isadore;1223208 wrote:It is interesting you write about the unemployment rate before 2008, gosh a ruddies, you know there was this recession think caused by the Republicans that put us in a big hole that we are trying ourselves out of, just like in 1929.

Actually these folks put us in our current predicament but OK....

gosh they have to write it in the name of the bill for it for it to be a valid criticism. wow
so they would have written in the voter id legislation "voter identification law to keep blacks, hispanics, poor, students and elderly from exercising their franchise"
i guess they are a little too sneaky for that, even though that is the effect. From the Brennan Center for Justice
"Studies show that as many as 11 percent of eligible voters do not have government-issued photo ID. That percentage is even higher for seniors, people of color, people with disabilities, low-income voters, and students. Many citizens find it hard to get government photo IDs, because the underlying documentation like birth certificates (the ID one needs to get ID) is often difficult or expensive to come by. At the same time, voter ID policies are far more costly to implement than many assume"

we get the real purpose of voter id from Pa House Majority lead Steve Turzai."Voter ID, which is going to allow Gov. Romney to win the state of Pennsylvania, done."

http://www.philly.com/philly/columnists/karen_heller/162018875.html

believer;1223308 wrote:Actually these folks put us in our current predicament but OK....

gosh it would be nice to know what your source is, cannot tell the author or even the magazine or newspaper it is taken from. My own list includes the men who put us on the path, mr reagan and the man who presided over the fall, mr bush, the younger and their accomplices.

HitsRus;1223186 wrote:Delusional. Prior to 2008 the unemployment rate was what?...and for how many years? Yet 'programs' continued to flourish. Now tell me who's been in office the past 3 1/2 years? If you want to insist that business doesn't want a full employment economy, let me assert that democrats don't want a full employment economy because it increases their political power keeping people dependent on them.

You, like other people who fancy themselves forward thinking elitists, can't fathom the thought that a free thinking black man has the balls to tell you that he doesn't want your help, doesn't need your help, that your help is a form of slavery not empowerment, and he resents it. How dare he not spout the company line...it goes against everything that you've been taught how a black should think. I can understand how that upsets you...it must be nonsense!

Hubert Humphrey? geez...that was 45 years ago and a lot has changed. I voted for HHH. I was 18.

Telling the unemployed masses regardless of their skin tone "Get a job herm derp" in an economy that will not employ everyone is not empowerment. An economy wherein the government is an employer of last resort and only provides "benefits" in exchange for an honest days work is not slavery. The latter is what real liberals want. That is not "help" in the way you're framing it. You're clearly still caught in the false mindset that if everyone just works maximally hard everyone will be able to earn a living for themselves but even if every single person in our country were maximally motivated and didn't want a handout of any kind our economy does not provide a job for those willing to work.

Just think about yourself; you're a business owner and have indicated that you hire lower income folks without many skills in the past. It would be bad for your bottom line if the government provided your surplus army of unemployed jobs and there weren't countless applicants any time you had an opening.

And it's ironic that you supported Hubert Humphrey because he was way more liberal than any of the major players in the "loser party," as you call it, today.

believer;1223308 wrote:Actually these folks put us in our current predicament but OK....

It's a shame that none of that is true and this information is widely available. This is a clear indication of how little progress is made through rational debate because despite these claims being soundly refuted the false beliefs continue. The community reinvestment act for example played no major role according to nearly everyone who investigated the financial crisis and I've posted this numerous times. For example, the housing crisis was mostly and ex-urban event, commercial real estate also experienced a crisis, etc.

Facts do not matter to you.

BoatShoes;1223391 wrote:It's a shame that none of that is true and this information is widely available. This is a clear indication of how little progress is made through rational debate because despite these claims being soundly refuted the false beliefs continue. The community reinvestment act for example played no major role according to nearly everyone who investigated the financial crisis and I've posted this numerous times. For example, the housing crisis was mostly and ex-urban event, commercial real estate also experienced a crisis, etc.

Facts do not matter to you.

The idea that none of it is true is as incorrect as claiming that all of it is true, or is the whole truth.

You're often wrong but to my knowledge and memory have not been dishonest. Don't start here.

It is nice to read your description of what African American think

I don't presuppose to know what "African Americans" think, but apparently you and other white liberals do, and feel the need to think they think as a group rather than unique indidviduals....and you think those that think as individuals need to be discredited vehemnetly and in no uncertain terms. You can't have West, a congressman, expousing those ideas. As was stated earlier in the thread... liberals think he needs "to keep his mouth shut."

