RedBlackAttack wrote:

fish82 wrote:

RedBlackAttack wrote:

fish82 wrote:

RedBlackAttack wrote:

4. So, you think the Big 3 are on the level of FNC when it comes to advancing an ideology and riling up a specific group of people? I have a BA in journalism and I can tell you that today's media is all pathetic, but FNC literally breaks every rule that honest reporting is supposed to abide by.

Don't get me wrong... I have some of the same problems with MSNBC and my disdain for Olbermann is on the level of my disgust with Beck and Hannity. But, there is no other news station that has the power of FNC, because it is far and away the most successful 24 hour news station and it is the most consistent in its framing of the conversation to appeal to a very specific political ideology.

Are you confusing Fox's reporting with their opinion people (Hannity, Beck, etc.)? I see nothing wrong with their reporting of news events- you can disagree with their opinion people all you want- and it's no fluke they're successful, because people need an alternative to the mainstream media and their absolute delinquency with regard to exposing Obama and his radical ideas.

The Big 3 have a free ticket into the living rooms of every single American and have so for decades now. Not to mention libs have:

1. Most major print newspaper markets: NY Times, LA Times, Washington Post, etc.

2. Pretty much every big-time Hollywood actor/actress and music star, and you can throw in some high-profile pro athletes there too. Those who dare to speak in favor of conservative ideas are silenced or ostracized.

It's hilarious that libs have all of these factors in their favor (and have for years) and they whine about FoxNews and talk radio as if it were oppressive government propaganda.

queencitybuckeye wrote:

IggyPride00 wrote: If things start to turn around even slightly economically he is poised to become a monster because somewhere out there he seems to have a sizable support base that seems to be totally immune to whatever happens to him politically negative.

Which would be unfortunate as it would perpetuate and reinforce an incorrecy cause and effect relationship. Of course, it somewhat depends on how bad the coming inflation gets, as he'll own that too, and legitimately.

jhay78 wrote:

RedBlackAttack wrote:

fish82 wrote:

RedBlackAttack wrote:

fish82 wrote:

RedBlackAttack wrote:

4. So, you think the Big 3 are on the level of FNC when it comes to advancing an ideology and riling up a specific group of people? I have a BA in journalism and I can tell you that today's media is all pathetic, but FNC literally breaks every rule that honest reporting is supposed to abide by.

Don't get me wrong... I have some of the same problems with MSNBC and my disdain for Olbermann is on the level of my disgust with Beck and Hannity. But, there is no other news station that has the power of FNC, because it is far and away the most successful 24 hour news station and it is the most consistent in its framing of the conversation to appeal to a very specific political ideology.

Are you confusing Fox's reporting with their opinion people (Hannity, Beck, etc.)? I see nothing wrong with their reporting of news events- you can disagree with their opinion people all you want- and it's no fluke they're successful, because people need an alternative to the mainstream media and their absolute delinquency with regard to exposing Obama and his radical ideas.

The Big 3 have a free ticket into the living rooms of every single American and have so for decades now. Not to mention libs have:

1. Most major print newspaper markets: NY Times, LA Times, Washington Post, etc.

2. Pretty much every big-time Hollywood actor/actress and music star, and you can throw in some high-profile pro athletes there too. Those who dare to speak in favor of conservative ideas are silenced or ostracized.

It's hilarious that libs have all of these factors in their favor (and have for years) and they whine about FoxNews and talk radio as if it were oppressive government propaganda.

I'm good with Fox News...except the "Fair and Balanced" bullshit that they promote. There are actually people out there that think they are "fair and balanced".

What Fox ought to do is hyperlink the political views of Rupert Murdoch.

2. Pretty much every big-time Hollywood actor/actress and music star, and you can throw in some high-profile pro athletes there too. Those who dare to speak in favor of conservative ideas are silenced or ostracized.

It's hilarious that libs have all of these factors in their favor (and have for years) and they whine about FoxNews and talk radio as if it were oppressive government propaganda.

jhay78 wrote:

RedBlackAttack wrote:

fish82 wrote:

RedBlackAttack wrote:

fish82 wrote:

RedBlackAttack wrote:

4. So, you think the Big 3 are on the level of FNC when it comes to advancing an ideology and riling up a specific group of people? I have a BA in journalism and I can tell you that today's media is all pathetic, but FNC literally breaks every rule that honest reporting is supposed to abide by.

