posted by ptown_trojans_1

Let's just use a scale of 1-10 for example. Let's say just the Russia stuff was let's say a 5 on the scale of getting rid of the President, impeachment was probably let's say a 7. What Trump is doing is like a 9 or 10. 

But, you do you. 

So wait, impeachment is a 7 and what is currently going on is a 9?

You can’t be fucking serious anymore. 

Impeachment, the actual Constitutional way of getting rid of a President is a 7. 

Trying to use courts to throw out questionable votes (in their mind, not mine) is a 9. 

Read all that again, and say it again. Maybe you will hear how stupid it sounds if you say it out loud?

Come on ptown, the “I’m a moderate really guys?!” schtick is up after that post. 

Impeachment is a 7, challenging votes is a 9...seriously I can’t make that shit up.

posted by jmog

So wait, impeachment is a 7 and what is currently going on is a 9?

You can’t be fucking serious anymore. 

Impeachment, the actual Constitutional way of getting rid of a President is a 7. 

Trying to use courts to throw out questionable votes (in their mind, not mine) is a 9. 

Read all that again, and say it again. Maybe you will hear how stupid it sounds if you say it out loud?

Come on ptown, the “I’m a moderate really guys?!” schtick is up after that post. 

Impeachment is a 7, challenging votes is a 9...seriously I can’t make that shit up.

How many times in US history has a sitting President or challenger contested the results of the election in US history to this extent in contrast to what his party is saying? Once, and in 2000 when it was one state and a few hundred votes. 

Impeachment has been done now twice in the last 25 years....so yes. Impeachment is a 7 and what the President is doing is a 9 or 10. 

I don't think you understand how, in terms of US history, how rare and dangerous what President Trump is doing right now. 

posted by ptown_trojans_1

WSJ is saying Janet Yellen for Treasuery and that...isn't a bad choice. 

Not a terrible choice, by any means, but I'm really not a fan of monetizing the debt.

That's the new normal, though.  I just hope people don't see that as a license to cut blank checks for all the pet causes.

posted by ptown_trojans_1

How many times in US history has a sitting President or challenger contested the results of the election in US history to this extent in contrast to what his party is saying? Once, and in 2000 when it was one state and a few hundred votes. 

Impeachment has been done now twice in the last 25 years....so yes. Impeachment is a 7 and what the President is doing is a 9 or 10. 

I don't think you understand how, in terms of US history, how rare and dangerous what President Trump is doing right now. 

It is quite obvious you are the one that doesn’t understand.

There have been a grand total of 3 Presidents that have been impeached.

There have been 4-5 (depending on source) if heavily contested Presidential elections that have either gone to court or had to be settled by compromises between the two parties through special conventions.

So 3 impeachments, 4 or 5 badly contested elections.

Want to stick with your rarity argument for 9 vs 7 still?

Your confirmation bias is showing.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/theconversation.com/amp/a-history-of-contested-presidential-elections-from-samuel-tilden-to-al-gore-149414

Contest the election, fine.  But don't let your lawyers run around telling everyone they have proof "Trump won by millions of votes"....while not supplying any proof.  Even Rush Limbaugh said you can't promise bombshells, and then not produce anything.

Undermining confidence in our elections, both at home and abroad, is easily the worst thing Trump has done.  Fortunately, with his history of lying I doubt anyone takes him seriously.  Well, aside from millions in the MAGA nation who still believe, without any evidence at all, that Trump won.

posted by gut

Contest the election, fine.  But don't let your lawyers run around telling everyone they have proof "Trump won by millions of votes"....while not supplying any proof.  Even Rush Limbaugh said you can't promise bombshells, and then not produce anything.

Undermining confidence in our elections, both at home and abroad, is easily the worst thing Trump has done.  Fortunately, with his history of lying I doubt anyone takes him seriously.  Well, aside from millions in the MAGA nation who still believe, without any evidence at all, that Trump won.

I don’t disagree, but that is no worse than the Pelosi’s and Schiff’s promising bombshells of Russia collusion that never happened either but led to an impeachment for no valid reason.

