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Gilbert investigating Heat tampering

Home ▸ Archive ▸ Pro Sports ▸ Gilbert investigating Heat tampering
hoops23's avatar

hoops23

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15,696 posts
Dec 3, 2010 10:45 PM
jordo212000;586838 wrote:Let. it. go. Gilbert

Quite frankly, Gilbert can do whatever the fuck he wants to do lol.
Dec 3, 2010 10:45pm
hoops23's avatar

hoops23

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15,696 posts
Dec 3, 2010 10:48 PM
enigmaax;586850 wrote:Hmmm....

LeBron in the finals with the Cavs = record low ratings
LeBron with the Heat = ratings soar http://thebiglead.com/index.php/2010/11/19/heat-mean-big-ratings/

Sounds terrible for the league.

Cavs vs Spurs was a boring match-up. Everybody knew what was going to happen and there weren't any exciting match-ups.

Recently though (the past two seasons), the Cavs had some of the biggest rating draws.

Of course the Heat are going to have good ratings right now.. It's new.. People are curios, the Heat have been shaky, etc..

In a few months, nobody will really give a fuck. Especially with ESON shoving them down the masses throats.

If you think 2 or 3 good teams that bring in ratings is good for a league overall, you're pretty foolish. I mean, I guess that's why the NBA lost about 400 million last year and may go into a lockout this upcoming season, right?
Dec 3, 2010 10:48pm
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enigmaax

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4,511 posts
Dec 3, 2010 10:53 PM
hoops23;586854 wrote:Cavs vs Spurs was a boring match-up. Everybody knew what was going to happen and there weren't any exciting match-ups.

Recently though (the past two seasons), the Cavs had some of the biggest rating draws.

Of course the Heat are going to have good ratings right now.. It's new.. People are curios, the Heat have been shaky, etc..

In a few months, nobody will really give a fuck. Especially with ESON shoving them down the masses throats.

If you think 2 or 3 good teams that bring in ratings is good for a league overall, you're pretty foolish. I mean, I guess that's why the NBA lost about 400 million last year and may go into a lockout this upcoming season, right?

Or maybe you'd like to look up the NBA's relative "success" when its top teams are dynasties. People want to see greatness, not "balance" because balance invariably means mediocrity. I've posted the numbers before, I'll wait (but not hold my breath) for you to back up your ridiculous hyposthesis with a modicum of fact......which isn't going to happen.
Dec 3, 2010 10:53pm
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enigmaax

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4,511 posts
Dec 3, 2010 10:54 PM
hoops23;586854 wrote:Cavs vs Spurs was a boring match-up. Everybody knew what was going to happen and there weren't any exciting match-ups.

Oh and....no shit. Why? Because neither was a "super team". Duh.
Dec 3, 2010 10:54pm
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jordo212000

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10,664 posts
Dec 3, 2010 10:54 PM
enigmaax;586850 wrote:Hmmm....

LeBron in the finals with the Cavs = record low ratings
LeBron with the Heat = ratings soar http://thebiglead.com/index.php/2010/11/19/heat-mean-big-ratings/

Sounds terrible for the league.

Yeah, it has been proven to people many a time that the NBA thrives when there are superteams loaded with superstars. That is what the casual fan wants to see, I know I do. I find it laughable that people think that casual fans want to see a watered down product, we don't.

Can you remember the last time anybody cared about game 16 of the regular season? haha. Usually the NBA has a hard time getting storylines during this time of the year. Not now.

Go ask David Stern if this is "bad" for the league. Ticket sales have been booming this year.
Dec 3, 2010 10:54pm
jordo212000's avatar

jordo212000

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10,664 posts
Dec 3, 2010 10:57 PM
hoops23;586851 wrote:Quite frankly, Gilbert can do whatever the fuck he wants to do lol.

I know he can and he is more than welcome to. He just looks silly in all of this. The crazy ex-girlfriend comparison really seems to fit him well.

If they do indeed find that the Heat were "tampering" how do you think he will tell David Stern? Another strongly worded letter in Comic Sans?
Dec 3, 2010 10:57pm
hoops23's avatar

hoops23

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Dec 3, 2010 10:59 PM
Ticket sales have been booming? For who? The Heat?

HEAT STRUGGLE TO SELL OUT HOME OPENER:
http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/blog/ball_dont_lie/post/Heat-struggles-to-sell-out-home-opener?urn=nba-281040

(And every home game after that has been terribly attended)

Check out the attendance, even the NHL is seeing better attendance figures than the NBA.

You guys are both foolish if you think this is good for the NBA. One or two markets dominating the ratings doesn't mean shit when there are 26 or so other teams who aren't doing shit ratings wise.

Why has the NFL become so popular? Parity.

Why is MLB still more popular than the NBA? Because of parity.

Wouldn't the "watered down product" be a league of 3 teams and bunch of nobodies? My god, what an idiotic statement once again from jordo...

