mucalum49;1462313 wrote:Tristan and Dion weren't discussed till the night before the last two drafts. The more talk goes towards Len the more I think they lean another way. Agree with you I think it's Noel. I'd also love to see the Cavs trade the two 2nd rounders & Gee for one year of Paul Pierce. Then still do the #19 for #13 and Marion deal. Hopefully we could get Steven Adams there too but if not trade #13 and either Kings or Griz future first to move up in a position to get him. That last trade is getting a little carried away though.

But either way you have the 2013-14 Cavs:

PG: Irving/Livingston
SG: Waiters/Ellington
SF: Pierce/Marion
PF: TT/Noel
C: AV/Zeller/Adams

Healthy that's a playoff team. Maybe not an East contender but enough to get the young guys experience and a veteran to teach them the ropes. And hopefully ohiobucks is right...

I'd much rather have McLemore/waiters at the 2 then Noel coming off the bench behind TT

Or pierce/porter

Pick6;1462326 wrote:I've read some rumblings about the Cavs looking to sign Collison or CJ Watson in FA to back up Kyrie. I'd cream if we got Collison. Really like his game, especially as a back up.

I loved him in Indy as well. He is a really solid back-up. Too bad the Pacers ended up having to start him so often, cause he isnt really that great in prolonged minutes (when it is for a long spell due to an injury or something).

Man this draft is really unique. Earlier today I was pretty set on not wanting NN. Then I read this piece by Chad Ford and I change my tune http://espn.go.com/blog/truehoop/post/_/id/60225/cavaliers-weighing-the-no-1-decision

Really just don't have a clue. I feel like any pick I'll be able to rationalize.

Fly4Fun;1462169 wrote:I don't think it's necessarily that simple.

Some would describe their wanting to keep LeBron off the team after the betrayal as a sign of integrity (Such as BR) while others would look at it as stubborn pride (such as yourself).

It's not a simple situation and how one views it is a reflection of what their values are specifically regarding sports teams (whether it is more important to win in a certain manner or whether winning at all costs is okay).

I'm guessing the same people that wouldn't mind having LeBron back also think that as long as the rules allow for it, flopping is okay. (But this is really just a theory with nothing to actually back it up).

This is a pretty ignorant assumption and I have no idea how it even correlates to anything regarding taking LBJ back. And for your own information, I hate flopping and the rules that allow it, so chuck that theory aside.

hoops23;1462350 wrote:This is a pretty ignorant assumption and I have no idea how it even correlates to anything regarding taking LBJ back. And for your own information, I hate flopping and the rules that allow it, so chuck that theory aside.

Like I said, it was just a theory. I was basing it on the idea that people who wouldn't want LeBron back wouldn't have a win at all costs mentality, but those who do might have that mentality. And flopping is a win at all costs strategy.

Thanks for the input!

I don't WANT lebron back, but the cave will need him back to win. So I will gladly accept him. Regardless I'd trade out of #1 for a player like Kevin love and a 1st next year. Noel is a stretch at 1 lem is a crap shoot, and macklemore is a big guy who may have peaked.

j_crazy;1462380 wrote:I don't WANT lebron back, but the cave will need him back to win. So I will gladly accept him. Regardless I'd trade out of #1 for a player like Kevin love and a 1st next year. Noel is a stretch at 1 lem is a crap shoot, and macklemore is a big guy who may have peaked.

Either you are drunk, or we cant take you seriously again for the "Macklemore" comment lol

Laley23;1462382 wrote:Either you are drunk, or we cant take you seriously again for the "Macklemore" comment lol

+ Cave, Lem, and trading the #1 for Love AND #1 next year in a loaded draft class. Must be drunk with the T-Wolves upper management.

Fly4Fun;1462377 wrote:Like I said, it was just a theory. I was basing it on the idea that people who wouldn't want LeBron back wouldn't have a win at all costs mentality, but those who do might have that mentality. And flopping is a win at all costs strategy.

Thanks for the input!

Here's some input Mr. Smartypants. THEY CAN'T BE COMPARED. (bolded for simplicity)

Lebron coming back = off the court "Win at all costs" strategy

Flopping = on the court "Win at all costs" strategy


Awesome logic fail bro, comparing two different types of things and then equating them.

Commander of Awesome;1462346 wrote:Man this draft is really unique. Earlier today I was pretty set on not wanting NN. Then I read this piece by Chad Ford and I change my tune http://espn.go.com/blog/truehoop/post/_/id/60225/cavaliers-weighing-the-no-1-decision

Really just don't have a clue. I feel like any pick I'll be able to rationalize.

