Pick6;1394080 wrote:Have never done them, but have heard of people getting crazy results from them, like you say. Any idea why that is?

Oh, definitely. If I'm pyramiding in normal fashion, going 12-10-8 (increasing the weight as I go), I'm not going to be able to use as much weight, nor likely get as many reps, on that last set of 8 as I would if I start out with maximal weight on my first set and go for 8 reps.

Pick6;1394080 wrote:Have never done them, but have heard of people getting crazy results from them, like you say. Any idea why that is?

It is really quite simple. Your first work set is when your body is at it's freshest. Therefore your first set (after proper warm ups) should ideally be your best since your body hasn't really expended much energy.

For example when I deadlifted last week: 325x5, 295x7, 255x9. Now if I would have done that in the reverse order there is no way I could have gotten 5 reps at 325. My body would have been exhausted by then.

birddog23;1394203 wrote:It is really quite simple. Your first work set is when your body is at it's freshest. Therefore your first set (after proper warm ups) should ideally be your best since your body hasn't really expended much energy.

For example when I deadlifted last week: 325x5, 295x7, 255x9. Now if I would have done that in the reverse order there is no way I could have gotten 5 reps at 325. My body would have been exhausted by then.

What did your warmup for DLs consist of?

birddog23;1394203 wrote:It is really quite simple. Your first work set is when your body is at it's freshest. Therefore your first set (after proper warm ups) should ideally be your best since your body hasn't really expended much energy.

For example when I deadlifted last week: 325x5, 295x7, 255x9. Now if I would have done that in the reverse order there is no way I could have gotten 5 reps at 325. My body would have been exhausted by then.

Exactly. Said it much better than me.

Automatik;1394207 wrote:What did your warmup for DLs consist of?

Contrary to a lot of beliefs, you don't really need to do a lot of warming up...and this is coming from a 45 year old with bad knees/elbows and a bad left front delt. My first "work" set (8 reps) on the bench is with over 300 lbs and I usually just bust out a set with 135 to get the blood flowing.

BR1986FB;1394237 wrote:Contrary to a lot of beliefs, you don't really need to do a lot of warming up...and this is coming from a 45 year old with bad knees/elbows and a bad left front delt. My first "work" set (8 reps) on the bench is with over 300 lbs and I usually just bust out a set with 135 to get the blood flowing.

I'm with you here. Although I'm about half your age lol. I did 135x4 and then 225x3. Boom I'm ready to go then.

BR1986FB;1394237 wrote:Contrary to a lot of beliefs, you don't really need to do a lot of warming up...and this is coming from a 45 year old with bad knees/elbows and a bad left front delt. My first "work" set (8 reps) on the bench is with over 300 lbs and I usually just bust out a set with 135 to get the blood flowing.

My first set is 135. What should I use to warm up? Kidding.

I agree with the blood flow. Before I start weights I almost always do some type of dynamic warm up that gets a sweat started then I do a warm up set. I see guys do like five sets of warm up and just don't get it.

hasbeen;1394249 wrote:My first set is 135. What should I use to warm up? Kidding.

I agree with the blood flow. Before I start weights I almost always do some type of dynamic warm up that gets a sweat started then I do a warm up set. I see guys do like five sets of warm up and just don't get it.

I'll hop around a little, stretch the shoulders out and do shoulder "dislocations" where you take a broomstick, hold it at both ends and then take it from front to your back (by your butt) and "dislocate" the shoulder. It doesn't literally dislocate it but it warms it up. Then, I do a set with 135 and I'm good to go. I also should mention that I warm my joints up with equine (horse) linament prior to workouts. Chit works like a champ.

BR1986FB;1394237 wrote:Contrary to a lot of beliefs, you don't really need to do a lot of warming up...and this is coming from a 45 year old with bad knees/elbows and a bad left front delt. My first "work" set (8 reps) on the bench is with over 300 lbs and I usually just bust out a set with 135 to get the blood flowing.

Yeah, I've heard this. Was just curious to see weight/reps if he did any.



