized this as "one of the greatest military blunders in recent US history".[24] Bergen says that the US failure to capture bin Laden at the time provided energy to the Taliban. It regrouped and became stronger after US officials diverted forces for the invasion of Iraq in March 2003 and war there
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Tora_Bora#Aftermath
No nations from the area aided our efforts and our allies as early as possible and disillusioned with the effort, much less likely to commit again.
The selection of Karzai as leader was a major step in undermining our occupation.
The Iraq invasion was justified by a lie and set up the situation for the prolonged bloody occupation and the loss of 4500 Americans and 318 of our allies.
No nations from the area aided our efforts and our allies as early as possible and disillusioned with the effort, much less likely to commit again.
The selection of Maliki as leader was a major step in undermining our occupation.
The withdrawal agreement with no protection of US troops was done under Bush.
And gosh a ruddies. “Russian adventurism was minimal during Bush II.”
LOL Putin invaded in Republic of Georgia and Bush did nothing.
　
　
　
　
Jun 25, 2014 8:26am
Q

QuakerOats

Senior Member

8,740 posts
Jun 25, 2014 8:44 AM
Saw Cheney again last night; he makes obama look like a 2nd grader. The pentagon wanted to keep about 20,000 troops, obama said no (for political reasons); the pentagon said well how about 10,000; obama said no (for political reasons); the pentagon said we should have, at the barest minimum, at least have several thousand troops to provide training, intelligence etc.... obama said no (for political reasons). We had a semi-stable Iraq, but obama created the vacuum that has directly led to this current crisis; he is responsible; he should be held accountable.

The pre-ordained nobel peace prize winner: now responsible for more blood in the streets, and greater insecurity here and around the globe.

Change we can believe in ...
Jun 25, 2014 8:44am
I

isadore

Senior Member

7,762 posts
Jun 25, 2014 11:56 AM
QuakerOats;1629854 wrote:Saw Cheney again last night; he makes obama look like a 2nd grader. The pentagon wanted to keep about 20,000 troops, obama said no (for political reasons); the pentagon said well how about 10,000; obama said no (for political reasons); the pentagon said we should have, at the barest minimum, at least have several thousand troops to provide training, intelligence etc.... obama said no (for political reasons). We had a semi-stable Iraq, but obama created the vacuum that has directly led to this current crisis; he is responsible; he should be held accountable.

The pre-ordained nobel peace prize winner: now responsible for more blood in the streets, and greater insecurity here and around the globe.

Change we can believe in ...
gosh a ruddies really

My belief is, we will, in fact be greeted as liberators.
  • Meet The Press with Tim Russert. (March 16, 2003)
    What we did in Iraq was exactly the right thing to do. If I had it to recommend all over again, I would recommend exactly the same course of action.
  • Vice Presidential Debate October 5, 2004
Jun 25, 2014 11:56am
Q

QuakerOats

Senior Member

8,740 posts
Jun 25, 2014 1:37 PM
He was, and is, exactly correct. Unfortunately obama lost all the gains; or rather, GAVE THEM AWAY, AND IN DOING SO SPIT ON THOSE WHO SACRIFICED ALL!


God you are a complete jackass.
Jun 25, 2014 1:37pm
Heretic's avatar

Heretic

Son of the Sun

18,820 posts
Jun 25, 2014 2:54 PM
QuakerOats;1629936 wrote:He was, and is, exactly correct. Unfortunately obama lost all the gains; or rather, GAVE THEM AWAY, AND IN DOING SO SPIT ON THOSE WHO SACRIFICED ALL!


God you are a complete jackass.
Pot, kettle, black.
Jun 25, 2014 2:54pm
I

isadore

Senior Member

7,762 posts
Jun 25, 2014 4:34 PM
QuakerOats;1629936 wrote:He was, and is, exactly correct. Unfortunately obama lost all the gains; or rather, GAVE THEM AWAY, AND IN DOING SO SPIT ON THOSE WHO SACRIFICED ALL!


God you are a complete jackass.
you can read these two statements and then make your statement, unbelieveable
My belief is, we will, in fact be greeted as liberators.
  • Meet The Press with Tim Russert. (March 16, 2003)
    What we did in Iraq was exactly the right thing to do. If I had it to recommend all over again, I would recommend exactly the same course of action.