BoatShoes;1223391 wrote:It's a shame that none of that is true and this information is widely available.

Actually, much of it is true. Perhaps you have tunnel vision and will accept only the liberal mantra, discounting the opinions of even some who were on the financial crisis commission.

There are many positions/viewpoints, widely available, that discount your (liberal-swayed) contention:


40% of the commission members themselves dissented from the Financial Commission's report!! Perhaps you wish to refresh yourself with their thoughts beginning on page 470 and continuing for over 100 pages.
http://www.gpo.gov/fdsys/pkg/GPO-FCIC/pdf/GPO-FCIC.pdf

And then move on to:

http://www.accountingtoday.com/debits_credits/Financial-Crisis-Commission-Splits-Report-56689-1.html



http://www.forbes.com/2009/10/03/community-reinvestment-act-mortgages-housing-opinions-contributors-peter-schweizer.html/

http://www.boston.com/bostonglobe/editorial_opinion/oped/articles/2008/09/28/franks_fingerprints_are_all_over_the_financial_fiasco/

http://www.americanthinker.com/2008/09/the_financial_mess_how_we_got.html



Gosh, I continue to be amazed at the attempts of the Left to legitimize government, which is destroying us.

queencitybuckeye;1223399 wrote:The idea that none of it is true is as incorrect as claiming that all of it is true,....

My point exactly.

I've posted many times that the mortgage meltdown has plenty of blame to go around including - contrary to Boatshoe's assertion that they were not responsible - the stellar Dems indicated in the image I posted.

I'm simply telling Isadore that it is as absurd to blame the meltdown on Republicans alone as it is to claim that these Dems were solely responsible. Anyone who can't agree to that is politically blind and naive.

believer;1223496 wrote:My point exactly.

I've posted many times that the mortgage meltdown has plenty of blame to go around including - contrary to Boatshoe's assertion that they were not responsible - the stellar Dems indicated in the image I posted.

I'm simply telling Isadore that it is as absurd to blame the meltdown on Republicans alone as it is to claim that these Dems were solely responsible. Anyone who can't agree to that is politically blind and naive.

I agree with this. Plenty of blame to go around. Including people who bought mortgages that had no business doing so. Always annoys me when people play dumb about not knowing what would happen with arm, balloon , interest only etc. Payments.

HitsRus;1223443 wrote:I don't presuppose to know what "African Americans" think, but apparently you and other white liberals do, and feel the need to think they think as a group rather than unique indidviduals....and you think those that think as individuals need to be discredited vehemnetly and in no uncertain terms. You can't have West, a congressman, expousing those ideas. As was stated earlier in the thread... liberals think he needs "to keep his mouth shut."

Gosh who wants to stop him from talking. He just shows where the tea party types are.
This is the Joe McCarthy clone who claimed there were 78-81 Democratic Congress people who are members of the Communist party
http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0412/75025.html
How did you do this?

HITrUS wrote: Hubert Humphrey? geez...that was 45 years ago and a lot has changed. I voted for HHH. I was 18.

isadore;1223323 wrote:gosh they have to write it in the name of the bill for it for it to be a valid criticism. wow
so they would have written in the voter id legislation "voter identification law to keep blacks, hispanics, poor, students and elderly from exercising their franchise"
i guess they are a little too sneaky for that, even though that is the effect. From the Brennan Center for Justice
"Studies show that as many as 11 percent of eligible voters do not have government-issued photo ID. That percentage is even higher for seniors, people of color, people with disabilities, low-income voters, and students. Many citizens find it hard to get government photo IDs, because the underlying documentation like birth certificates (the ID one needs to get ID) is often difficult or expensive to come by. At the same time, voter ID policies are far more costly to implement than many assume"

we get the real purpose of voter id from Pa House Majority lead Steve Turzai."Voter ID, which is going to allow Gov. Romney to win the state of Pennsylvania, done."

http://www.philly.com/philly/columnists/karen_heller/162018875.html

Do you really believe the shit you post on here? I sure hope not. The voter ID issue is a joke. I don't think I can even justify wasting my time writing more to you about it.

bigdaddy2003;1223706 wrote:Do you really believe the **** you post on here? I sure hope not. The voter ID issue is a joke. I don't think I can even justify wasting my time writing more to you about it.

Yes I believe it. Mr. Turzai let the cat out of the bag. We had grandfather clauses, literacy tests and poll taxes used in the past to deprive blacks of their franchise. Now we have voter id.

isadore;1223714 wrote:Yes I believe it. Mr. Turzai let the cat out of the bag. We had grandfather clauses, literacy tests and poll taxes used in the past to deprive blacks of their franchise. Now we have voter id.