Btw, I've made about 5 pumpkin cheesecakes so far. I've got that shit down! :laugh: "Whipped" nonfat cottage cheese is the key!

BR1986FB;1394259 wrote:I'll hop around a little, stretch the shoulders out and do shoulder "dislocations" where you take a broomstick, hold it at both ends and then take it from front to your back (by your butt) and "dislocate" the shoulder. It doesn't literally dislocate it but it warms it up. Then, I do a set with 135 and I'm good to go. I also should mention that I warm my joints up with equine (horse) linament prior to workouts. Chit works like a champ.

I don't use a broomstick, but that's my favorite warm up.

I usually run 3 miles before I lift. Not currently looking to bulk up. Just trying to lose a little, but don't want to lose too much strength. I've fixed my diet a lot since November. I need to change some more to lose more weight, but not ready yet. Lost 17lbs in 2 months so I figure I don't want to lose too much too quick.

I'll have to link to the study but there has been some research from summer of 2012 specifically focusing on "cardiovascular training" on a muscle group, prior to resistance training to a similar muscle group shows increased gains and enhanced production and reception of T-levels. This is counter-intuitive to what is generally though, although I think the reason why is somewhat misunderstood.

The real key is to be able to train as long and heavy as you could without the cardiovascular training, otherwise you're losing a little top-end ability and the net effect is zero.

So I tried the reverse pyramid structure today for legs. Yup, legs on a Friday...I'm a badass. :laugh:

Actually, my legs are weak. I don't completely neglect them, but I'm trying to focus more on my core and lower body in general.

Thoughts on this?

Air squats and the bar for a warmup.

215 x 6
200 x 8
185 x 9
135 x 10
135 x 10

After I got thoroughly dominated by that, I did some dumbbell stiff legged dead lifts in the same format

80 x 6
65 x 8
55 x 10
55 x 12

Finished with some calves and 30 min of cardio and I'm fucking hurting. I live 10 blocks from my gym....it took a while to get home.

Oh..I also attempted some hanging "toe to bar raises" to finish it off. Let's just say I should have started with easier knee raises. That exercise is a bitch. I need to build up more.

How regularily and how long have you been squatting. That actually looks pretty decent.

I'm starting to get irritated at my squat progress, mostly because I've been stuck. I can 1RM 245 but am really nervous to do it too often because I have such a bad right knee, it's immediately unstable and the bar tends to roll a bit. Doing anything heavy with reps over 200 is a killer because I'm so nervous about the knee, despite there being no pain. Maybe it's me really fearing an injury because it is refreshing to know you have your mobility.

It's frustrating when I've hit 335 for a double dead lifting, even though I only weigh about 170 right now.

Automatik, have you tried a HIIT style cardio, maybe 3 or 4 sprints BEFORE training legs, and then maybe slowly pace yourself the 10 blocks home walking?

I'll be honest, the first set of 215 was a bitch. I was wobbly as hell at first, but got it together. My form is ok, but could be better. My knees sometimes tend to bend in. I've been squatting off and on for years. In the last month I've been increasing my leg workouts, maybe twice a week. I've also been doing Bulgarian split squats. Ever try them? Good stuff and also brutal. I always thought it was a chick exercise.

I feel ya regarding your knee. I was dealing with on and off inflammation in my right knee about a year to 18 months ago, frustrating as hell. At one point I stopped doing squats all together due to it. It's better...for now.

I never was one to go crazy on squats. I don't think I've ever even attempted to max out. I just remember in the past I would try to do 3-5 at 250lb. That was 5+ years ago though when I was much bigger/stronger and holding a lot more weight.

Also, I've done HIIT in the past, but not lately. Today I just stiffened up after the workout, it happens lol

Azubuike24;1394441 wrote:I'll have to link to the study but there has been some research from summer of 2012 specifically focusing on "cardiovascular training" on a muscle group, prior to resistance training to a similar muscle group shows increased gains and enhanced production and reception of T-levels. This is counter-intuitive to what is generally though, although I think the reason why is somewhat misunderstood.