Our system is broken, both sides suck donkey balls. To act like Trump is so much worse than the dems is just plain ignoring reality. 

posted by jmog

I don’t disagree, but that is no worse than the Pelosi’s and Schiff’s promising bombshells of Russia collusion that never happened either but led to an impeachment for no valid reason.

True, although I still don't think that's as bad as attacking the absolute foundation of our Democracy.

And that's not what led to his impeachment - it was his abuse of power trying to get Biden investigated.  Which, ironically enough, McConnell is gearing up for assuming the Repubs hold the Senate.  Payback is going to be a bitch.

Although I still question how much appetite there is for that when most of these swamp rats have the same deals with their family and friends (though you don't see nearly as much with corrupt foreign governments).

posted by gut

True, although I still don't think that's as bad as attacking the absolute foundation of our Democracy.

And that's not what led to his impeachment - it was his abuse of power trying to get Biden investigated.  Which, ironically enough, McConnell is gearing up for assuming the Repubs hold the Senate.  Payback is going to be a bitch.

Although I still question how much appetite there is for that when most of these swamp rats have the same deals with their family and friends (though you don't see nearly as much with corrupt foreign governments).

So making up shit about a sitting President that leads to an impeachment (don’t kid yourself, if you don’t believe Russia Russia Russia led to the impeachment and then they switched to a phone call you are kidding yourself), doesn’t undermine our republic (not a democracy)?

I agree that impeachment has by far been the worst. This election bullshit is dumb, but it went through correct channels vs a garbage political game. 

Don’t get me wrong, Trump has no chance, but get outta here w this is somehow worse than a 4 year witch hunt. 

posted by jmog

So making up shit about a sitting President that leads to an impeachment (don’t kid yourself, if you don’t believe Russia Russia Russia led to the impeachment and then they switched to a phone call you are kidding yourself), doesn’t undermine our republic (not a democracy)?

Oh, they wanted to get rid of him, and it wasn't just the Democrats.  But his impeachment had nothing to do with Russia, and the articles of impeachment didn't mention anything about that or the Mueller report.

If you think Russia Russia Russia undermined our Democracy, then you have to acknowledge Trump was justifiably impeached for trying to do the same thing to a political opponent.

posted by gut

Oh, they wanted to get rid of him, and it wasn't just the Democrats.  But his impeachment had nothing to do with Russia, and the articles of impeachment didn't mention anything about that or the Mueller report.

If you think Russia Russia Russia undermined our Democracy, then you have to acknowledge Trump was justifiably impeached for trying to do the same thing to a political opponent.

At what point in this discussion have I defended Trump on anything?

I have literally said both sides suck, and they have both undermined our republic (not a democracy).

It’s ptown that is trying to act like the Dems are just mildly wrong and Trump is Hitler.

posted by gut

Not a terrible choice, by any means, but I'm really not a fan of monetizing the debt.

That's the new normal, though.  I just hope people don't see that as a license to cut blank checks for all the pet causes.

I wouldn't worry about blank checks given the likely R Senate. 

I think the choices so far are fine from Biden as they are not polarzing choices. 

posted by jmog

It is quite obvious you are the one that doesn’t understand.

There have been a grand total of 3 Presidents that have been impeached.

There have been 4-5 (depending on source) if heavily contested Presidential elections that have either gone to court or had to be settled by compromises between the two parties through special conventions.

So 3 impeachments, 4 or 5 badly contested elections.

Want to stick with your rarity argument for 9 vs 7 still?

Your confirmation bias is showing.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/theconversation.com/amp/a-history-of-contested-presidential-elections-from-samuel-tilden-to-al-gore-149414

Yeah...I don't think you understand US History and how rare/ dangerous what the President did in comparisoon to other times in history. 

posted by jmog

At what point in this discussion have I defended Trump on anything?

I have literally said both sides suck, and they have both undermined our republic (not a democracy).

It’s ptown that is trying to act like the Dems are just mildly wrong and Trump is Hitler.

As gut has mentioned, you again are combining several different things, the Mueller Investigation and the actual Impeachment. Not a surprise by you though. 

