Gblock, I agree that it helps cross the curriculum between subjects, but my point is that it expects kids to learn things at a rate that IMO is unattainable by students. My son is in the 4th grade, they started on fractions, by the end of his 4th grade year fractions will not be taught anymore, they will use fractions in math, but not taught fractions. That is my point, this curriculum expects kids to grasp concepts that are above their cognitive abilities to grasp and then to use them throughout their educational careers. I have been working with my children since they could talk with basic math facts. The curriculum is too wide for the entire grade level to grasp and use later. Now, are there kids that need that, yes those kids would succeed in the classroom in spite of the curriculum, but I work with special needs kids and they cant grasp the basic concepts, and they don't meet the criteria for alternative so they are stuck with work that might as well be Greek to them!

redstreak one;1523935 wrote:Gblock, I agree that it helps cross the curriculum between subjects, but my point is that it expects kids to learn things at a rate that IMO is unattainable by students. My son is in the 4th grade, they started on fractions, by the end of his 4th grade year fractions will not be taught anymore, they will use fractions in math, but not taught fractions. That is my point, this curriculum expects kids to grasp concepts that are above their cognitive abilities to grasp and then to use them throughout their educational careers. I have been working with my children since they could talk with basic math facts. The curriculum is too wide for the entire grade level to grasp and use later. Now, are there kids that need that, yes those kids would succeed in the classroom in spite of the curriculum, but I work with special needs kids and they cant grasp the basic concepts, and they don't meet the criteria for alternative so they are stuck with work that might as well be Greek to them!

That seems more of an issue of the mentality that we should put everyone in the same courses/No Child Left Behind. Special needs kids aren't going to be able to learn at the same rate and perhaps depth that other kids do, that shouldn't mean we slow down the other kids. I'm also not a fan of fail rate being one of the metrics for a school. Because it is teachers essentially can't fail kids that should be failing.

That said I still think public schools are much better than the alternatives in many cases. Charter schools almost all blow, homeschooling varies greatly but definitely tends to leave kids with a lack of diversity in their opinions (they don't learn or encounter beliefs that challenge what their parents want them to encounter) and sometimes there are social issues with that. Private schools can be excellent but they're also mindblowingly expensive.

I Wear Pants;1523949 wrote:That said I still think public schools are much better than the alternatives in many cases. Charter schools almost all blow, homeschooling varies greatly but definitely tends to leave kids with a lack of diversity in their opinions (they don't learn or encounter beliefs that challenge what their parents want them to encounter) and sometimes there are social issues with that. Private schools can be excellent but they're also mindblowingly expensive.

Personally, I really didn't run into alternative viewpoints in high school (public) that made for any challenge. Most of the people I knew in high school were apathetic in a lot of their worldview development.

The college I attended had enough students that had been home-schooled up until that point that you were virtually unable to avoid getting to know several each year, and I have to say that the homeschooled students, while sometimes socially behind, were often the better critical thinkers in classes, as well as the ones who were educated beyond the average student in subjects of a core curriculum nature.

Again, I was never homeschooled, but I've interacted with a lot of formerly-homeschooled classmates, both in high school and college, and they were, on average, better developed from an academic and critical thinking standpoint than the class average.

I know too little about charter schools to really even opine on their benefit. What is it that is so problematic about them?

I Wear Pants;1523949 wrote:Charter schools almost all blow

Pretty broad sweeping brush...

Especially since there's no "one" way that charters operate.

O-Trap;1524063 wrote:I know too little about charter schools to really even opine on their benefit. What is it that is so problematic about them?

There's not much problematic about them...unless they are the charter schools filled with ALL the troubled kids. Those ones are a bear to work in -- my wife was in one for a year and the teacher turnover was awful (she left after one year because of relocation of my career). It would have been hard for her to stay another year though.

Some charters are quality and teachers love them. Some charters have NO overhead costs in administration/leadership -- the teachers do all of the admin work/decisions. Some specialize in "arts," "sciences," or even physical education (a good friend of mine works with a running group in Indianapolis that utilizes running to help the school and kids).

Some say charter schools are a money pit for troubled kids who never will amount to anything. All the money is spent to make them better, when in reality, there's no hope and it's just keeping the troubled kids out of the regular schools where others are trying to actually teach/learn.

OSH;1524075 wrote:Pretty broad sweeping brush...

Especially since there's no "one" way that charters operate.



There's not much problematic about them...unless they are the charter schools filled with ALL the troubled kids. Those ones are a bear to work in -- my wife was in one for a year and the teacher turnover was awful (she left after one year because of relocation of my career). It would have been hard for her to stay another year though.

Some charters are quality and teachers love them. Some charters have NO overhead costs in administration/leadership -- the teachers do all of the admin work/decisions. Some specialize in "arts," "sciences," or even physical education (a good friend of mine works with a running group in Indianapolis that utilizes running to help the school and kids).

Some say charter schools are a money pit for troubled kids who never will amount to anything. All the money is spent to make them better, when in reality, there's no hope and it's just keeping the troubled kids out of the regular schools where others are trying to actually teach/learn.

"Troubled" seems like a nebulous term.

Would a "learning center" that uses K12 curriculum constitute a charter school?

O-Trap;1524078 wrote:"Troubled" seems like a nebulous term.

Would a "learning center" that uses K12 curriculum constitute a charter school?

I couldn't figure out a better word than "troubled." My wife's class was full of a whole handful of kids with different backgrounds.

I guess her school would have been filled with the kids that the regular public schools didn't want -- or took too much time to educate compared to the rest of the students. Her students weren't all "dumb." They just had baggage. Some were raised by their grandparents for a variety of reasons. One came from a homeless family that also had like 14 other kids -- they stayed in a shelter. That sort of stuff.

Other charter schools aren't necessarily set up the same.

I honestly cannot say what constitutes a charter school. There's all kinds of different looks and feels of what some may call theirs a "charter" school. Some are really good at educating. Some are public and some are private. I'm learning a lot about them as I go through the educational scene.

My alma mater recently played and lost to a #1 ranked school in there division 98 - 21. No bullying claim filed. The sad thing is that the game should never have been scheduled. The AD of the losing school threw that power house on the schedule as just a filler game to complete the schedule real quick before he retires after this season.