Don't get me wrong... I have some of the same problems with MSNBC and my disdain for Olbermann is on the level of my disgust with Beck and Hannity. But, there is no other news station that has the power of FNC, because it is far and away the most successful 24 hour news station and it is the most consistent in its framing of the conversation to appeal to a very specific political ideology.

Are you confusing Fox's reporting with their opinion people (Hannity, Beck, etc.)? I see nothing wrong with their reporting of news events- you can disagree with their opinion people all you want- and it's no fluke they're successful, because people need an alternative to the mainstream media and their absolute delinquency with regard to exposing Obama and his radical ideas.

If you think that the 'news division' of FNC and entirely separate and completely devoid of the agendas that are far more blatant on the 'editorial division' of the staff, I don't know what to tell you.

Since FNC trotted out this latest talking point, media matters has followed their 'news division' and there are literally countless examples of the lines blurring to a point wherein there is no significant difference between the news division and the opinion page.

It got to a point, in fact, where FNC had to publicly admit that their 'news hours,' which they deem objective (while countless examples show otherwise) consist of nine hours in their 24 hour cycle.

So, even if I were discussing the 'opinion' portion of the channel, that is the vast majority of their daily programming, so my overriding point would still be a valid one.

But, when you have the 'news hours' playing with semantics like changing the universally understood reference to the 'public option' being changed in FNC's 'news hours' to the 'government option' on the advice of Frank Luntz, it becomes difficult to take them seriously.

Or, how about when Megyn Kelly built an entire 'news hour' segment around Beck's criticism of the government's healthcare plan?

How about the 'news hour' shows doctoring videos in order to make far right rallies seem like more than they actually are, which FNC was forced to apologize for after it was pointed out by the Daily Show?

So, even by FNC's own admission, the 'news hours' (which are not clearly labeled so that people can tell the opinion from the news and it is often difficult with them blurring the lines so often) encompass considerably less than 50 percent of their overall product. When you throw in the fact that those news hours shows are also filled with wordplay and gentle nudgings that prepare the watchers for the avalanche of extreme right wing propaganda to come, there is nothing unbiased about that entertainment station (a much more apt description).

I don't feel like you have to be right or left to understand that FNC is devoted to getting specific messages out. We should all want a station that labels itself as 'fair and balanced' to live up to that claim.

I would give similar criticisms to MSNBC, for what it is worth. The only show I occasionally watch on that station is Morning Joe, which ironically is hosted and dominated by a moderate conservative.

What is the last show on FNC that gave three hours every day to a liberal host?

All other news organizations are bad and they should be ashamed, but FNC is in a league by itself when it comes to efficiently packaging propaganda in a cohesive, 24-hour a day product.

jhay78 wrote:1. Most major print newspaper markets: NY Times, LA Times, Washington Post, etc.

I guess no one reads the Washington Times, New York Post, and The Wall Street Journal, eh? For every example of a liberal slanting newspaper you can give me, I can match it with a conservative one. To claim that print is dominated by liberals is nonsense.

In fact, if you go through the big city newspapers, for every liberal slanting publication, there will almost always be a publication available that offers the other side of the debate.

NY Times - NY Post
Washington Post - Washington Times
etc.

jhay78 wrote:2. Pretty much every big-time Hollywood actor/actress and music star, and you can throw in some high-profile pro athletes there too. Those who dare to speak in favor of conservative ideas are silenced or ostracized.

I don't see how it is the fault of the left that there are talented artists that also happen to be of a progressive mindset.

Btw, if you go to most country concerts, I doubt you will see the acts being 'shunned' for conservative viewpoints... And country music has a huge following.

Writerbuckeye wrote: Ever notice that you never, ever see similar stories coming out about liberals/Democrats?

There's two reasons.

One, the loons have already taken over the party's main platform so there really aren't any groups outside the "norm" for Democrats, anymore.

The other reason is that the same loons who control the Democrat Party also control the media and do their level best not to hurt the party's image. They're good soldiers in the battle for hearts and minds.