You are really twisting yourself to try and make them even. Thanks for throwing the Hitler reference out there even though I in no way even made that mention, which again shows how you are just grasping. Yes, both sides suck, but what Trump is doing/ did is much worse than whatever the Ds tried the last couple years based on US History. 

Finally, thanks for also saying we are a republic and not democracy.....which is dumb because a republic is a type of democracy. 

posted by ptown_trojans_1

Yeah...I don't think you understand US History and how rare/ dangerous what the President did in comparisoon to other times in history. 

Your post proves quite the opposite. 3 impeachment’s ever, 4 or 5 nearly devastating contested elections.

Yup, this is more “rare”.

The election is three weeks old, and the transition is now moving along, some eight weeks before the swearing in. Hardly "devastating". Certainly less damaging than Congress using impeachment for purely partisan reasons. Disclaimer: Trump's conduct in regard to the election results makes him more of an asshole than ever, which for him is quite the accomplishment.

posted by jmog

Your post proves quite the opposite. 3 impeachment’s ever, 4 or 5 nearly devastating contested elections.

Yup, this is more “rare”.

Yeah...if you think what Trump is doing is just like the other times, you do not understand US History. One little link you posted just glosses over a lot of things. 

For example, in 1960, Nixon conceded easily so it cannot be used. The examples in the 1880s were a little different based on the system in place at the time. But, even then, it was not at the level of what Trump is saying and doing. Trump is basically saying the entire election result is false. 

posted by queencitybuckeye

The election is three weeks old, and the transition is now moving along, some eight weeks before the swearing in. Hardly "devastating". Certainly less damaging than Congress using impeachment for purely partisan reasons. Disclaimer: Trump's conduct in regard to the election results makes him more of an asshole than ever, which for him is quite the accomplishment.

Yeah, that is because the adults in the room, the Republican party, basically told him it's over. 

posted by ptown_trojans_1

Yeah, that is because the adults in the room, the Republican party, basically told him it's over. 

True. Sadly no one in the minority party in either of the last two impeachments took on that role.

posted by ptown_trojans_1

I can't wait for the evidence in the courts to back that up...oh...you mean there is actually zero evidence.....

Again, cite the actual court case and evidence or get the fuck out of here with your bullshit. 

Again, you have no answer for the statistical impossibilities.  These few counties did not magically go from 55% turnout to 90%.  If you believe that, you likely believed the Russia hoax as well.

posted by ptown_trojans_1

Yeah...I don't think you understand US History and how rare/ dangerous what the President did in comparisoon to other times in history. 

Laughable

posted by ptown_trojans_1

Yeah...if you think what Trump is doing is just like the other times, you do not understand US History. One little link you posted just glosses over a lot of things. 

For example, in 1960, Nixon conceded easily so it cannot be used. The examples in the 1880s were a little different based on the system in place at the time. But, even then, it was not at the level of what Trump is saying and doing. Trump is basically saying the entire election result is false. 

I think the last two pages of this thread has proven you to be the one that doesn’t understand history as you have been proven wrong a couple times on historical items.

Either you don’t understand it or are a partisan hack unwilling to admit when you make a mistake or are wrong.

posted by jmog

I think the last two pages of this thread has proven you to be the one that doesn’t understand history as you have been proven wrong a couple times on historical items.

Either you don’t understand it or are a partisan hack unwilling to admit when you make a mistake or are wrong.

the latter of the two is likely correct.  So blinded by DC and the deepness of the swamp.  People like PTown want to write the Chapter on this stuff in the history books.  History will write itself.

posted by gut

Contest the election, fine.  But don't let your lawyers run around telling everyone they have proof "Trump won by millions of votes"....while not supplying any proof.  Even Rush Limbaugh said you can't promise bombshells, and then not produce anything.

Undermining confidence in our elections, both at home and abroad, is easily the worst thing Trump has done.  Fortunately, with his history of lying I doubt anyone takes him seriously.  Well, aside from millions in the MAGA nation who still believe, without any evidence at all, that Trump won.

You sound just like the like AP

posted by QuakerOats

You sound just like the like AP

Says the guy who regularly sounds like a QAnon nut.