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"Z" Watch

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Eric Taylor

Senior Member

602 posts
Mar 23, 2010 5:23 PM
I read in one article today that he is going to explore the FA market after the season.
Mar 23, 2010 5:23pm
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devil1197

Senior Member

6,220 posts
Mar 23, 2010 5:39 PM
Eric Taylor wrote: I read in one article today that he is going to explore the FA market after the season.
He could get more $$$ from other teams, but in the end he'll either stay with the Cavs or retire.

He will never wear another teams jersey.
Mar 23, 2010 5:39pm
royal_k's avatar

royal_k

Senior Member

4,423 posts
Mar 23, 2010 5:48 PM
devil1197 wrote:
Eric Taylor wrote: I read in one article today that he is going to explore the FA market after the season.
He could get more $$$ from other teams, but in the end he'll either stay with the Cavs or retire.

He will never wear another teams jersey.
I tend to agree with this. He loves being a Cav, and the fans love him.
Mar 23, 2010 5:48pm
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devil1197

Senior Member

6,220 posts
Mar 23, 2010 5:58 PM
I know he loves the Cavs, but it probably deals most with his personality and where he lives. He is a very low key individual and the area where he live suits him and his family perfect. I doubt he ever leaves the Cleveland area.
Mar 23, 2010 5:58pm
jordo212000's avatar

jordo212000

Senior Member

10,664 posts
Mar 23, 2010 6:08 PM
Yikes. I don't like the fact that they waived Darnell Jackson.
Mar 23, 2010 6:08pm
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devil1197

Senior Member

6,220 posts
Mar 23, 2010 6:10 PM
jordo212000 wrote: Yikes. I don't like the fact that they waived Darnell Jackson.
Lol, why?
Mar 23, 2010 6:10pm
jordo212000's avatar

jordo212000

Senior Member

10,664 posts
Mar 23, 2010 6:12 PM
Had nice potential. You waive a young guy with potential for Z who at this point has little to offer besides a feel good story for ESPN. It's a business, not a Lifetime Movie.
Mar 23, 2010 6:12pm
Lovejoy1984's avatar

Lovejoy1984

Senior Member

5,277 posts
Mar 23, 2010 6:23 PM
Jackson for Z is a good move at this point.

Jackson has barely sniffed the court this season. Come playoff time, Z will be our 2nd big off the bench.
Mar 23, 2010 6:23pm
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devil1197

Senior Member

6,220 posts
Mar 23, 2010 6:43 PM
jordo212000 wrote: Had nice potential. You waive a young guy with potential for Z who at this point has little to offer besides a feel good story for ESPN. It's a business, not a Lifetime Movie.
Yeah, one guy will play and one won't in the playoffs.

Guys like Jackson are a dime a dozen, while guys like Z aren't. You just don't find 7'3 guys who can still knock down outside jumpers and is one of the better offensive rebounders around the rim at his age.
Mar 23, 2010 6:43pm
SQ_Crazies's avatar

SQ_Crazies

The Godfather

7,977 posts
Mar 23, 2010 7:11 PM
Z makes us stronger against the best teams in the league. D-Block rode the bench. 99.9% of the time there is a cheap free agent that is similar to Jackson. Not saying he doesn't have potential, but we absolutely don't need him and he wasn't ever going to play. He isn't a center and IMO isn't athletic enough to play there like JJ is. So he's a 4 and he's on a roster with Jamison, Varejao and Hickson. So there is a very talented vet, and 2 players that are young like Jackson and both better on the roster. No reason to keep him and it certainly doesn't hurt to lose him.

Again, not saying he doesn't have potential and can't be a solid player--in fact I think he can be. But not with the Cavs, the only way he'll ever be more highly regarded than Andy or JJ is if he goes and shows it on the court somewhere else. He's never going to beat those two out based on practice, he needs minutes.
Mar 23, 2010 7:11pm
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trep14

Senior Member

842 posts
Mar 23, 2010 7:38 PM
I gotta agree that I don't like waiving Jackson. I understand the sentimental value in bring Z back, but if Jackson was given a shot, he might have been that beloved Cleveland guy that Z has become.
Mar 23, 2010 7:38pm
SQ_Crazies's avatar

SQ_Crazies

The Godfather

7,977 posts
Mar 23, 2010 7:43 PM
LOL they did not bring Z back for sentimental value. Why does no one think he's done anything for us this season?
Mar 23, 2010 7:43pm
ytownfootball's avatar

ytownfootball

Bold faced liar...