So if a Republican doesn't walk in lock step WITH THE PARTY AS IT IS VIEWED BY LIBERALS (not other conservatives), it becomes a news story.

See how that works...

RedBlackAttack wrote:

Writerbuckeye wrote: Ever notice that you never, ever see similar stories coming out about liberals/Democrats?

There's two reasons.

One, the loons have already taken over the party's main platform so there really aren't any groups outside the "norm" for Democrats, anymore.

The other reason is that the same loons who control the Democrat Party also control the media and do their level best not to hurt the party's image. They're good soldiers in the battle for hearts and minds.

So if a Republican doesn't walk in lock step WITH THE PARTY AS IT IS VIEWED BY LIBERALS (not other conservatives), it becomes a news story.

See how that works...

That is laughable.

To state that Democrats are the ones that have no levels of moderate-to-extreme in the party when comparing them to Republicans is the epitome of the pot calling the kettle black.

Hell... In a congress in which the Democrats had a near super majority, the most control for either party since the 70s, the healthcare reform still almost didn't pass and the final tally included... What? Over 30 Dems that voted against the President's bill?

You had Democrats arguing the Pro Life stance which is historically a conservative social issue.

The stimulus package passed with zero GOP votes.

As I've pointed out before in this thread, Olympia Snowe tried to reach out to the President and help craft a bill that may be beneficial to the views of both sides and she was shunned by her party and had to come crawling back.

Democrats ROUTINELY vote outside of party lines, as evidenced by two days ago.

These are the Democrats that voted against the President's plan:

John Adler NJ-3
Jason Altmire PA-4
Michael Arcuri NY-24
John Barrow GA-12
Marion Berry ARK-1
Dan Boren OK-2
Rick Boucher VA-9
Bobby Bright AL-2
Ben Chandler KY-6
Travis Childers MISS-1
Artur Davis AL-7
Lincoln Davis TN-4
Chet Edwards TX-17
Parker Griffith AL-5
Stephanie Herseth Sandlin SD-1
Tim Holden PA-1
Larry Kissell NC-8
Frank Kratovil MD-1
Daniel Lipinski IL-3
Stephen F. Lynch MA-9
Jim Marshall GA-8
Jim Matheson UT-2
Mike McIntyre NC-7
Michael McMahon NY-13
Charlie Melancon LA-3
Walt Minnick ID-1
Glenn Nye VA-2
Collin Peterson MN-7
Mike Ross AR-4
Heath Shuler NC-11
Ike Skelton MO-4
Zack Space OH-18
John Tanner TN-8
Gene Taylor MS-4
Harry Teague NM-2

...but, there are no contrasting voices in the party?

The 2001 Bush tax cuts were passed with the support of all Republican senators (with the exception of John McCain) and it also included 12 Democratic 'yes' votes in the Senate.

RedBlackAttack wrote:

jhay78 wrote:

RedBlackAttack wrote:

fish82 wrote:

RedBlackAttack wrote:

fish82 wrote:

RedBlackAttack wrote:

4. So, you think the Big 3 are on the level of FNC when it comes to advancing an ideology and riling up a specific group of people? I have a BA in journalism and I can tell you that today's media is all pathetic, but FNC literally breaks every rule that honest reporting is supposed to abide by.

Don't get me wrong... I have some of the same problems with MSNBC and my disdain for Olbermann is on the level of my disgust with Beck and Hannity. But, there is no other news station that has the power of FNC, because it is far and away the most successful 24 hour news station and it is the most consistent in its framing of the conversation to appeal to a very specific political ideology.

Are you confusing Fox's reporting with their opinion people (Hannity, Beck, etc.)? I see nothing wrong with their reporting of news events- you can disagree with their opinion people all you want- and it's no fluke they're successful, because people need an alternative to the mainstream media and their absolute delinquency with regard to exposing Obama and his radical ideas.

If you think that the 'news division' of FNC and entirely separate and completely devoid of the agendas that are far more blatant on the 'editorial division' of the staff, I don't know what to tell you.

Since FNC trotted out this latest talking point, media matters has followed their 'news division' and there are literally countless examples of the lines blurring to a point wherein there is no significant difference between the news division and the opinion page.

It got to a point, in fact, where FNC had to publicly admit that their 'news hours,' which they deem objective (while countless examples show otherwise) consist of nine hours in their 24 hour cycle.

