saying that handing out the death penalty "wouldn't do any good" is like saying a murderer shouldn't be punished because it "wouldn't do any good"--it's not going to bring back the life of the murdered e.g. Football is king at PSU (as well as many other college institutions), and keeping the image of PSU football pristine probably went a long way in the actions of the Big 4. i.e. it would look very bad if the public found out that Sandusky was a pedophile, so they didn't do what should have been done, or what they might have done if they didn't have to worry about the football program. So football was the complete driving force behind every decision made or not made. It has EVERYTHING to do with sports/football--and therefore the death penalty would be completely appropriate. Innocent people (present student athletes e.g) indeed get the shaft , but unfortunately for them, that's the price that is paid when the higher ups screw up to the degree that they did. Just like innocent people (their kids e.g.) might get shafted when their dad (the bread winner) gets thrown in prison for the sins he comitted. They had nothing to so with it, but that's the justice system we live in , whether it's the NCAA doling out the punishment, or the state or federal govt.

Hearing the NCAA president talk today on ESPN, it sounded like he really wants to hammer Penn State IF he can figure out a way to legally do it. As has been said over and over most of this is a criminal case with LOIC being about the NCAA only way to get to Penn State. Do they deserve the death penalty? Of course they do. Will they get the death penalty? There are a lot of dollars out there to be made by them playing that say no they won't.

reclegend22;1227530 wrote:I get that, but my contention is that a death sentence for the football program today wouldn't really benefit the victims in any significant way. What will benefit those who suffered is getting to the bottom of the truth and seeing that those individuals directly responsible for what happened receive their due punishment. That is what I imagine the victims most desire. Jerry Sandusky got his. Others may get theirs pending what the courts find.

But the NCAA punishment isn't a replacement for criminal justice. That would still happen. So the victims would still get what they are seeking. The NCAA punishment is NOT about the victims benefit, but punishment for the actions by the university as it relates to athletics.

0311sdp;1227609 wrote:Hearing the NCAA president talk today on ESPN, it sounded like he really wants to hammer Penn State IF he can figure out a way to legally do it. As has been said over and over most of this is a criminal case with LOIC being about the NCAA only way to get to Penn State. Do they deserve the death penalty? Of course they do. Will they get the death penalty? There are a lot of dollars out there to be made by them playing that say no they won't.

Legally, there is nothing stopping the NCAA from doing whatever it wants.

ccrunner609;1227549 wrote:and on the other end of my argument is that the victoms shouldnt and wont benefit from the NCAA sanctions and the NCAA decision should not be weighed with that in mind. THats was civil laws are for.

Holy shit, I just repped CC.

WebFire;1227640 wrote:But the NCAA punishment isn't a replacement for criminal justice. That would still happen. So the victims would still get what they are seeking. The NCAA punishment is NOT about the victims benefit, but punishment for the actions by the university as it relates to athletics.

I understand. I think I misinterpreted CC's post. I tried to make my feelings more clear in my last post above.

reclegend22;1227643 wrote:I understand. I think I misinterpreted CC's post. I tried to make my feelings more clear in my last post above.

Yeah, hadn't read that yet. I think it's a given that any NCAA punishments would be handed out after a thorough investigation is done, with facts presented. No different than any other case really.

OSU got hammered because Tressel failed to pass along needed info and get it through the compliance dept. PSU is going to get hammered because the administrators and HC chose to cover up a true, real crime because of the backlash that might be felt with regard to the school and football team's reputation.

The question is, if they covered this up, what else may they have covered up that we'll never know about. That's why I think they need to be hammered. That "we're better than everyone else, bla bla bla" mantra is dead and I think there's a lot of stuff PSU probably never let see the light of day and handled 'in house' to keep up that sterling reputation.

WebFire;1227646 wrote:Yeah, hadn't read that yet. I think it's a given that any NCAA punishments would be handed out after a thorough investigation is done, with facts presented. No different than any other case really.

I completely agree. That's a rational way of looking at it. Some here, however, are ready to start wildly throwing out extreme punishments based on no hard facts. So that's my problem.

gosh a ruddies who commissioned the Freeh report, PSU? The evidence needed for action has already been supplied by their own highly qualified investigator.

isadore;1227662 wrote:gosh a ruddies who commissioned the Freeh report, PSU? The evidence needed for action has already been supplied by their own highly qualified investigator.

No. It hasn't. The Freeh Report is full of missing information and guesswork. And don't even bother replying further because you obviously have a 21st chromosome and I don't have heated arguments with people who have those.

FatHobbit;1227587 wrote:I never understand why anyone ever bothers to respond to Isadore. It's the same song and dance with him ever time. Just ignore him and he will go away. Lol

This is the way that sleeper (aka isadore) can post out of the basement, and as long as he has an audience, he'll continue to instigate...it's pretty sad.

reclegend22;1227668 wrote:No. It hasn't. The Freeh Report is full of missing information and guesswork. And don't even bother replying further because you obviously have a 21st chromosome and I don't have heated arguments with people who have those.

LOL. pathetic. Some people will act as apologists for anything. PSU hired a superqualified person to investigate this atrocity. They gave him access to their files. If there are limits on what he saw, then it is because of the university. one of the most ridiculous criticism is he did not question the accused administrators and paterno. Well one is dead and the others have 5th amendment rights. Louis found the evidence that proved the guilt of the institution and its employees. Atrocity deniers refuse to accept the truth.

reclegend22;1227650 wrote:I completely agree. That's a rational way of looking at it. Some here, however, are ready to start wildly throwing out extreme punishments based on no hard facts. So that's my problem.

