jmog;1678413 wrote:Hoyer has 56% for the season and was at 54.5% in the preseason, at what point was he 41%? Or is that just another piece of BS you invented yourself, like the Breowns making the playoffs?

77 Manziel QBR vs. 70 QB Hoyer...that's all you need to know. Don't worry..Pettine swings on Mr. McGoos' nuts so you'll be able to enjoy the most inaccurate quarterback in the league do his thing again Sunday.

Footwedge;1678414 wrote:Tell you what olebuddy, this Sunday, when Hoyer throws his usual array of dirt balls, air balls and dropped pick sixes, and somehow escapes with yet another win, you and I can stand up in unison and yell. "Oh McGoo. you've done it again." Bwahahahah. Then I'll drive down to Coshocton and treat you to 9 holes at River Greens along the banks of the Tuscarawas River. My all time best score was 76...at River Greens.

YOu mean the game he threw for over 300 yards and a game winning drive to get them to 7-4 and a half game outta first?

Footwedge;1678419 wrote:77 Manziel QBR vs. 70 QB Hoyer...that's all you need to know. Don't worry..Pettine swings on Mr. McGoos' nuts so you'll be able to enjoy the most inaccurate quarterback in the league do his thing again Sunday.

I just think it is funny that you cherry pick numbers that fit your story, not the whole picture.

You talk about completion % until you are shown that Tarkenton and Manziel are as bad or worse in the NFL than Hoyer. Then you switch to QBR (which Hoyer's is better than Tarkenton's), what's next, their shoe size?

Does anyone really hang their hat on QBR? Didn't Trent Dilfer invent that?

jmog;1678417 wrote:Funny thing is, Failwedge is so engrossed with Tarkenton and how well Manziel compares, all while complaining about Hoyer's completion percentages...

Hoyer-56% completion this season.
Tarkenton-57% completion throughout his career.
Hoyer-82.3 QBR this season
Tarkenton-80.4 QBR for his career.

So are you saying that Manziel could be 1% better than Hoyer?

Before you try to down play the accomplishments of HoF Fran Tearkenton, know this...from wiki..." At the time of his retirement he owned every major quarterback record. He was inducted into the Pro Football Hall of Fame in 1986."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fran_Tarkenton Paragraph 2...if you can count that far.

Now...with that out the way....

Tarkenton played for a horrible expansion team early in his career. Secondly, in his prime years from 67 through 76, his QBR was over 84%. Thirdly, I doubt if QBR rating includes moving sticks with his feet.

Only the ignorant could downplay the achievements of Tarkenton. Take a well deserved bow......you fall into that category.

thavoice;1678421 wrote:YOu mean the game he threw for over 300 yards and a game winning drive to get them to 7-4 and a half game outta first?

If you want to defend Hoyer's game on Sunday...knock yourself out. And I would be careful on using semantics to make a point. RE. "you mean the Brian Hoyer that has led his team into last place this year?" See how that works?

jmog;1678417 wrote:Funny thing is, Failwedge is so engrossed with Tarkenton and how well Manziel compares, all while complaining about Hoyer's completion percentages...

Hoyer-56% completion this season.
Tarkenton-57% completion throughout his career.
Hoyer-82.3 QBR this season
Tarkenton-80.4 QBR for his career.

So are you saying that Manziel could be 1% better than Hoyer?

Completion percentages for ALL quarterbacks were MUCH LOWER back 30/40 years ago. Even Johnny U's rate wasn't great by today's standards. Nor YA Tittle, Van Brocklin. Otto Graham, Bart Starr and so on. Back in those days the rules were defense friendly. Hell. you could clotheline receivers without consequences. Beyond that....I compare Manziel's SCRAMBLING ABILITES to Tarkenton's...not necessarily his passing. Manziel has a much more accurate arm than hall of fame quarterback Fran Tarkenton. Tarkenton never won a Heisman either.

But don't worry. your boy will be out there Sunday throwing his dirtballs and air balls. Yummy!!! All the while the future hall of famer will hold the clipboard and the playoff opportunity will wilt away with the true Browns fan holding their collective noses masking the rancid stench from yet another putrid quarterback performance by the 23rd rated passer.

He is right about rules being "defense friendly" back in the day so that can screw with the numbers. Very hard to compare current players versus even players as far back as the 80's He is wrong about "future hall of famer" though. Only way he gets there is if he's taking tickets at the front door.