The real key is to be able to train as long and heavy as you could without the cardiovascular training, otherwise you're losing a little top-end ability and the net effect is zero.

If you fine that link, post it.

As for legs, i don't think I've worked them out in over a month. I guarantee I could squat 315 sets of 6+ right now. I just don't see the purpose of doing them anymore. I need to do light weight leg curls/extension/press, but haven't done it yet. I just don't think my MCL is fully functional after tearing it fall '10.
My junior and senior years of college I went into football season squatting right around 500. I just don't need that strength anymore.

I coach and play slow pitch softball. If you guys have good logic to do legs again, I could use the motivation. Lol

hasbeen;1394567 wrote:If you fine that link, post it.

As for legs, i don't think I've worked them out in over a month. I guarantee I could squat 315 sets of 6+ right now. I just don't see the purpose of doing them anymore. I need to do light weight leg curls/extension/press, but haven't done it yet. I just don't think my MCL is fully functional after tearing it fall '10.
My junior and senior years of college I went into football season squatting right around 500. I just don't need that strength anymore.

I coach and play slow pitch softball. If you guys have good logic to do legs again, I could use the motivation. Lol

Its pretty widely known that having and being a good squatter/deadlifter will help your other lifts increase. I've read this a lot and really do believe it.

birddog23;1395573 wrote:Its pretty widely known that having and being a good squatter/deadlifter will help your other lifts increase. I've read this a lot and really do believe it.

Definitely.


Im going to try the reverse pyramid tomorrow. Question though...I get the theory that doing this makes doing your 8 rep set easier, but why would it matter if you can already do your 12-10-8?

Pick6;1395580 wrote:Definitely.


Im going to try the reverse pyramid tomorrow. Question though...I get the theory that doing this makes doing your 8 rep set easier, but why would it matter if you can already do your 12-10-8?

If you can do 225 (for example) for 8 reps on your bench at the END of your bench workout, you should be able to get (for example) 235 for 8 reps at the BEGINNING of your bench workout. You're fresher & stronger.

BR1986FB;1395613 wrote:If you can do 225 (for example) for 8 reps on your bench at the END of your bench workout, you should be able to get (for example) 235 for 8 reps at the BEGINNING of your bench workout. You're fresher & stronger.

derp. makes sense. thanks

I guess it really depends what your main priority/goal is long-term, or even just that day. If I'm maxing out, I'll deadlift or squat at the beginning of a workout and then expect to be a bit weaker afterward, regardless of what I'm doing. If just going for reps and building strength, I'll deadlift (especially) at the end of the workout as most other things don't tax the CNS nearly as much.

Then again, I've never been able to just go in and hit 3 or 4 PR-level sets and call it quits. Some people can and in that case, I guess it doesn't matter.

I think I'm going for the 24 hr fast tomorrow or Wednesday. I'm wondering if I should workout on that day or not, but I know working out "fasted" is preferred.

If it goes ok, might be a new weekly thing. We shall see!

Automatik;1395800 wrote:I think I'm going for the 24 hr fast tomorrow or Wednesday. I'm wondering if I should workout on that day or not, but I know working out "fasted" is preferred.

If it goes ok, might be a new weekly thing. We shall see!

I'd be an angry mother fucker not eating for 24 hours.

Raw Dawgin' it;1395840 wrote:I'd be an angry mother fucker not eating for 24 hours.

It's actually not that bad. I've only gone 20 hours but after a certain period of time you hit a comfort zone.

Raw Dawgin' it;1395840 wrote:I'd be an angry mother fucker not eating for 24 hours.

I'm a bit worried about that, which is why I'm going to eat once midday then start. I've been rather irritable at work lately as is. I can't be lashing out from lack of food. :laugh:

Once you train your body it's rather easy to fast for a long time. It's very difficult coming off a glucose-fueled diet 100% of the time to go right into a 24-hour fast though.

Anyone who has done it will likely be able to attest to some amazing benefits. Clarity, improvement in digestion, improved immunity, etc.