6,978 posts
Mar 23, 2010 7:49 PM
Z is a sentimental fan favorite, LOL, but my God the guy is a vital piece of the Cav success. How many 7' 3" guys can post on the wing and knock down 4 straight 3's? His mid range is a bitch to account for.
Mar 23, 2010 7:49pm
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jordo212000

Senior Member

10,664 posts
Mar 23, 2010 8:03 PM
Playoffs? I prefer the front court of Shaq, Varejao, Jamison, and Hickson. Sure Z can hit an open jumpshot.... but so can Jamison. You need a guy underneath the hoop now that we have a stretch 4. My issue with Z is that Z is a statue defensively. Howard ate his lunch last year in the playoffs.

A crowded rotation just got more crowded. There goes some more of Hickson's minutes.
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As for Jackson, some of you are right, he probably wouldn't see much playing time next year either, but he might have had some decent trade value. They could have moved him for another piece.
Mar 23, 2010 8:03pm
Lovejoy1984's avatar

Lovejoy1984

Senior Member

5,277 posts
Mar 23, 2010 8:07 PM
jordo212000 wrote: Playoffs? I prefer the front court of Shaq, Varejao, Jamison, and Hickson. Sure Z can hit an open jumpshot.... but so can Jamison. You need a guy underneath the hoop now that we have a stretch 4. My issue with Z is that Z is a statue defensively. Howard ate his lunch last year in the playoffs.

A crowded rotation just got more crowded. There goes some more of Hickson's minutes.
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As for Jackson, some of you are right, he probably wouldn't see much playing time next year either, but he might have had some decent trade value. They could have moved him for another piece.
With him only playing 4.2 minutes a game, I fail to see how he'd have any trade value, other than being a warm body to be an add on to a trade to make the #'s work.
Mar 23, 2010 8:07pm
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Be Nice

Senior Member

1,120 posts
Mar 23, 2010 8:10 PM
Z's the man. Shaq will be traded. wink, wink
Mar 23, 2010 8:10pm
ytownfootball's avatar

ytownfootball

Bold faced liar...

6,978 posts
Mar 23, 2010 8:11 PM
My opinion is that Z's value is not based soley on what he brings to the table individually, as he has obviously declined over the years, but rather what he does to the oposition when he and Shaq are on the floor. Let's face it, Z doesn't possess the ups he once had, but at 7'3" are ups really required? No. Wingspan is huge and he causes shots to be altered, he won't get 5 blocks/game but he doesn't need to.
Mar 23, 2010 8:11pm
jordo212000's avatar

jordo212000

Senior Member

10,664 posts
Mar 23, 2010 8:11 PM
HighRoller74 wrote: With him only playing 4.2 minutes a game, I fail to see how he'd have any trade value, other than being a warm body to be an add on to a trade to make the #'s work.
Well that might be because you only see his minutes with the Cavs. You would have to be naive to think that NBA scouts haven't had an eye on his D league numbers/ the minutes he did get with the Cavs.
Mar 23, 2010 8:11pm
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trep14

Senior Member

842 posts
Mar 23, 2010 8:12 PM
ytownfootball wrote: My opinion is that Z's value is not based soley on what he brings to the table individually, as he has obviously declined over the years, but rather what he does to the oposition when he and Shaq are on the floor. Let's face it, Z doesn't possess the ups he once had, but at 7'3" are ups really required? No. Wingspan is huge and he causes shots to be altered, he won't get 5 blocks/game but he doesn't need to.
Mike Brown? Is that you? I've never heard anyone other than Mike Brown actually defend the infamous" twin towers" lineup before.
Mar 23, 2010 8:12pm
ytownfootball's avatar

ytownfootball

Bold faced liar...

