Choose your scenario: OSU Sugar Bowl

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ptown_trojans_1's avatar

ptown_trojans_1

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7,632 posts
Dec 24, 2010 12:05 PM
Manhattan Buckeye;612610 wrote:1) It is a big issue. It isn't a crime but it's the first thing compliance departments tell athletes. You do this - you risk not being able to play.

2) I don't buy the "well it hurts other players" argument. What if it were crimes these guys committed? No one here would seriously argue that they should be out on bail and be able to play because other players who didn't commit the crimes would be affected.

3) Gene Smith should be fired. He's effed this up as much as an AD could. You take a high profile and VERY well compensated position, you are accountable. Either he's a major league liar about their compliance department's process or he's incompetent because if he's telling the truth he can't manage the program. Either way, he messed up in his position.

Ohio St. is a laughingstock right now. Rationalizing bad behavior doesn't help anyone. Take the medicine and fix the disease.

Largely agree, but disagree that Gene needs to go.
The university should be docked some scholarships and placed on probation for a few years.
Dec 24, 2010 12:05pm
darbypitcher22's avatar

darbypitcher22

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8,000 posts
Dec 24, 2010 12:14 PM
centralbucksfan;612575 wrote:I don't disagree with you. But you have to look thru the eyes of the coach. Who has to have the betterment of the "whole" over the individual in mind is many situations.

This is true, but to a point. You're teaching a much more valuable lesson to that whole by not playing them than you ever could by allowing them to play in the game.
Dec 24, 2010 12:14pm
Z

zach24oz

Senior Member

598 posts
Dec 24, 2010 12:32 PM
I don't really think they should go Reggie Bush and USC on the OSU program because the usc thing was much worse...I would just not let the 5 guys play the bowl game and see what happens after that. If they do play, there will be more stuff looked into it as time goes on and if they find something I don't want to have to give up a sugar bowl tropy because those guys should not have been playing in the first place.
Dec 24, 2010 12:32pm
lhslep134's avatar

lhslep134

why so serious?

9,774 posts
Dec 24, 2010 12:44 PM
Manhattan Buckeye;612610 wrote:
Ohio St. is a laughingstock right now. Rationalizing bad behavior doesn't help anyone. Take the medicine and fix the disease.

Are you drunk? I don't think anyone thinks OSU is a laughingstock because 5 of their players tried to sell stuff they received for some extra money to help their family (or whatever the real reason is).
Dec 24, 2010 12:44pm
V

vball10set

paying it forward

24,795 posts
Dec 24, 2010 12:50 PM
Manhattan Buckeye;612610 wrote: Ohio St. is a laughingstock right now. Rationalizing bad behavior doesn't help anyone. Take the medicine and fix the disease.
:confused: usually you bring up some good points and have decent input on OSU athletics, but I think you're way off here....embarassed by these relevations, yes--laughingstock? sorry--no
Dec 24, 2010 12:50pm
G

georgemc80

Senior Member

983 posts
Dec 24, 2010 12:55 PM
Sit them...I honestly believe and would wager good money that even without these players OSU beats Arkansas.

The Recipe:

Guiton has to start and play.
The studs behind Herron along with Saine become the brunt of the offense.
Play field position
Play good special teams(iffy, I know)
Play bend don't break Defense


Hey this sounds familiar...win the game using Tressel ball.

Given the opportunity Guiton can be a poor man's Denard Robinson.
Dec 24, 2010 12:55pm
jordo212000's avatar

jordo212000

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10,664 posts
Dec 24, 2010 1:02 PM
vball10set;612662 wrote::confused: usually you bring up some good points and have decent input on OSU athletics, but I think you're way off here....embarassed by these relevations, yes--laughingstock? sorry--no

Yeah I was going to say the same thing to him. There are few people barbecuing Ohio State right now. Most of the talk is centered on Pryor and Posey (+ his mom).
Dec 24, 2010 1:02pm
lhslep134's avatar

lhslep134

why so serious?

9,774 posts
Dec 24, 2010 1:08 PM
georgemc80;612667 wrote:
Given the opportunity Guiton can be a poor man's Denard Robinson.

I think he's closer to an unpolished Troy Smith than Denard. Denard is the best QB in the nation with his feet.