So, even if I were discussing the 'opinion' portion of the channel, that is the vast majority of their daily programming, so my overriding point would still be a valid one.

But, when you have the 'news hours' playing with semantics like changing the universally understood reference to the 'public option' being changed in FNC's 'news hours' to the 'government option' on the advice of Frank Luntz, it becomes difficult to take them seriously.

Or, how about when Megyn Kelly built an entire 'news hour' segment around Beck's criticism of the government's healthcare plan?

How about the 'news hour' shows doctoring videos in order to make far right rallies seem like more than they actually are, which FNC was forced to apologize for after it was pointed out by the Daily Show?

So, even by FNC's own admission, the 'news hours' (which are not clearly labeled so that people can tell the opinion from the news and it is often difficult with them blurring the lines so often) encompass considerably less than 50 percent of their overall product. When you throw in the fact that those news hours shows are also filled with wordplay and gentle nudgings that prepare the watchers for the avalanche of extreme right wing propaganda to come, there is nothing unbiased about that entertainment station (a much more apt description).

I don't feel like you have to be right or left to understand that FNC is devoted to getting specific messages out. We should all want a station that labels itself as 'fair and balanced' to live up to that claim.

I would give similar criticisms to MSNBC, for what it is worth. The only show I occasionally watch on that station is Morning Joe, which ironically is hosted and dominated by a moderate conservative.

What is the last show on FNC that gave three hours every day to a liberal host?

All other news organizations are bad and they should be ashamed, but FNC is in a league by itself when it comes to efficiently packaging propaganda in a cohesive, 24-hour a day product.

jhay78 wrote:1. Most major print newspaper markets: NY Times, LA Times, Washington Post, etc.

I guess no one reads the Washington Times, New York Post, and The Wall Street Journal, eh? For every example of a liberal slanting newspaper you can give me, I can match it with a conservative one. To claim that print is dominated by liberals is nonsense.

In fact, if you go through the big city newspapers, for every liberal slanting publication, there will almost always be a publication available that offers the other side of the debate.

NY Times - NY Post
Washington Post - Washington Times
etc.

jhay78 wrote:2. Pretty much every big-time Hollywood actor/actress and music star, and you can throw in some high-profile pro athletes there too. Those who dare to speak in favor of conservative ideas are silenced or ostracized.

I don't see how it is the fault of the left that there are talented artists that also happen to be of a progressive mindset.

Btw, if you go to most country concerts, I doubt you will see the acts being 'shunned' for conservative viewpoints... And country music has a huge following.

I'll agree with most of that about FoxNews, but IMO they balance out the views of MSNBC and CNN. Libs still have the Big 3 and have for awhile.

I stand by the Hollywood stars and their influence on the American public. Any kid who watches the evening news and follows and listens to Hollywood stars spout their ideas will naturally by default (excluding influence of parents) lean to the left. So the deck is stacked for libs as far as media in general in concerned.

Back to the topic of the thread, to suggest that Repub's have been hijacked by the extreme right is laughable. Who was their last candidate for prez? Was it a right-wing nut job- no, it was fence-sitting, reach-across-the-aisle, go-against-my-party-when-I-have-to, maverick John McCain, and he got his behind kicked.
Repubs have done OK when they stayed true to conservative roots and leaned to the right- at least they did in 80 (Reagan won 44 states) and 84 (he won 49).

Paladin wrote: This is hilarious. The freak shows here just can't see the "real" picture -- all the Major newspapers, the Big 3 networks, the famous Hollywood stars, etc are a REFLECTION of the country. The Ds SWEPT the elections for Prez, Senate & House....... cleaned R's clocks in state election for Govs and Legislatures. THAT is the mainstream of the country, folks. The misfits are the extremists at the "tea parties", Faux News, the "conservative" talk radio and what is left of the R party now that they have chased out the Moderates of their own party. Frum is pointing out that Rs made major mistakes and the worst is still ahead, that elections will still have bad consequences for the R party. Obstructionists politics, Tea Party idiots and extreme positions doom the Rs for years to come. That is Frum 's message. Because the Rs are not mainstream America anymore.