That is a sad statement isadore. I don't think we agree on anything politically so it shouldn't shock me but it does. I don't know a single person who doesn't have an ID or who couldn't go and buy one. You have to be pretty bad off or have to be spending your extra money on things you don't really need if you don't have one.

The cost of obtaining a state ID varies from FREE to $30 for a multi year ID. Most states have nominal handling charges $6-10. Many are free or deeply discounted for elderly and low income. The paperwork is no more difficult that filling out an election ballot.

Funny how the party that worries about corporate 'corruption', has no qualms with good old Chicago style voter fraud. Anybody who thinks differently probably has an ACORN in their noggin.

Mr. Turzai let the cat out of the bag.

Actually, I believe it was Mr West who has let the cat out of the bag, on how handouts, and fostering and encouraging dependency, wins elections.

bigdaddy2003;1223742 wrote:That is a sad statement isadore. I don't think we agree on anything politically so it shouldn't shock me but it does. I don't know a single person who doesn't have an ID or who couldn't go and buy one. You have to be pretty bad off or have to be spending your extra money on things you don't really need if you don't have one.

to reinterate.
"From the Brennan Center for Justice
"Studies show that as many as 11 percent of eligible voters do not have government-issued photo ID. That percentage is even higher for seniors, people of color, people with disabilities, low-income voters, and students. Many citizens find it hard to get government photo IDs, because the underlying documentation like birth certificates (the ID one needs to get ID) is often difficult or expensive to come by. At the same time, voter ID policies are far more costly to implement than many assume"
i guess these are not the kind of people you know big daddy. And alot of people are pretty bad off or lacking mobility and transportation.

HitsRus;1223749 wrote:The cost of obtaining a state ID varies from FREE to $30 for a multi year ID. Most states have nominal handling charges $6-10. Many are free or deeply discounted for elderly and low income. The paperwork is no more difficult that filling out an election ballot.

Funny how the party that worries about corporate 'corruption', has no qualms with good old Chicago style voter fraud. Anybody who thinks differently probably has an ACORN in their noggin.



Actually, I believe it was Mr West who has let the cat out of the bag, on how handouts, and fostering and encouraging dependency, wins elections.

Gosh we have a non problem used as an excuse to deprive the needy of the right to vote. The number of cases of voter fraud infinitesimal, those deprived the vote in the millions. It is based not on your opinion but on the research of the Brennan Center for Justice.
As to West’s statements, the term infinitesimal comes up again, the 2% of black voters supporting his view and opposing the President
Is this true?

HITsRUS wrote: Hubert Humphrey? geez...that was 45 years ago and a lot has changed. I voted for HHH. I was 18.

isadore;1223755 wrote:Gosh we have a non problem used as an excuse to deprive the needy of the right to vote. The number of cases of voter fraud infinitesimal, those deprived the vote in the millions. It is based not on your opinion but on the research of the Brennan Center for Justice.
As to West’s statements, the term infinitesimal comes up again, the 2% of black voters supporting his view and opposing the President
Is this true?

It's not a non problem and once again isadore having that big of a percentage of black voters isnt a bragging point.

yes....a high school mock election. I was big into RFK...but he was killed. I voted for McGovern in '72 in the real election.... Indoctrinated in a prestigious eastern liberal arts school....what the f*** did I know...then came Jimmy Carter, Dennis Kucinich....ughhhh.

It is based not on your opinion but on the research of the Brennan Center for Justice

A study by a liberal think tank funded by George Soros?

I'd rather take another position...that of former SCOTUS Justice John Paul Stevens (considered a liberal ) who wrote the majority opinion upholding an Indiana voter ID law.

Liberal Supreme Court Justice John Paul Stevens was cognizant of voter fraud. In writing a 6-3 majority opinion upholding an Indiana voter ID law, Mr. Justice Stevens said that "flagrant examples of (voter) fraud . . . have been documented throughout this Nation's history by respected historians and journalists" and "that not only is the risk of voter fraud real but that it could affect the outcome of a close election."

Further, your assertion that voter fraud is infintesimally small, is like assuming that few are speeding on a highway because the number of traffic citation issued was small. That figure only shows those that were CAUGHT...not all those who were actually violating the speed limit.