  • Vice Presidential Debate October 5, 2004
The mendacity and incompetence of Cheney and his regime were major reasons for our casualties and for the present situation.
Jun 25, 2014 4:34pm
G

gut

Senior Member

15,058 posts
Jun 25, 2014 5:39 PM
isadore;1630051 wrote: The mendacity and incompetence of Cheney and his regime were major reasons for our casualties and for the present situation.
Yeah, well, we know where hope (or, more directly, the audacity of hope) has gotten us. How's the saying go, "hope in one hand, shit in the other and see which one gets filled first"?
Jun 25, 2014 5:39pm
pmoney25's avatar

pmoney25

Senior Member

1,787 posts
Jun 25, 2014 5:47 PM
Are people really defending Dick Cheney and GWB on Iraq? I get that Obama is terrible but lets not act like the Bush regime with Darth Cheney were the greatest regime of all time.

The occupation of Iraq was never going to be successful. Smart people knew this.
Jun 25, 2014 5:47pm
HitsRus's avatar

HitsRus

Senior Member

9,206 posts
Jun 25, 2014 9:09 PM
pmoney25;1630074 wrote:Are people really defending Dick Cheney and GWB on Iraq? I get that Obama is terrible but lets not act like the Bush regime with Darth Cheney were the greatest regime of all time.

The occupation of Iraq was never going to be successful. Smart people knew this.
I don't think anyone on here is claiming Cheney and Bush were blameless.... and they certainly made their share of mistakes, The Iraq war was hard and drawn out, and costly both in terms of dollars and lives. But facts are facts...let's try to keep our eye on the ball here:
1) when they left office,there was no Al Qaida in Iraq.
2) BHO stated himself that in 2011 we were leaving Iraq, stable, sovereign and self reliant.
3) U.S. commanders recommended leaving a force of 20,000 residual troops.

You can say what you want about Bush and his administration, but in 2011 Iraq was "stable, sovereign and self reliant" ....what has transpired since is the direct result of the current administration and its policies . They have given away all the work and hard earned gains made by American soldiers and comittment. They are directly responsible for the clusterf*** unfolding and they should be held responsible for such "inattention."
The occupation of Iraq was never going to be successful. Smart people knew this.
I guess we will never know for sure....but one thing is certain, and that is Iraq's abandonment was not...and smart people knew this.
Jun 25, 2014 9:09pm
ptown_trojans_1's avatar

ptown_trojans_1

Moderator

7,632 posts
Jun 25, 2014 9:24 PM
QuakerOats;1629854 wrote:Saw Cheney again last night; he makes obama look like a 2nd grader. The pentagon wanted to keep about 20,000 troops, obama said no (for political reasons); the pentagon said well how about 10,000; obama said no (for political reasons); the pentagon said we should have, at the barest minimum, at least have several thousand troops to provide training, intelligence etc.... obama said no (for political reasons). We had a semi-stable Iraq, but obama created the vacuum that has directly led to this current crisis; he is responsible; he should be held accountable.

The pre-ordained nobel peace prize winner: now responsible for more blood in the streets, and greater insecurity here and around the globe.

Change we can believe in ...
Amazing how people here keep forgetting the law, as in the Status of Forces Agreement signed in 2008.
Obama had no choice but to withdraw forces from Iraq by the end of 2011. It was not up to him. It was not political. You are wrong.

http://www.mcclatchydc.com/2008/11/18/56116/unofficial-translation-of-us-iraq.html

Section 24:
All U.S. forces are to withdraw from all Iraqi territory, water and airspace no later than the 31st of December of 2011.
And, the U.S. tried to push the date back, but you know Iraq being a sovereign country, decided no thanks.

While there was no al Qaeda in 2011, the situation has changed so much thanks to the civil war in Syria and our inability, and the regions to contain that conflict.

Mix in the fact that Maliki is a power tyrant for the Shia's, the gains made by the Awakening back in 2006-2007, or the surge here, are falling apart.
But, nevermind the simple facts, please listen to almighty Cheney. He is never wrong.
[LEFT]
Read more here: http://www.mcclatchydc.com/2008/11/18/56116/unofficial-translation-of-us-iraq.html#storylink=cpy
[/LEFT]
Jun 25, 2014 9:24pm
pmoney25's avatar

pmoney25

Senior Member

1,787 posts
Jun 25, 2014 9:26 PM
HitsRus;1630155 wrote:I don't think anyone on here is claiming Cheney and Bush were blameless.... and they certainly made their share of mistakes, The Iraq war was hard and drawn out, and costly both in terms of dollars and lives. But facts are facts...let's try to keep our eye on the ball here:
1) when they left office,there was no Al Qaida in Iraq.
2) BHO stated himself that in 2011 we were leaving Iraq, stable, sovereign and self reliant.
3) U.S. commanders recommended leaving a force of 20,000 residual troops.