Paladin wrote: This is hilarious. The freak shows here just can't see the "real" picture -- all the Major newspapers, the Big 3 networks, the famous Hollywood stars, etc are a REFLECTION of the country.

The Ds SWEPT the elections for Prez, Senate & House....... cleaned R's clocks in state election for Govs and Legislatures. THAT is the mainstream of the country, folks.

The misfits are the extremists at the "tea parties", Faux News, the "conservative" talk radio and what is left of the R party now that they have chased out the Moderates of their own party.

Frum is pointing out that Rs made major mistakes and the worst is still ahead, that elections will still have bad consequences for the R party. Obstructionists politics, Tea Party idiots and extreme positions doom the Rs for years to come.

That is Frum 's message. Because the Rs are not mainstream America anymore.

jhay78 wrote:

Paladin wrote: This is hilarious. The freak shows here just can't see the "real" picture -- all the Major newspapers, the Big 3 networks, the famous Hollywood stars, etc are a REFLECTION of the country.

Yeah, you're right- Hollywood stars live normal everday lives just like the rest of us. They're a reflection of 1% of 1% of society with their lifestyles- and you'll never hear the prez or the Hypo-crats whining about their incomes or distributing their wealth.

The Ds SWEPT the elections for Prez, Senate & House....... cleaned R's clocks in state election for Govs and Legislatures. THAT is the mainstream of the country, folks.

In 2008- with a bad economy, a controversial war, and an irresponsible mainstream media who refused to expose BHO's radical associations/beliefs and instead bowed down and worshiped him along with every other American with an attention span of 5 seconds.

The misfits are the extremists at the "tea parties", Faux News, the "conservative" talk radio and what is left of the R party now that they have chased out the Moderates of their own party.

Fail- "extremists" have made FoxNews by far the most watched news network, and have paved the way for talk radio to become more popular everyday.

Frum is pointing out that Rs made major mistakes and the worst is still ahead, that elections will still have bad consequences for the R party. Obstructionists politics, Tea Party idiots and extreme positions doom the Rs for years to come.

:huh:

That's why they won governor races in Virginia (voted for Obama in '08) and New Jersey (also Obama in '08, heavy blue state) in November 2009, and put Scott Brown in freaking Ted Kennedy's seat in Massachusetts in January.

That is Frum 's message. Because the Rs are not mainstream America anymore.

How quickly we forget. If mainstream America had a vote, and not the jackasses in DC who cut deals and used every backroom trick and tactic they could come up with (despite having their precious majority), Obamacare would've gone down in flames along the lines of 60% to 40%.
Republicans can't wait until November and Frum needs a little history lesson going back to Nov. '09 and Jan. 2010.

derek bomar wrote:

jhay78 wrote:

Paladin wrote: This is hilarious. The freak shows here just can't see the "real" picture -- all the Major newspapers, the Big 3 networks, the famous Hollywood stars, etc are a REFLECTION of the country.

Yeah, you're right- Hollywood stars live normal everday lives just like the rest of us. They're a reflection of 1% of 1% of society with their lifestyles- and you'll never hear the prez or the Hypo-crats whining about their incomes or distributing their wealth.

The Ds SWEPT the elections for Prez, Senate & House....... cleaned R's clocks in state election for Govs and Legislatures. THAT is the mainstream of the country, folks.

In 2008- with a bad economy, a controversial war, and an irresponsible mainstream media who refused to expose BHO's radical associations/beliefs and instead bowed down and worshiped him along with every other American with an attention span of 5 seconds.

The misfits are the extremists at the "tea parties", Faux News, the "conservative" talk radio and what is left of the R party now that they have chased out the Moderates of their own party.

Fail- "extremists" have made FoxNews by far the most watched news network, and have paved the way for talk radio to become more popular everyday.

Frum is pointing out that Rs made major mistakes and the worst is still ahead, that elections will still have bad consequences for the R party. Obstructionists politics, Tea Party idiots and extreme positions doom the Rs for years to come.

:huh:

That's why they won governor races in Virginia (voted for Obama in '08) and New Jersey (also Obama in '08, heavy blue state) in November 2009, and put Scott Brown in freaking Ted Kennedy's seat in Massachusetts in January.

That is Frum 's message. Because the Rs are not mainstream America anymore.