But I agree with you.
Dec 24, 2010 1:08pm
darbypitcher22's avatar

darbypitcher22

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8,000 posts
Dec 24, 2010 1:26 PM
You're going to have to go to Guiton at some point... let's just face it, Bauserman has never been good enough to play here, and I don't exactly think that Taylor Graham will be either with Braxton in the fold
Dec 24, 2010 1:26pm
M

Manhattan Buckeye

Senior Member

7,566 posts
Dec 24, 2010 1:33 PM
vball10set;612662 wrote::confused: usually you bring up some good points and have decent input on OSU athletics, but I think you're way off here....embarassed by these relevations, yes--laughingstock? sorry--no

Did you see Gene Smith's press conference? They are deflecting it off like "it is no big deal - everyone does it." 4 of your top players get caught violating the first rule you're taught not to violate, is Ohio State completely incompetent by saying their players weren't educated?

Again, either they are lying (my opinion) or the athletic department can't maintain a compliance department. Pick which one is worse.
Dec 24, 2010 1:33pm
M

Manhattan Buckeye

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7,566 posts
Dec 24, 2010 1:35 PM
lhslep134;612652 wrote:Are you drunk? I don't think anyone thinks OSU is a laughingstock because 5 of their players tried to sell stuff they received for some extra money to help their family (or whatever the real reason is).

They are a laughingstock because moron AD says they were never specifically told they couldn't do that. Where's the O'Rly owl when you need it?
Dec 24, 2010 1:35pm
ytownfootball's avatar

ytownfootball

Bold faced liar...

6,978 posts
Dec 24, 2010 1:40 PM
Manhattan Buckeye;612704 wrote:Did you see Gene Smith's press conference? They are deflecting it off like "it is no big deal - everyone does it." 4 of your top players get caught violating the first rule you're taught not to violate, is Ohio State completely incompetent by saying their players weren't educated?

Again, either they are lying (my opinion) or the athletic department can't maintain a compliance department. Pick which one is worse.

Obviously not being able to maintain compliance is worse, that is definitely not the case. They lied.

Is that worse or "bad", well I guess, but honestly, would it be any different were this to have happened anywhere else? No. This generation (well the last several actually) seem to have a sense of entitlement never seen before. They're going to lie and post blame anywhere else other than where it belongs. Embarrassing? Hell yeah, but in NO WAY unexpected and certainly not laughing stock material, it'd be the same anywhere else.
Dec 24, 2010 1:40pm
C

centralbucksfan

Senior Member

5,111 posts
Dec 24, 2010 1:45 PM
Manhattan Buckeye;612705 wrote:They are a laughingstock because moron AD says they were never specifically told they couldn't do that. Where's the O'Rly owl when you need it?

You really don't get it, do you? THe AD and the coach said what they said so they can take the heat. They took one for the team, as a leader should do. When something like this happens, those who run the program are and should be ultimately responsible. Get a clue.
Dec 24, 2010 1:45pm
lhslep134's avatar

lhslep134

why so serious?

9,774 posts
Dec 24, 2010 1:47 PM
Manhattan Buckeye;612705 wrote:They are a laughingstock because moron AD says they were never specifically told they couldn't do that. Where's the O'Rly owl when you need it?

Thanks for answering my question, you are indeed drunk.
Dec 24, 2010 1:47pm
M

Manhattan Buckeye

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7,566 posts
Dec 24, 2010 1:54 PM
What the hell are you talking about?

Defend Smith's comments for me, please.

Thanks for having a substantive conversation. Either make an argument or not....why were the OSU players not aware of the rule? Was it a lack of instruction from the AD's office (Smith should be fired), incompetence by the compliance department (they should be fired)....or as Centralbucks put it (and is my interpretation as well), they took one for the team?

If that's the case, IMO they should resign. If OSU has any semblance of an academic honor code or any pretense that their athletic department has anything to do with the university - yeah, take one for the team, but don't be part of the academic community.
Dec 24, 2010 1:54pm
C

centralbucksfan

Senior Member

5,111 posts
Dec 24, 2010 1:58 PM
Manhattan Buckeye;612716 wrote:If that's the case, IMO they should resign. If OSU has any semblance of an academic honor code or any pretense that their athletic department has anything to do with the university - yeah, take one for the team, but don't be part of the academic community.

Resign? For what reason? Now your starting to sound downright ignorant and making this bigger then what it is....like many.
Dec 24, 2010 1:58pm
ytownfootball's avatar

ytownfootball

Bold faced liar...

6,978 posts
Dec 24, 2010 1:59 PM
Manhattan Buckeye;612716 wrote:What the hell are you talking about?

Defend Smith's comments for me, please.