6,978 posts
Mar 23, 2010 8:14 PM
trep14 wrote:
ytownfootball wrote: My opinion is that Z's value is not based soley on what he brings to the table individually, as he has obviously declined over the years, but rather what he does to the oposition when he and Shaq are on the floor. Let's face it, Z doesn't possess the ups he once had, but at 7'3" are ups really required? No. Wingspan is huge and he causes shots to be altered, he won't get 5 blocks/game but he doesn't need to.
Mike Brown? Is that you? I've never heard anyone other than Mike Brown actually defend the infamous" twin towers" lineup before.
Christmas Day 2009 ring a bell?
Mar 23, 2010 8:14pm
jordo212000's avatar

jordo212000

Senior Member

10,664 posts
Mar 23, 2010 8:16 PM
trep14 wrote:
ytownfootball wrote: My opinion is that Z's value is not based soley on what he brings to the table individually, as he has obviously declined over the years, but rather what he does to the oposition when he and Shaq are on the floor. Let's face it, Z doesn't possess the ups he once had, but at 7'3" are ups really required? No. Wingspan is huge and he causes shots to be altered, he won't get 5 blocks/game but he doesn't need to.
Mike Brown? Is that you? I've never heard anyone other than Mike Brown actually defend the infamous" twin towers" defense before.
Yeah they actually tried that defense at the beginning of the season and it lead to terrible results. Neither guy has the speed to guard the PF. I can't believe that people still think that is a viable defensive strategy.

Here is a quote from a Washington Times writer who lampooned the defense earlier this season, "Brown also has taken to experimenting with the Twin Towers of O'Neal and Zydrunas Ilgauskas, which is a dubious undertaking. That leaves the Cavaliers with Slow and Slower on the floor and too many defensive holes to fill."
http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2009/oct/30/tom-knott-cavaliers-start-has-no-defense/

I'd pick and roll the crap out of the lineup. There is no way Z or Shaq could man up a solid PF at this point in their careers
Mar 23, 2010 8:16pm
ytownfootball's avatar

ytownfootball

Bold faced liar...

6,978 posts
Mar 23, 2010 8:23 PM
You don't think I'd seriously suggest that offense for a significant portion of a game or at all given the oposition do you? Use your head.
Mar 23, 2010 8:23pm
T

trep14

Senior Member

842 posts
Mar 23, 2010 8:24 PM
ytownfootball wrote:
trep14 wrote:
ytownfootball wrote: My opinion is that Z's value is not based soley on what he brings to the table individually, as he has obviously declined over the years, but rather what he does to the oposition when he and Shaq are on the floor. Let's face it, Z doesn't possess the ups he once had, but at 7'3" are ups really required? No. Wingspan is huge and he causes shots to be altered, he won't get 5 blocks/game but he doesn't need to.
Mike Brown? Is that you? I've never heard anyone other than Mike Brown actually defend the infamous" twin towers" lineup before.
Christmas Day 2009 ring a bell?
Would it work over a seven game series? I think Phil Jackson would realize that all you need to is get them away from a basket and pick and roll it to death. Neither of them can move.
Mar 23, 2010 8:24pm
ytownfootball's avatar

ytownfootball

Bold faced liar...

6,978 posts
Mar 23, 2010 8:32 PM
Would it work in a seven game series? In limited use, yep.

It's a versatility issue and one more option you can throw at teams. Point is Z adds a lot to this team, even in a limited role.
Mar 23, 2010 8:32pm
F

Footwedge

Senior Member

9,265 posts
Mar 23, 2010 9:08 PM
jordo212000 wrote: Playoffs? I prefer the front court of Shaq, Varejao, Jamison, and Hickson. Sure Z can hit an open jumpshot.... but so can Jamison. You need a guy underneath the hoop now that we have a stretch 4. My issue with Z is that Z is a statue defensively. Howard ate his lunch last year in the playoffs.

A crowded rotation just got more crowded. There goes some more of Hickson's minutes.
---------
As for Jackson, some of you are right, he probably wouldn't see much playing time next year either, but he might have had some decent trade value. They could have moved him for another piece.
Jamison is mediocre from outside of 16 feet. Z can and does stretch the floor. Early on this year, Z's shot was off. But after that, he was really good.

I would love big Z to take 15 monutes or so from Jamsion. With Z on the court, the floor is truly stretched. With Jamison, not so much.

As for rebounding, Z can still clean glass. As another poster said, Z still gets tip ins.
Mar 23, 2010 9:08pm