I am in the same boat though I've been warming up to NN for a little while now. Defense is something the whole team needs so I'd be happy for him contributing there and scoring on fast breaks/dunks for a little while. It's been working for Blake Griffin albeit he is much stronger than NN would be.

I think Len could be good too but he took more shots then NN and is supposed to be more polished on offense but couldn't score more than 1.5 PPG over NN who's spoken about as if he trips and falls every time he touches the ball on offense. Porter is a safe pick but doesn't really fix our interior D. He was my guy when I thought we'd be drafting at #3 or #4.

Only two guys I'd be upset about is Oladipo and McLemore. Not having anything to do with their talents but I really think Dion is going to be something special. I don't want any playing time taken away that could potentially stunt his development.

mucalum49;1462417 wrote:I am in the same boat though I've been warming up to NN for a little while now. Defense is something the whole team needs so I'd be happy for him contributing there and scoring on fast breaks/dunks for a little while. It's been working for Blake Griffin albeit he is much stronger than NN would be.

I think Len could be good too but he took more shots then NN and is supposed to be more polished on offense but couldn't score more than 1.5 PPG over NN who's spoken about as if he trips and falls every time he touches the ball on offense. Porter is a safe pick but doesn't really fix our interior D. He was my guy when I thought we'd be drafting at #3 or #4.

Only two guys I'd be upset about is Oladipo and McLemore. Not having anything to do with their talents but I really think Dion is going to be something special. I don't want any playing time taken away that could potentially stunt his development.

And Griffin really isn't a great defender. He is just a fast break machine. With a point like CP3 it can be really successful. I'd love to see lob city with Kyrie, Dion, TT, and NN. Talk about athletic. Add in a solid SF, Andy off the bench, TZ if he develops and I DEF see a perennial playoff team for years to come. Throw LBJ or any other free agent all star onto that team, and watch out. (IMO)

lhslep134;1462394 wrote:Here's some input Mr. Smartypants. THEY CAN'T BE COMPARED. (bolded for simplicity)

Lebron coming back = off the court "Win at all costs" strategy

Flopping = on the court "Win at all costs" strategy


Awesome logic fail bro, comparing two different types of things and then equating them.

They can be compared as they are similar, you admit as such by saying they are both win at all costs strategy. If two things were identical there would be no point in comparing them... that's kind of the point of a comparison. You're making a huge deal out a theory that I even admitted I had nothing to base it on. Talk about making a mountain out of a molehill.

Portland turns down Cavs offer of #1 & #19 for Aldridge.....

http://www.waitingfornextyear.com/2013/06/nba-news-draft-rumors-trailblazers-reject-cavaliers-offer-for-lamarcus-aldridge/

Fly4Fun;1462429 wrote:They can be compared as they are similar, you admit as such by saying they are both win at all costs strategy. If two things were identical there would be no point in comparing them... that's kind of the point of a comparison. You're making a huge deal out a theory that I even admitted I had nothing to base it on. Talk about making a mountain out of a molehill.

Thank you for contributing soooo much to our Cleveland threads. Such a great mod and poster you are.

sportswizuhrd;1462387 wrote:+ Cave, Lem, and trading the #1 for Love AND #1 next year in a loaded draft class. Must be drunk with the T-Wolves upper management.

Those fit into the "drunk" comment.

The not taking him serious again is thinking McLemore, a RS Freshman...TWO GUARD is a big guy who has peaked lol...

Fly4Fun;1462429 wrote:They can be compared as they are similar, you admit as such by saying they are both win at all costs strategy.

You just don't get it

Once I diminish Len's stats in favor of Noel because he only averaged 1.5PPG over Noel who's raw offensively I read tweets like this.

Probasketballdraft@Probballdraft
Len had double digit shots in 12 games. Averaged 16 ppg, 9.7 rpg, 2.0 bpg, and shot 53% from the field. Imagine that type of player w Kyrie.

So basically games he is involved offensively he produced, when he was forgotten about he wasn't the same player. Kind of chalk that up to Len believers who say he had bad guard play that hindered him. Also could be a red flag that if he isn't involved in the game he doesn't exert the same effort. Ah, such a confusing draft!

Edit: And back on the Noel train. Passing all this along from RCF so another poster showed Noel's stats when given double digit shots.

in games where Noel had double digit shots he averaged 14.2 ppg, 10.6 rpb, 2.4 bpg, 2.6 spg on 55% shooting.