Thanks for having a substantive conversation. Either make an argument or not....why were the OSU players not aware of the rule? Was it a lack of instruction from the AD's office (Smith should be fired), incompetence by the compliance department (they should be fired)....or as Centralbucks put it (and is my interpretation as well), they took one for the team?

If that's the case, IMO they should resign. If OSU has any semblance of an academic honor code or any pretense that their athletic department has anything to do with the university - yeah, take one for the team, but don't be part of the academic community.

Man you're in left field here. There is no way you can possibly believe that the issue doesn't go deeper than just the two guys put in front of the mikes do you?
Dec 24, 2010 1:59pm
M

Manhattan Buckeye

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7,566 posts
Dec 24, 2010 2:01 PM
Resign for lying - or if he isn't lying, being incompetent. If I'm ignorant that thinking a university head and trusted official (i) shouldn't lie or (ii) should be able to do the job they are paid to do, than I'm ignorant. Call me ignorant all you want.
Dec 24, 2010 2:01pm
M

Manhattan Buckeye

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7,566 posts
Dec 24, 2010 2:03 PM
ytownfootball;612720 wrote:Man you're in left field here. There is no way you can possibly believe that the issue doesn't go deeper than just the two guys put in front of the mikes do you?

Oh I'm sure it goes deeper, that isn't an excuse for the guys in front of the mikes to lie.
Dec 24, 2010 2:03pm
ytownfootball's avatar

ytownfootball

Bold faced liar...

6,978 posts
Dec 24, 2010 2:04 PM
I wasn't aware that an AD's job description included keeping players from lying and selling their shit in a back alley.
Dec 24, 2010 2:04pm
Pick6's avatar

Pick6

A USA American

14,946 posts
Dec 24, 2010 2:08 PM
ytownfootball;612726 wrote:I wasn't aware that an AD's job description included keeping players from lying and selling their shit in a back alley.

+1..some of you are acting like we are worse than USC or something now lol
Dec 24, 2010 2:08pm
M

Manhattan Buckeye

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7,566 posts
Dec 24, 2010 2:08 PM
The AD's job is to make sure they know the rules. For Christ's sake the guy makes hundreds of thousands a year. If the players screwed up, take the penalty. If you are saying you screwed up, fall on your sword.
Dec 24, 2010 2:08pm
ytownfootball's avatar

ytownfootball

Bold faced liar...

6,978 posts
Dec 24, 2010 2:10 PM
Manhattan Buckeye;612724 wrote:Oh I'm sure it goes deeper, that isn't an excuse for the guys in front of the mikes to lie.

Part of that deeper issue involves towing the "company" line just like any other organization. You know damn well they didn't/don't want to mamby pamby the hell out of it but realistically have no other option, either now or for later considerations.
Dec 24, 2010 2:10pm
F

fan_from_texas

Senior Member

2,693 posts
Dec 24, 2010 2:25 PM
Manhattan Buckeye;612610 wrote:1) It is a big issue. It isn't a crime but it's the first thing compliance departments tell athletes. You do this - you risk not being able to play.

2) I don't buy the "well it hurts other players" argument. What if it were crimes these guys committed? No one here would seriously argue that they should be out on bail and be able to play because other players who didn't commit the crimes would be affected.

3) Gene Smith should be fired. He's effed this up as much as an AD could. You take a high profile and VERY well compensated position, you are accountable. Either he's a major league liar about their compliance department's process or he's incompetent because if he's telling the truth he can't manage the program. Either way, he messed up in his position.

Ohio St. is a laughingstock right now. Rationalizing bad behavior doesn't help anyone. Take the medicine and fix the disease.
I agree with all of this. I hope Tress forces them to sit out and shows that Ohio State is better than that.
Dec 24, 2010 2:25pm
darbypitcher22's avatar

darbypitcher22

Senior Member

8,000 posts
Dec 24, 2010 2:26 PM
Manhattan Buckeye;612730 wrote:The AD's job is to make sure they know the rules. For Christ's sake the guy makes hundreds of thousands a year. If the players screwed up, take the penalty. If you are saying you screwed up, fall on your sword.

False. The AD's job is to make sure people that work in the compliance office have adequately educated these young men. I firmly believe that there's NO WAY these guys couldn't have at least thought that what they were doing wasn't a violation. At least the first day if not part of the 2nd day of practice when they're back on campus is spent with these compliance people dealing with presentations on the rules and filling out tons of paperwork related to summer jobs and the wages they earned, vehicles, housing, etc.
Dec 24, 2010 2:26pm