A study by the Heritage Foundation showed that 70% of Americans supported Voter ID laws and 22% opposed. It seems Americans actually VALUE integrity in our election sytem.

bigdaddy2003;1223771 wrote:It's not a non problem and once again isadore having that big of a percentage of black voters isnt a bragging point.

gosh I would think winning the support of a large percentage of one of the major ethnic groups of our nation would be a great thing. Especially a group so long oppressed who now see hope and support in America.

HitsRus;1223776 wrote:yes....a high school mock election. I was big into RFK...but he was killed. I voted for McGovern in '72 in the real election.... Indoctrinated in a prestigious eastern liberal arts school....what the f*** did I know...then came Jimmy Carter, Dennis Kucinich....ughhhh.

leading you to the party of george w. bush, tom delay, michelle bachman and the gang.

isadore;1223823 wrote:leading you to the party of george w. bush, tom delay, michelle bachman and the gang.

and away from the party of Pelosi, Frank, Schumer, Waters, Gore, Boxer, Rangel, and a host of other Democrat nut jobs.

HitsRus;1223083 wrote:Why does he need to keep his mouth shut? And get your facts straight. He claimed that 80 members of Congress were Communists...not 80%. Basically, the "progressive caucus". As he states, call it(them) what you will, but the ideology is the same, the methods are the same, etc....a rose by any other name is still a rose.

I stand corrected on the number. Thanks for the correction. But if you agree that these 80 Democrats and the communists share one of the same ideology, then I feel sorry for you. Do you need a refresher on what the communist party actually advocates? Having a strong lefty lean is a far cry from Marx's communism. But you've made your mindset clear. Allan West is one of the biggest baffoons out there...bar none. I don't dare stink up LJ's boards with a few youtubes of this guy...a guy who has laid claim that Cheney's lesbian daughter us nothing more than a "selfish hedonist" in "choosing" such a lifestyle. If you want to slam your spear into the ground of this Alan West's feet, more power to you. Most people...including rational thinking conservatives would stay as far away from this media grabbing uncle Tommy as they can.

As for venom...nothing compares to the venom spewed at West who, as a black man, has the guts to oppose and embarrass the white liberal elite....see the original link with Huckabee's interview...and the LA Times reference.
Check out Soledad O'Brien and her 'attempt' at discrediting him.
http://www.theblaze.com/stories/cnns-anchor-has-testy-exchange-with-allen-west-over-communist-remarks-name-names/

When you are A FRIEKING Congressman, you had better be careful in the words you choose. Because when you fly off the deep end as many times as this guy has, then you are gonna have your feet held to the fire. You don't see JC Watts make such a mockery...nor a Tom Sowell. And the best of the bunch is Walter Williams, one of the most classy individuals ever in explaining his position...something your buddy sorely lacks.

....and really...c'mon Wedge...when it comes to 'venom' not to many people on this site rival the stuff you put out.

The stuff I put out is rarely...if ever challenged because A... It is not venomous at all. I choose to use colorful language as it relates to unnecessary wars. Yet, I don't see anyone wanting to challenge me on that subject. Why is that?

And B, if you do in fact find my descriptive narratives as being "offensive", that's OK too. I, just like the fatman on the AM dial, are not politicians...and as such, don't have to answer to the public for voicing political opinions. Alan West is a Congressman for God sake.

As for Alan West...carry on. Very amusing indeed.

HitsRus;1223790 wrote:A study by a liberal think tank funded by George Soros?

I'd rather take another position...that of former SCOTUS Justice John Paul Stevens (considered a liberal ) who wrote the majority opinion upholding an Indiana voter ID law.



Further, your assertion that voter fraud is infintesimally small, is like assuming that few are speeding on a highway because the number of traffic citation issued was small. That figure only shows those that were CAUGHT...not all those who were actually violating the speed limit.

A study by the Heritage Foundation showed that 70% of Americans supported Voter ID laws and 22% opposed. It seems Americans actually VALUE integrity in our election sytem.

Gosh a ruddies how serious a threat is voter fraud
“
And the number is ridiculously low. You have a better chance of being hit by lightning than discovering an incident of polling place fraud.”
http://www.ohiochatter.com/forum/showthread.php?35292-Congressman-Allen-West-True-racism-lies-with-white-liberals..../page2
What is the cost, how many people are going to be disenfranchised
“
Brennan Center for Justice
"Studies show that as many as 11 percent of eligible voters do not have government-issued photo ID. That percentage is even higher for seniors, people of color, people with disabilities, low-income voters, and students. Many citizens find it hard to get government photo IDs, because the underlying documentation like birth certificates (the ID one needs to get ID) is often difficult or expensive to come by. At the same time, voter ID policies are far more costly to implement than many assume"