OQB
Posts: 6,679
May 16, 2011 10:47pm
BRF;770764 wrote:I fell asleep and just woke up. Holy Shit!
Good Morning BRF!
hoops23
Posts: 15,696
May 16, 2011 10:47pm
FWIW: CC has a 3-3 record and a 3.47 ERA this season. Masterson and Tomlin have both been better and Fausto is right there as well. Plus CC is either 30 or about to turn 30.
OQB
Posts: 6,679
May 16, 2011 10:48pm
hoops23;770768 wrote:FWIW: CC has a 3-3 record and a 3.47 ERA this season. Masterson and Tomlin have both been better and Fausto is right there as well. Plus CC is either 30 or about to turn 30.
Very good point....
D
devil1197
Posts: 6,220
May 16, 2011 10:49pm
Germano with a solid inning. He may need that for his confidence.
Laley23
Posts: 29,506
May 16, 2011 10:50pm
royal_k;770761 wrote:I disagree that they have to be perennial MVP candidates for the trade to be a good one. If they both play at a high level (Brantley already is) and play consistent, than the trade will be a good one. And LaPorta is showing signs of what he may become. (a middle of the order RBI machine) They were not going to be able to sign CC.
aka, exactly what I said in my post. All I was saying is that value wise, CC is on another level. I was responding to what Hoops said about not thinking highly of CC. I was pointing out the guy is a Cy Young candidate EVERY year. So for the trade to have the same value on that level, 1 of them has to be MVP candidates. I think the trade was great, because CC was gone anyway. Im just not sure how one can say CC wasnt a big loss. I would much rather have CC than LaPorta and Brantley.
Laley23
Posts: 29,506
May 16, 2011 10:51pm
hoops23;770768 wrote:FWIW: CC has a 3-3 record and a 3.47 ERA this season. Masterson and Tomlin have both been better and Fausto is right there as well. Plus CC is either 30 or about to turn 30.
His ERA has also been sub 3 all season till he just gave up the 6 runs to Boston.
D
devil1197
Posts: 6,220
May 16, 2011 10:54pm
Choo with a double.
Can we get 20?
Can we get 20?
Laley23
Posts: 29,506
May 16, 2011 10:54pm
devil1197;770776 wrote:Choo with a double.
Can we get 20?
Im greedy. Give me a quarter century!
hoops23
Posts: 15,696
May 16, 2011 10:54pm
I just was never high on CC. Good pitcher? Yes. A guy you offer the bank for? No. Weight, consistency, and getting a few great players in return made me ok with the trade.
The Cliff Lee deal is an entirely different scenario though, but that trade is still young.
The Cliff Lee deal is an entirely different scenario though, but that trade is still young.
royal_k
Posts: 4,423
May 16, 2011 10:55pm
If this game's in Cleveland, Choo has 2 HRs tonight.
OQB
Posts: 6,679
May 16, 2011 10:55pm
We need to save some runs for tomorrow night haha
D
devil1197
Posts: 6,220
May 16, 2011 10:57pm
royal_k;770780 wrote:If this game's in Cleveland, Choo has 2 HRs tonight.
If this game is in Cleveland, Choo would have 2, Hafner with 1, and Cabrera with 1.
All hit the warning track deep.
royal_k
Posts: 4,423
May 16, 2011 10:58pm
hoops23;770778 wrote:I just was never high on CC. Good pitcher? Yes. A guy you offer the bank for? No. Weight, consistency, and getting a few great players in return made me ok with the trade.
The Cliff Lee deal is an entirely different scenario though, but that trade is still young.
CC was and is a very good pitcher. But, IMO, he will never be a big game pitcher. He just doesn't pitch well in most of those games.
hoops23
Posts: 15,696
May 16, 2011 10:59pm
royal_k;770783 wrote:CC was and is a very good pitcher. But, IMO, he will never be a big game pitcher. He just doesn't pitch well in most of those games.
Yep, kind of what I'm trying to get at lol. He was a regular season ace but a postseason fake.
Laley23
Posts: 29,506
May 16, 2011 11:03pm
hoops23;770778 wrote:I just was never high on CC. Good pitcher? Yes. A guy you offer the bank for? No. Weight, consistency, and getting a few great players in return made me ok with the trade.
The Cliff Lee deal is an entirely different scenario though, but that trade is still young.
Yeah I get that and respect your opinion. But I just dont see how you arent high on CC. Over the last 10 years, Doc Halladay is the only pitcher who has been better (imo). Age I can get behind, but we still would have had 5 years in his prime (the last 3 and next 2). But weight has never been an issue for him or slowed him down.
His Cy Young votes since trade:
1 - year before trade
5 - (including votes in both leagues...and should have been MVP for the Brewers)
4
3
He is a workhorse, who saves the bullpen, and when given support (2006 and 2008) he gets you wins. He is 45-20 since the trade. That is pretty damn good. Thats a guy I would offer the bank for. But I also value pitching way more than hitters.
Laley23
Posts: 29,506
May 16, 2011 11:04pm
hoops23;770785 wrote:Yep, kind of what I'm trying to get at lol. He was a regular season ace but a postseason fake.
Now that I will say has some merit. But he was good in the 2009 postseason (bad in the 2010 though).
royal_k
Posts: 4,423
May 16, 2011 11:06pm
Laley23;770788 wrote:Now that I will say has some merit. But he was good in the 2009 postseason (bad in the 2010 though).
And worse in 2007
OQB
Posts: 6,679
May 16, 2011 11:07pm
But he also has the highest paid lineup behind him to help him win all those games....do you think he would have that same record if he were in and Indians uniform?Laley23;770787 wrote:He is a workhorse, who saves the bullpen, and when given support (2006 and 2008) he gets you wins. He is 45-20 since the trade. That is pretty damn good. Thats a guy I would offer the bank for. But I also value pitching way more than hitters.
Laley23
Posts: 29,506
May 16, 2011 11:09pm
royal_k;770791 wrote:And worse in 2007
right. I was going post trade. But you could through in his awful start with the Brewers.
D
devil1197
Posts: 6,220
May 16, 2011 11:13pm
Ball game fellas.
19-1.
Get a game up on Detroit and Kansas City.
19-1.
Get a game up on Detroit and Kansas City.
Laley23
Posts: 29,506
May 16, 2011 11:13pm
OQB;770792 wrote:But he also has the highest paid lineup behind him to help him win all those games....do you think he would have that same record if he were in and Indians uniform?
No, but does any pitcher? Im just curious as to who you guys would spend the money on (outside of Halladay). Who has been better than CC?
royal_k
Posts: 4,423
May 16, 2011 11:13pm
Ballgame...lol
OQB
Posts: 6,679
May 16, 2011 11:13pm
Tribe wins 19-1 and move their record to 25-13!
Laley23
Posts: 29,506
May 16, 2011 11:14pm
Who goes for KC tomorrow since they used the scheduled starter today (to the tune of 14 ER lol)???
D
devil1197
Posts: 6,220
May 16, 2011 11:15pm
Laley23;770805 wrote:Who goes for KC tomorrow since they used the scheduled starter today (to the tune of 14 ER lol)???
He only pitched 2 innings, so he could probably go again lol.