WebFire;711674 wrote:How can they have set the program back 20 years when it hasn't even been 20 years? Most of the aftermath didn't start until 1997, and the big sanctions weren't handed out until 2003 I think.

Most people on here don't know anything about this history of Michigan bball. It's not like they were a storied program up until the Fab 5 anyway. Frieder and Fisher put Michigan on the map, before then they weren't very relevant. They just lump bball with football. 99-2008 was really the only low period, and even that included an NIT title which for a program with all kinds of trouble isn't too shabby.

WebFire;711677 wrote:Precisely why Fab Five didn't like them. Duke didn't recruit the kids from the hood. Only the perceived good kids, many of whom were white. If you know much about this time period, it was a time of rap and hip hop, and almost a small black rights movement period. These inner city kids were angry. Duke was a target for them.

Like others said, I didn't like Duke then because because they did seem like fairies. I can only imagine how much the Fab Five hated them.

PRobably right. Yeah..I was in HS about this time period altought live in a white area.

dave;711728 wrote:Most people on here don't know anything about this history of Michigan bball. It's not like they were a storied program up until the Fab 5 anyway. Frieder and Fisher put Michigan on the map, before then they weren't very relevant. They just lump bball with football. 99-2008 was really the only low period, and even that included an NIT title which for a program with all kinds of trouble isn't too shabby.

They weren't storied, but Frieder and Fisher had a good thing going. But Michigan never has been a powerhouse basketball school. The '89 'ship was a bit of a surprise even.

thavoice;711735 wrote:PRobably right. Yeah..I was in HS about this time period altought live in a white area.

Same here. I was a frosh-soph during the Fab Five years. Even though I lived in a white area, the hip-hop culture was still making it's presence known.

WebFire;711738 wrote:Same here. I was a frosh-soph during the Fab Five years. Even though I lived in a white area, the hip-hop culture was still making it's presence known.

Very true...and whites were buying the hip hop music like it was going out of style. I know we would make the hour trip to the closest place that sold tapes, yeah I said tapes, and then CD's with explicit lyrics.....for shock value i imagine at that age. The good ole 2 Live Crew Banned in the USA tape......that got lots of play...but anyways.......

Of course growing up a Duke fan I disliked Michigan for the very reasons Michigan players disliked Duke. I felt Michigan was a bunch of thugged out ruffians who didn't belong in the college game.
The sanctions kind of validated this point, but I am admittedly biased on this point. Thomas Hill, Grant Hill, Brian Davis were from good families and if memory serves were not public school educated.
Coach K changed his stance a bit with the recruitment and signing of St.Louis native Chris Carrawell and Chicago kid Sean Dockery. Of course Duke got flack for signing Dockery because of his lower than normal test scores. But I guess it was so out of character it was a magnet for criticism.

As for the Fab 5, great time in college hoops. Really exploded on the scene and made college basketball trendy and empowered players more so than coaches. I feel at that time coaches dominated the headlines (K, Dean, Carlisemo, Tark, Pitino) but with the fab 5 the players now became brand managers.

WebFire;711677 wrote:Precisely why Fab Five didn't like them. Duke didn't recruit the kids from the hood. Only the perceived good kids, many of whom were white. If you know much about this time period, it was a time of rap and hip hop, and almost a small black rights movement period. These inner city kids were angry. Duke was a target for them.

Like others said, I didn't like Duke then because because they did seem like fairies. I can only imagine how much the Fab Five hated them.

Funny how no one remembers Chris Webber WAS recruited by Duke. He made an official visit to Duke. Duke offered Webber a scholarship.

Jalen Rose, dont let the facts get in the way of your story of racism.

september63;711764 wrote:Funny how no one remembers Chris Webber WAS recruited by Duke. He made an official visit to Duke. Duke offered Webber a scholarship.

Jalen Rose, dont let the facts get in the way of your story of racism.

Chris Webber went to a private school.

SportsAndLady;711788 wrote:Chris Webber went to a private school.

And was also the #1 prospect in the country. None of the rest were even an afterthought for Duke.

Funny how no one remembers Chris Webber WAS recruited by Duke.

This was mentioned by Juwann Howard, who signed first and then recruited King, Rose, Jackson, and Weber.

Why is their hatred of Duke such a big issue? Who gives a shit if they hated Duke. They also said they hated Ohio State.

Duke, I'm sure, takes pride in their preppy culture and the ability to win at times with less talent.

Duke, I'm sure, takes pride in their preppy culture and the ability to win at times with less talent.

Because race was brought into the conversation

thedynasty1998;711809 wrote:Why is their hatred of Duke such a big issue? Who gives a shit if they hated Duke. They also said they hated Ohio State.

Duke, I'm sure, takes pride in their preppy culture and the ability to win at times with less talent.

You mean, the Fuckeyes?

Im just saying it wasnt a black/white issue. Jalen Rose says they only recruited white kids and Uncle Toms. Is he calling Webber an Uncle Tom then?

september63;711824 wrote:Im just saying it wasnt a black/white issue. Jalen Rose says they only recruited white kids and Uncle Toms. Is he calling Webber an Uncle Tom then?

He didn't say white kids and uncle toms, he said white kids or black uncle toms.

SportsAndLady;711837 wrote:He didn't say white kids and uncle toms, he said white kids or black uncle toms.

No Shit. The term "Uncle Tom" only refers to black ppl a little to accepting to the white culture. No such thing as a white Uncle Tom.

SportsAndLady;711837 wrote:He didn't say white kids and uncle toms, he said white kids or black uncle toms.

..and I heard they didnt recruit black african americans either.........just african americans.

CinciX12;699881 wrote:I realize that. But to not admit that they changed basketball is a little ridiculous.

Prescott;711813 wrote:Because race was brought into the conversation

Imagine that...race being brought into the conversation by blacks who got caught cheating.

september63;711847 wrote:No Shit. The term "Uncle Tom" only refers to black ppl a little to accepting to the white culture. No such thing as a white Uncle Tom.

My bad I thought you said it was a black/white issue, so I was thinking you said he only recruited white guys...I did not know uncle toms were only black people?

Its ok. IT is a term i have not heard in awhile myself. When i was growing up ya heard it thrown around a little bit more but not so much anymore

Relax September I believe Rose was just making a general statement. Let's face it, the preception is that Duke does recruit white guys and well to do black guys. This is coming from Rose who truly lived in the hood. He was making a generalization about it. Was Rose's thoughts and statements racist back in the day? Hell yea and he would be the first to admit it.

SportsAndLady;711903 wrote:My bad I thought you said it was a black/white issue, so I was thinking you said he only recruited white guys...I did not know uncle toms were only black people?

Yep. It derives from the novel "Uncle Toms Cabin" which was written about a slave, Uncle Tom and how he behaved with his owners and such. An excellent book, and I believe it was the second best selling book over 100 years to only the Bible.

In fact, Lincoln says the novel was a huge part in the Civil War starting up.

uncle tom = Carlton Banks
black inner city kids = jazzy jeff

I thought it was a good show last night

eh, I thought it was OK

I agree with the guys on The Fan. The first part of it was pretty entertaining, the second part seemed like an infomercial. I dont need to hear the "should student athletes gets paid" argument anymore. These kids knew what they were getting into.