I think you have to separate the general public's reaction to a shocking report, from what the public's opinion would be when a full, factual report comes out later. I think most people who are calling for punishment are doing so based on the report presenting potential facts, if there is such a thing.

It's no different than any other public opinion on a crime, i.e., OJ Simpson, Casey Anthony and Zimmerman, in the initial stages of the investigation. I wouldn't get too hung up on it.

Ultimately these were crimes committed by individuals against individuals. The University is bigger than the individual. Punish all responsible as much as possible. The institution itself shouldn't be punished. This is NOT an NCAA issue. Clean house of all those at fault. Hire new and start over.

these were individuals given power by that institution who used that power to in one case abuse children and in the others to protect the abuser. those conspiring to protect the predator were using their institutional powers to protect the football program and the university from justifiable criticism, lose of reputation and revenue. the institution gained revenue and preserved its reputation over more than a decade because of the coverup while boys were being raped. the institution is responsible for the action of its agents.

NCAA boss won't rule out death penalty for Penn St
NEW YORK (AP) -- The president of the NCAA says he isn't ruling out the possibility of shutting down the Penn State football program in the wake of the Jerry Sandusky child sex abuse scandal.
In a PBS interview Monday night, NCAA President Mark Emmert said he doesn't want to ''take anything off the table'' if the NCAA determines penalties against Penn State are warranted.
Emmert said he's ''never seen anything as egregious as this in terms of just overall conduct and behavior inside a university.'' He added, ''What the appropriate penalties are, if there are determinations of violations, we'll have to decide.''
The last time the NCAA shut down a football program with the so-called ''death penalty'' was in the 1980s, when SMU was forced to drop the sport because of extra benefits violations. After the NCAA suspended the SMU program for a year, the school decided not to play in 1988, either, as it tried to regroup.
''This is completely different than an impermissible benefits scandal like (what) happened at SMU, or anything else we've dealt with. This is as systemic a cultural problem as it is a football problem. There have been people that said this wasn't a football scandal,'' Emmert said.
''Well, it was more than a football scandal, much more than a football scandal. It was that but much more. And we'll have to figure out exactly what the right penalties are. I don't know that past precedent makes particularly good sense in this case, because it's really an unprecedented problem.''
http://sports.yahoo.com/news/ncaa-boss-wont-rule-death-133107995--ncaaf.html
Shut them down.

and gosh a ruddies a suggestion for the players

"A student-athlete advocacy group has asked the NCAA to lift all transfer restrictions for Penn State football players, allowing them to switch schools without penalty. The request comes in the wake of the school-funded Freeh Commission concluding that administrators and coaches helped conceal the Jerry Sandusky sexual molestation scandal. The request would allow any Penn State player to become immediately eligible to play at any other program and still receive a full scholarship. It would also allow other schools to communicate with players about potential transfers. NCAA rules stipulate a player on scholarship who transfers must sit out one year before becoming eligible."
http://sports.yahoo.com/news/ncaaf--advocacy-group-penn-state-players-transfer-without-restrictions.html

Here is a link to a good article about Vicky Triponey, she is the former head of student affairs. The article gives some good insight on how PSU operated.


If the link does not work just google the story about The Penn State way.

She stood up the Joe Pa and she does not work there anymore.

(tried to post the link from an IPad, doesn't want to cooperate.)

reclegend22;1227541 wrote:

How many mushrooms, ballpark, would you say you've eaten tonight?

NEVER blame good things in life like mushrooms on how this guy acts. Rubbing alcohol mixed with drain cleaner is more like it.

georgemc80;1227693 wrote:Ultimately these were crimes committed by individuals against individuals. The University is bigger than the individual. Punish all responsible as much as possible. The institution itself shouldn't be punished. This is NOT an NCAA issue. Clean house of all those at fault. Hire new and start over.

The crimes themselves were. But if there was a cover up, it gets much more broad.

But ultimately, the individuals covered it up. The school didn't commit a crime. The people in power did. Punish those individuals...replace those individuals.


The only reason to use the death penalty is to send a message for member institutions to avoid such actions in the future. I really hope we don't have to send a message that covering up pedophilia is a no no.

WebFire;1227747 wrote:The crimes themselves were. But if there was a cover up, it gets much more broad.

See OSU: Tressel, James Patrick

Yes, I think they should. I think they need to consider punishment's for the entire university. Janitors all the way up to the President of the University were covering up a horrific case of pedophilia that reached back into the 70's according to new reports. Remember back when Star Linebacker Dan Connor was suspended for prank calling Jerry Sandusky??? It was because the whole team knew he was a pedo! Everybody knew he was a pedo and nobody did anything. Just shut the damn place down. The District Attorney was MURDERED! This is beyond the football program. The whole university was a damn criminal enterprise.

I don't think the DA (who is still missing I believe so murdered possibly but not fact) is in relation to Sandusky's case. He was also handeling some major drug cases from my understanding.

Connor and teammates were not pranking Sandusky:
http://deadspin.com/5858679/penn-state-lb-suspended-in-2005-for-prank-calling-a-retired-assistant-coach-says-it-wasnt-jerry-sandusky