So at least Noel is consistent on defense across all games and his numbers in rebounds, blocks and steals doesn't jump up only when he's involved such as Len's numbers did.

http://www.fearthesword.com/2013/6/24/4460002/nba-draft-rumors-cleveland-cavaliers-linked-to-luol-deng-paul-pierce

-Anthony Bennett has ballooned up to 261 pounds as he recovers from shoulder surgery. This isn't a massive deal as he can't work out right now, but having said that it's somewhat scary that a guy who could plausibly have weight problems in the future looks to have put on nearly 20 pounds in two months.The Cavs should probably just steer clear of him given that he's not a great fit positionally on this team.
-Luol Deng has been linked to the Cavaliers, via Marc Stein of ESPN. However, it looks like there is a lot more steam to a Deng-to-the-Wizards deal, involving the 3rd overall pick along with Emeka Okafor's expiring contract. If Ernie Grunfeld does that deal, he should be fired on the spot. I've gone on record saying I'd deal the 19th pick for Deng. Not much more than that though.
-Jason Lloyd went on Cleveland area radio today and said that he believes the Cavaliers are down to either Alex Len or Ben McLemore as their candidates for the number one pick. How much I believe that, I'm not sure. This could easily be an organizational smoke screen, or it could be Lloyd trying to get out in front of something. Either way, I think Lloyd has been a step behind in the draft process so far despite being Cleveland's most reliable reporter. Honestly, the only person who has idea what's going to happen at number one is Chris Grant right now. It's possible news leaks a couple of days early about who the team will select as it has the last couple of years. But right now I don't think that has happened yet.
-The Celtics and Cavaliers have apparently had preliminary discussions involving Paul Pierce, according to Jay King of masslive.com and Celtics Town. It'll be interesting to follow to see if these go anywhere. Seeing Pierce in a Cavaliers' jersey is almost unimaginable, so I stil haven't exactly wrapped my head around the possibility of him actually lining up at small forward in Cleveland next season.
-Apparently one of the Cavaliers' top targets in free agency this offseason is going to be Earl Clark, according to The Sporting News. Why? I have no idea. No, really. I have no idea what could possess Grant and company to pursue the services of Clark.
-The Cavaliers have long been known to have a desire to move back into the first round using their two early second round picks, and they may have found a partner in Denver. The Nuggets, who have the 27th overall pick on Wednesday, are looking to move out of the first round and into the second. This isn't a huge surprise to me, given that most of the prospects the Nuggets have brought in to work out have been second round guys. They may have found one that they like, but not enough to give a guaranteed contract to. Whether or not it's worth it for the Cavs to move up four spots depends on who they have their eye on.
-Finally, I recorded a podcast this weekend about the draft with the Colorado Sports Guys. You all should probably give it a listen, as it turned out really well and it is highly informative. Nate Timmons over at Denver Stiffs and Ross Martin run the show, and then Dave Starcer of At The Hive and I discuss possibly scenarios for the entire draft. There is a lot of Cavalier talk in there as well, so I think it could actually be useful to the Fear The Sword audience. Enjoy!

http://www.waitingfornextyear.com/2013/06/nba-trade-rumors-news-draft-houston-cleveland-thomas-robinson/

I'd love to get both Aldridge and Pierce.

Trade the number 1 and 2014 top 10 protected first round pick to Portland for Aldridge then the 2 2nd round picks for pierce. And trade the 19 for Marion and the 13th pick.

Pg- Kyrie
Sg- waiters
Sf- pierce
Pf-Aldridge
C- Andy

Bench
Gee
Ellington
Thompson
Marion
#13 pick
Livingston
Zeller

I think this team would be a top 4-5 team in the east

Crimson streak;1462583 wrote:I'd love to get both Aldridge and Pierce.

Trade the number 1 and 2014 top 10 protected first round pick to Portland for Aldridge then the 2 2nd round picks for pierce. And trade the 19 for Marion and the 13th pick.

Pg- Kyrie
Sg- waiters
Sf- pierce
Pf-Aldridge
C- Andy

Bench
Gee
Ellington
Thompson
Marion
#13 pick
Livingston
Zeller

I think this team would be a top 4-5 team in the east

That's a top 4 team in the east easily.

Commander of Awesome;1462586 wrote:That's a top 4 team in the east easily.

If we could get Caldwell pope at 13. It would be amazing

Is Mo Speights still with us?

GOONx19;1462597 wrote:Is Mo Speights still with us?

Yes

Crimson streak;1462583 wrote:Trade the number 1 and 2014 top 10 protected first round pick to Portland for Aldridge

I think it would take more than that.