You're saying a league with 12-14 really good teams would be watered down? LMAO. Hell, I'd take it if the NBA could get 8-10 teams that are legit contenders.
Dec 3, 2010 10:59pm
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jordo212000

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Dec 3, 2010 11:32 PM
hoops23;586866 wrote:Ticket sales have been booming? For who? The Heat?

HEAT STRUGGLE TO SELL OUT HOME OPENER:
http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/blog/ball_dont_lie/post/Heat-struggles-to-sell-out-home-opener?urn=nba-281040

(And every home game after that has been terribly attended)

Check out the attendance, even the NHL is seeing better attendance figures than the NBA.

You guys are both foolish if you think this is good for the NBA. One or two markets dominating the ratings doesn't mean shit when there are 26 or so other teams who aren't doing shit ratings wise.

Why has the NFL become so popular? Parity.

Why is MLB still more popular than the NBA? Because of parity.

Wouldn't the "watered down product" be a league of 3 teams and bunch of nobodies? My god, what an idiotic statement once again from jordo...

You're saying a league with 12-14 really good teams would be watered down? LMAO. Hell, I'd take it if the NBA could get 8-10 teams that are legit contenders.

You literally have no idea what you are talking about. The NBA was killing it at the box office at the start of the season...
http://www.sportingnews.com/nba/story/2010-09-28/offseason-frenzy-drives-nba-box-office

-The league had a 40% increase in season tickets compared to last year
- Revenues are up 40%
- Season ticket renewal was up 5%
- Best season for new ticket sales since 2007-2008
- 21 teams sold more than 1000 season tickets, compared to 11 last year

Oh and I love how you pick one article talking about one game and then base your opinion of the entire league off it.

I haven't even got into the ratings they've been getting. Just look at all the hype. The NBA matters right now and it usually doesn't matter until after the Super Bowl

Like engimaax said, you are either being dense or contrarian by arguing against the superteams. Superteams might not work in other leagues, but it works in the NBA

Oh and by the way, you argue that the NFL is wildly successful because of "parity" yet you neglect to mention that college football is just as popular, and that sport is famous for not having a lot of parity. My point: The sports are driving the needle and gaining revenue because they are football. It isn't about "parity".
Dec 3, 2010 11:32pm
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like_that

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Dec 3, 2010 11:36 PM
jordo212000;586899 wrote:You literally have no idea what you are talking about. The NBA was killing it at the box office at the start of the season...
http://www.sportingnews.com/nba/story/2010-09-28/offseason-frenzy-drives-nba-box-office

-The league had a 40% increase in season tickets compared to last year
- Revenues are up 40%
- Season ticket renewal was up 5%
- Best season for new ticket sales since 2007-2008
- 21 teams sold more than 1000 season tickets, compared to 11 last year

I haven't even got into the ratings they've been getting. Just look at all the hype. The NBA matters right now and it usually doesn't matter until after the Super Bowl

Like engimaax said, you are either being dense or contrarian by arguing against the superteams. Superteams might not work in other leagues, but it works in the NBA

Oh and by the way, you argue that the NFL is wildly successful because of "parity" yet you neglect to mention that college football is just as popular, and that sport is famous for not having a lot of parity. My point: The sports are driving the needle and gaining revenue because they are football. It isn't about "parity".


There is a lot more parity in college football than you think. Just because there is 128 teams (more?), doesn't mean there isn't parity. A playoff would prove that too.
Dec 3, 2010 11:36pm
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enigmaax

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4,511 posts
Dec 3, 2010 11:41 PM
hoops23;586866 wrote:Ticket sales have been booming? For who? The Heat?

HEAT STRUGGLE TO SELL OUT HOME OPENER:
http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/blog/ball_dont_lie/post/Heat-struggles-to-sell-out-home-opener?urn=nba-281040

(And every home game after that has been terribly attended)

Check out the attendance, even the NHL is seeing better attendance figures than the NBA.

You guys are both foolish if you think this is good for the NBA. One or two markets dominating the ratings doesn't mean shit when there are 26 or so other teams who aren't doing shit ratings wise.

Why has the NFL become so popular? Parity.

Why is MLB still more popular than the NBA? Because of parity.

Wouldn't the "watered down product" be a league of 3 teams and bunch of nobodies? My god, what an idiotic statement once again from jordo...

You're saying a league with 12-14 really good teams would be watered down? LMAO. Hell, I'd take it if the NBA could get 8-10 teams that are legit contenders.
Couple things...you are talking about the difference between 2-3 contenders and 4-5 contenders in any given season. How many legit contenders were there last year? If you add the Heat, how many are there this year? If some team suddenly pulled Carmelo Anthony and a couple other big time players, how many would there be? "Super Teams" are still increasing the number of legit contenders and that 8-10 pipedream ain't gonna happen either way.