BR1986FB;1678452 wrote:He is right about rules being "defense friendly" back in the day so that can screw with the numbers. Very hard to compare current players versus even players as far back as the 80's He is wrong about "future hall of famer" though. Only way he gets there is if he's taking tickets at the front door.

and passing used to be more downfield, with 2-3 guys out in the pattern, whereas today there are so many more higher percentage routes and throws.

thavoice;1678454 wrote:and passing used to be more downfield, with 2-3 guys out in the pattern, whereas today there are so many more higher percentage routes and throws.

Agreed.

BR1986FB;1678452 wrote:He is right about rules being "defense friendly" back in the day so that can screw with the numbers. Very hard to compare current players versus even players as far back as the 80's He is wrong about "future hall of famer" though. Only way he gets there is if he's taking tickets at the front door.

Like I said if alive I'll treat to your favorite breakfast of champions at Duncan donuts in Canton on JJJ's induction day....there's one right on the strip.

Brian Hoyer running the offense andplaying "rabbit's foot football" as the brilliant and eloquent Chuck Booms puts it.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t8GTHXTEvIc

Footwedge;1678440 wrote:Before you try to down play the accomplishments of HoF Fran Tearkenton, know this...from wiki..." At the time of his retirement he owned every major quarterback record. He was inducted into the Pro Football Hall of Fame in 1986."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fran_Tarkenton Paragraph 2...if you can count that far.

Now...with that out the way....

Tarkenton played for a horrible expansion team early in his career. Secondly, in his prime years from 67 through 76, his QBR was over 84%. Thirdly, I doubt if QBR rating includes moving sticks with his feet.

Only the ignorant could downplay the achievements of Tarkenton. Take a well deserved bow......you fall into that category.

Where did I downplay Tarkenton? I just displayed his stats next to Hoyer's. I did nothing more, nothing less.

I agree. I think Tarkenton should be starting over Hoyer this week.

jmog;1678429 wrote:I just think it is funny that you cherry pick numbers that fit your story, not the whole picture.

You talk about completion % until you are shown that Tarkenton and Manziel are as bad or worse in the NFL than Hoyer. Then you switch to QBR (which Hoyer's is better than Tarkenton's), what's next, their shoe size?

Now 'splain to me again how Hoyer's numbers are better than Tarkinington's numbers again, Lucy. Even your own buds here are shaking their heads on yours and Al Turdy's nonsense.

thavoice;1678508 wrote:I agree. I think Tarkenton should be starting over Hoyer this week.

At 70 years old or so...Tark or MaGoo would be a push.

Footwedge;1678512 wrote:Now 'splain to me again how Hoyer's numbers are better than Tarkinington's numbers again, Lucy. Even your own buds here are shaking their heads on yours and Al Turdy's nonsense.

Hoyer has a higher QB rating and a better winning percentage.

Can we shut this thread down so everyone can take a moment to collect themselves?

Well, the Falcons are 1-6 against teams not in their division. Their defense is garbage and overall they are soft. The only advantage for Atlanta is they are in the Dome.

jimmyjjohn;1682463 wrote:Well, the Falcons are 1-6 against teams not in their division. Their defense is garbage and overall they are soft. The only advantage for Atlanta is they are in the Dome.

I agree. When Cleveland plays them, they should have a shot. Probably a real close game decided by a last second field goal or something like that.

Heretic;1682548 wrote:I agree. When Cleveland plays them, they should have a shot. Probably a real close game decided by a last second field goal or something like that.

How well coached do you think it will be?

Rotinaj;1682549 wrote:How well coached do you think it will be?

Probably not very. The "Mike Smith" factor probably will raise its ugly head in a key situation.

Excited for this game. I see a costly interception by hoyer somewhere along the line.

Call it a hunch, but I could see the Falcons owner, Arthur Blank, getting really excited at some point in this one.

Jeff Thomas, who does the 20-20 sports minute updates on the Fan, had a one liner this morning that had me shoot my morning coffee out my nose. The Shanahan interview where he said the quarterback decision was close call but coach decided to go with the guy that has a 7-5 record....and then says he supports the decision to which Thomas quipped"..."better watch out. there's a big truck backing up.

Yeah...I'm sure Shanahan is real pleased playing the 27th ranked quarterback in the NFL against the top rated offense in all of football. Especially given the circumstances that he has a guy with a stronger arm, more accurate arm, and the ability to run it in in the red zone anytime he wants to in the red zone rotting away on the bench.