You can say what you want about Bush and his administration, but in 2011 Iraq was "stable, sovereign and self reliant" ....what has transpired since is the direct result of the current administration and its policies . They have given away all the work and hard earned gains made by American soldiers and comittment. They are directly responsible for the clusterf*** unfolding and they should be held responsible for such "inattention."


I guess we will never know for sure....but one thing is certain, and that is Iraq's abandonment was not...and smart people knew this.
The major flaw in your position is that because it was "stable" that it was working or could have worked. The issue is whether you stayed 10 years or 100 years, the moment we leave, it would revert back.

Also I don't understand why we brag about no al Qaeda in Iraq as an accomplishment. Al Qaeda had no power in Iraq prior to our invasion.
Jun 25, 2014 9:26pm
I

isadore

Senior Member

7,762 posts
Jun 25, 2014 9:31 PM
1. Mr\Ms Oats consider Bush and Cheney blameless
My (Cheney) belief is, we will, in fact be greeted as liberators.
Meet The Press with Tim Russert
. (March 16, 2003)
What we did in Iraq was exactly the right thing to do. If I had it to recommend all over again, I would recommend exactly the same course of action.

Quaker oats wrote:He was, and is, exactly correct. Unfortunately obama lost all the gains; or rather, GAVE THEM AWAY, AND IN DOING SO SPIT ON THOSE WHO SACRIFICED ALL!
2. Gosh a ruddies there were no Al Queda in Iraq before Cheney Bush invasion, if it wasn't for their regime their would be no ISIS.
3. They put Maliki in power and he is the reason there is no residual force left in the country. He opposed, he refused legal protection for our troops.
Jun 25, 2014 9:31pm
G

gut

Senior Member

15,058 posts
Jun 25, 2014 9:47 PM
pmoney25;1630159 wrote:..the moment we leave, it would revert back.
Who said we'd have to leave prematurely? We have bases all over the world, many significant bases. Why couldn't we just "move" our base in Saudi Arabia to Iraq?
Jun 25, 2014 9:47pm
pmoney25's avatar

pmoney25

Senior Member

1,787 posts
Jun 25, 2014 9:54 PM
gut;1630166 wrote:Who said we'd have to leave prematurely? We have bases all over the world, many significant bases. Why couldn't we just "move" our base in Saudi Arabia to Iraq?
Two questions

When would it not be premature?

Why more bases?

Military expansion/adventurism has been a major cause of all empire collapses throughout history. Ours will be no different.

We will never not be in some sort of war with terrorists. The Bush doctrine basically gives the president free reign to constant war always with the threat of terrorists attacking our country. Our middle east foreign policy for the last 60 + years is why we are in this situation to begin with.
Jun 25, 2014 9:54pm
G

gut

Senior Member

15,058 posts
Jun 25, 2014 9:55 PM
ptown_trojans_1;1630158 wrote:Amazing how people here keep forgetting the law, as in the Status of Forces Agreement signed in 2008.
You do realize the parties could have agreed to an extended or amended SOFA?
Jun 25, 2014 9:55pm
G

gut

Senior Member

15,058 posts
Jun 25, 2014 9:58 PM
pmoney25;1630173 wrote:Two questions

When would it not be premature?

Why more bases?

Military expansion/adventurism has been a major cause of all empire collapses throughout history. Ours will be no different.

We will never not be in some sort of war with terrorists. The Bush doctrine basically gives the president free reign to constant war always with the threat of terrorists attacking our country. Our middle east foreign policy for the last 60 + years is why we are in this situation to begin with.
That's why I said "move" the Saudi Arabia or another base. I did not advocate MORE bases.

When would it not be premature? When it isn't. That's just as much a cop-out as you claiming Iraq would never stand on its own. It was stable with Saddam, and it was stable with our troops still there. So you're kind of making a strawman argument.
Jun 25, 2014 9:58pm