How quickly we forget. If mainstream America had a vote, and not the jackasses in DC who cut deals and used every backroom trick and tactic they could come up with (despite having their precious majority), Obamacare would've gone down in flames along the lines of 60% to 40%.
Republicans can't wait until November and Frum needs a little history lesson going back to Nov. '09 and Jan. 2010.

49% of people polled yesterday said it was a good first step...they may not have exactly voted for the bill he put out, but they don't necessarily think the bill is going in the wrong direction either...jus sayin...he's going to get a lot of credit for doing something no one else before him (good or bad) could do, plus there really are some good things in this bill even if you hate how it was accomplished. Hopefully in a few years it can be approved upon, because I don't see the majority of the bill being overturned or changed.

Paladin wrote: Keep it up. I like that the Rs think all is well with their party, their positions and their plank. Can't ask for a better chance than to run against the party of no, no ideas, no tolerance, and no truth.

Writerbuckeye wrote: And yet a new CBS poll says a vast majority want Republicans to keep fighting against the just passed healthcare bill. I'd say the R's are doing something right and should keep on doing it.

Paladin wrote: Keep it up. I like that the Rs think all is well with their party, their positions and their plank. Can't ask for a better chance than to run against the party of no, no ideas, no tolerance, and no truth.

derek bomar wrote:

jhay78 wrote:

Paladin wrote: This is hilarious. The freak shows here just can't see the "real" picture -- all the Major newspapers, the Big 3 networks, the famous Hollywood stars, etc are a REFLECTION of the country.

Yeah, you're right- Hollywood stars live normal everday lives just like the rest of us. They're a reflection of 1% of 1% of society with their lifestyles- and you'll never hear the prez or the Hypo-crats whining about their incomes or distributing their wealth.

The Ds SWEPT the elections for Prez, Senate & House....... cleaned R's clocks in state election for Govs and Legislatures. THAT is the mainstream of the country, folks.

In 2008- with a bad economy, a controversial war, and an irresponsible mainstream media who refused to expose BHO's radical associations/beliefs and instead bowed down and worshiped him along with every other American with an attention span of 5 seconds.

The misfits are the extremists at the "tea parties", Faux News, the "conservative" talk radio and what is left of the R party now that they have chased out the Moderates of their own party.

Fail- "extremists" have made FoxNews by far the most watched news network, and have paved the way for talk radio to become more popular everyday.

Frum is pointing out that Rs made major mistakes and the worst is still ahead, that elections will still have bad consequences for the R party. Obstructionists politics, Tea Party idiots and extreme positions doom the Rs for years to come.

:huh:

That's why they won governor races in Virginia (voted for Obama in '08) and New Jersey (also Obama in '08, heavy blue state) in November 2009, and put Scott Brown in freaking Ted Kennedy's seat in Massachusetts in January.

That is Frum 's message. Because the Rs are not mainstream America anymore.

How quickly we forget. If mainstream America had a vote, and not the jackasses in DC who cut deals and used every backroom trick and tactic they could come up with (despite having their precious majority), Obamacare would've gone down in flames along the lines of 60% to 40%.
Republicans can't wait until November and Frum needs a little history lesson going back to Nov. '09 and Jan. 2010.

49% of people polled yesterday said it was a good first step...they may not have exactly voted for the bill he put out, but they don't necessarily think the bill is going in the wrong direction either...jus sayin...he's going to get a lot of credit for doing something no one else before him (good or bad) could do, plus there really are some good things in this bill even if you hate how it was accomplished. Hopefully in a few years it can be approved upon, because I don't see the majority of the bill being overturned or changed.

tk421 wrote:

Writerbuckeye wrote: And yet a new CBS poll says a vast majority want Republicans to keep fighting against the just passed healthcare bill. I'd say the R's are doing something right and should keep on doing it.

OMG. Facts. What is going on? The party of no, backed up by the American people. What ever will the Democrats do? That poll is obviously biased or not from a reputable(Democratic controlled) news source. Wait a minute, CBS? What the heck. Someone in D.C better get on the phone.

Writerbuckeye wrote: And yet a new CBS poll says a vast majority want Republicans to keep fighting against the just passed healthcare bill. I'd say the R's are doing something right and should keep on doing it.