Midstate01;765620 wrote:Is Arredondo on the 40 man?

Yes. He's been rehabbing (pitching very well) and is due to come off. He will be in Cincinnati. Probably in Chapman's role until he gets his stuff together. Scott Rolen will be back. So will Juan Francisco. All probably by the end of the weekend, maybe early next week with Francisco.

Arredondo for Leake.
Rolen for Valaika.
Francisco for either Cairo on the DL or another pitcher down, maybe LeCure, although he has earned his spot.

Hate to say it because I like the guy, but with Heisey and Lewis' versatility in the OF and on defense, at what point does Gomes get phased out? It's gotta be either Lewis DFA'ed (I'd hate this move) or Cairo to the DL for Francisco...

Midstate01;765620 wrote:Is Arredondo on the 40 man?

I think so, but he is out of options, so now that re-hab is over he either has to go to the 25 man or be made available to other teams. I still don't see the problem with what Dusty was adamantly against before the game -- switching out Chapman with Arredondo so Chapman can get straightened out without risking games. Maybe they send EV to Louisville -- does he have options. Also it may be good to have Leake go to Louisville, but Dusty said before Cueto and Bailey got hurt in the spring that it was never planned to send Leake down. Something has to give and it'll probably be one of the pitchers who pitched best today, LeCure, going down as I don't think they'll give Arredondo away.

Azubuike24;765623 wrote:Ryan Wagner. Difference was Wagner was conceivably ready to be a reliever, and it's much easier to come up in a relief role as a major league. I'm not giving up on Leake but after last year people talked about him like the Reds had a future starter spot penciled in for the next 10-15 years, kind of like another Arroyo, and clearly, he's NOT at that level yet.

The good news is, he's got options and the Reds have good starters. On most teams, a guy like him would continually be run out every 5 days for a few years because of last year's success. The truth is, after mid-July last year, he got rocked, was then shut down due to "arm fatigue" and he hasn't been good this year at all.

I thought Leake has had some pretty good starts this year hasn't he? I just looked up his stats and he went 6 innings twice(gave up 2 both times) and went 7 twice(gave up 2 and 3 runs). I'm not a baseball guy but those appear to be fairly good starts, nothing earth shattering though.

Can someone explain the option thing to me? I keep seeing it and don't understand how some people have options and others don't. Guessing it's based on their contract but honestly don't know.

I agree on the comparison, don't get me wrong. Wagner came into a horrible situation on an awful team with bad defense behind him. He came in and had the "future closer" label on him from day one, responsible for saving a pen which was one of, if not the worst in baseball. Add to that his injury problems, and he was doomed.

Leake isn't doomed, but I think many people, Dusty Baker included, are blinded by how "solid" he was last year in the first 3-4 months, when people expected very little, if anything, from a guy with 0 professional experience. That has really clouded judgment and I think reality isn't as clear about his performance/ceiling as it would be for others. Quite honestly, he can't help this team right now, and bringing him in today's situation was exactly why. He's a starter, who isn't ready to crack this rotation, and putting him in a situation where stuff needs to dominate on a batter to batter basis is doing NOBODY any good.

Terry_Tate;765629 wrote:Can someone explain the option thing to me? I keep seeing it and don't understand how some people have options and others don't. Guessing it's based on their contract but honestly don't know.

Every player gets a certain amount of options based on their service. Players who are younger can be moved freely from the majors to the minors at any time while they are on the 40-man roster, without being subject to being lost to another team. For instance, Mike Leake, since he's in his second season, can get shuffled up and down from Louisville and Cincinnati for the next 2 or 3 years. Once he hits a certain amount of major league service time, he would be subject to waivers for him to go back and forth.

For instance, the Reds could send Mike Leake down and bring Jose Arredondo without having to make any changes. Nobody would be subject to waivers or the Reds losing them. They could not, one month later, send Arredondo down and bring Leake up, unless Arredondo cleared waivers (which he likely wouldn't). If he clears waivers, the Reds could then move him to AAA. If he was DFA'ed, they would bypass him going on waivers, he would be removed from the 40-man roster and he could either be forced down to AAA (off the 40-man roster) or if he's already been DFA'ed once in his career, he could either choose to go to AAA (off the 40-man) or become a free agent.

BTW, that's just a general understanding. There are a ton of little nuances of these rules that are out there somewhere. Normally though, guys who have options are younger players/prospects or guys who might be older but have never been consistently staying in the majors.

I'd rather have Lewis be the lefty batter off the bench and use Janish as Rolen's backup and let Renteria play SS on those days. I'm more sold on Valaika than Francisco.

Cards are down 10-1 in the 6th right now, so the Reds will most likely be 1 game back before their series this weekend.

SportsAndLady;765903 wrote:Cards are down 10-1 in the 6th right now, so the Reds will most likely be 1 game back before their series this weekend.

Only makes today hurt a little more.

Azubuike24;765633 wrote:Every player gets a certain amount of options based on their service. Players who are younger can be moved freely from the majors to the minors at any time while they are on the 40-man roster, without being subject to being lost to another team. For instance, Mike Leake, since he's in his second season, can get shuffled up and down from Louisville and Cincinnati for the next 2 or 3 years. Once he hits a certain amount of major league service time, he would be subject to waivers for him to go back and forth.

For instance, the Reds could send Mike Leake down and bring Jose Arredondo without having to make any changes. Nobody would be subject to waivers or the Reds losing them. They could not, one month later, send Arredondo down and bring Leake up, unless Arredondo cleared waivers (which he likely wouldn't). If he clears waivers, the Reds could then move him to AAA. If he was DFA'ed, they would bypass him going on waivers, he would be removed from the 40-man roster and he could either be forced down to AAA (off the 40-man roster) or if he's already been DFA'ed once in his career, he could either choose to go to AAA (off the 40-man) or become a free agent.

Thanks for the explanation. I figured it was contract or length of time in the majors, so that makes sense.

Thats a pretty good explanation of player options.

Each player has three options...and during the year you can get sent down as many times as teh team wishes and that is considered only one option.

WLW clarified last night that volquez DOES have options left.

Many players never get 'out of options' and technically could be sent down but that usually is reserved for the younger players. There are tons of rules/regulations/stipulations etc that goes alot with it.