As for ticket sales, 75% of it comes from season ticket holders and the NBA saw a record increase in that department. http://www.sportingnews.com/nba/story/2010-09-28/offseason-frenzy-drives-nba-box-office

And its funny you quote an article about how the Heat "struggle" to sell out when their attendance is up 2000 per game.
Dec 3, 2010 11:41pm
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like_that

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Dec 3, 2010 11:44 PM
There really is no excuse for them not to sell out every game. Their fans are just pathetic, but that is another discussion.
Dec 3, 2010 11:44pm
hoops23's avatar

hoops23

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15,696 posts
Dec 3, 2010 11:45 PM
jordo212000;586899 wrote:You literally have no idea what you are talking about. The NBA was killing it at the box office at the start of the season...
http://www.sportingnews.com/nba/story/2010-09-28/offseason-frenzy-drives-nba-box-office

-The league had a 40% increase in season tickets compared to last year
- Revenues are up 40%
- Season ticket renewal was up 5%
- Best season for new ticket sales since 2007-2008
- 21 teams sold more than 1000 season tickets, compared to 11 last year

Oh and I love how you pick one article talking about one game and then base your opinion of the entire league off it.

I haven't even got into the ratings they've been getting. Just look at all the hype. The NBA matters right now and it usually doesn't matter until after the Super Bowl

Like engimaax said, you are either being dense or contrarian by arguing against the superteams. Superteams might not work in other leagues, but it works in the NBA

Oh and by the way, you argue that the NFL is wildly successful because of "parity" yet you neglect to mention that college football is just as popular, and that sport is famous for not having a lot of parity. My point: The sports are driving the needle and gaining revenue because they are football. It isn't about "parity".

Like I said, there was a lot of early excitement coming into the NBA this year, however, that excitement is quickly dying. You can continue to be delusional, but the NBA improving at the beginning of the season isn't that big of a deal, because the fact is, 26 teams will no longer care come January, which is when the NBA always falters.

As for College football, there is A LOT of parity in that game.. You can't be that naive, can you? Every year there are quite a few title contenders and frequently, teams ranked outside of the preseason top 8 or 10 end up making it to the BCSNC.
Dec 3, 2010 11:45pm
hoops23's avatar

hoops23

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Dec 3, 2010 11:46 PM
enigmaax;586908 wrote:Couple things...you are talking about the difference between 2-3 contenders and 4-5 contenders in any given season. How many legit contenders were there last year? If you add the Heat, how many are there this year? If some team suddenly pulled Carmelo Anthony and a couple other big time players, how many would there be? "Super Teams" are still increasing the number of legit contenders and that 8-10 pipedream ain't gonna happen either way.

As for ticket sales, 75% of it comes from season ticket holders and the NBA saw a record increase in that department. http://www.sportingnews.com/nba/story/2010-09-28/offseason-frenzy-drives-nba-box-office

And its funny you quote an article about how the Heat "struggle" to sell out when their attendance is up 2000 per game.

The Cavs have sold out every game this season. What's your point? My point is, it won't last.

and up 2,000? LOL.
Dec 3, 2010 11:46pm
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jordo212000

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Dec 3, 2010 11:51 PM
The current situation isn't really all that different than it has been the past few years. There are always 4-5 teams who have a realistic shot of winning the title. Everybody else is a pretender.

Last year:
Lakers
Cavs
Magic
Celtics

Nobody outside of that group had a chance of winning the title last year. Everybody knew who the best teams were

This year we essentially replace the Cavs with the Heat and perhaps add the Thunder to the fray. That's the NBA. That's what it is famous for. Heck the Celtics and Lakers have played in an absurd amount of Finals. And it always does well ratings wise

Casual fan could care less if the Clippers win 13 or 33 games. We want to see good basketball and exicting matchups.
Dec 3, 2010 11:51pm
hoops23's avatar

hoops23

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Dec 3, 2010 11:52 PM
In the NBA, 23 teams are not averaging sell outs. Somehow, ESPN has Miami averaging sell outs in every game, when we see with our own eyes, that's NOT the case.

16 teams average less than 90% capacity.

14 of those teams average less than 85%

8 of those average less then 80%
Dec 3, 2010 11:52pm
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enigmaax

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Dec 3, 2010 11:54 PM
hoops23;586915 wrote:and up 2,000? LOL.

I don't get it.

Their home attendance is 5th in the league, road attendance is 1st, and overall is 1st. The NBA market isn't great to begin, but they're doing better than anyone else and you quote an article about how they are struggling to sell out one game. Hey, if I'm missing something, let me know.
Dec 3, 2010 11:54pm
hoops23's avatar

hoops23

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15,696 posts
Dec 3, 2010 11:54 PM
jordo212000;586918 wrote:The current situation isn't really all that different than it has been the past few years. There are always 4-5 teams who have a realistic shot of winning the title. Everybody else is a pretender.

Last year:
Lakers
Cavs
Magic
Celtics

Nobody outside of that group had a chance of winning the title last year. Everybody knew who the best teams were

This year we essentially replace the Cavs with the Heat and perhaps add the Thunder to the fray. That's the NBA. That's what it is famous for. Heck the Celtics and Lakers have played in an absurd amount of Finals. And it always does well ratings wise

Casual fan could care less if the Clippers win 13 or 33 games. We want to see good basketball and exicting matchups.

This current formula has the NBA steadily losing money and cutting salary cap space. Yeah, fans want to see this product. LOL.

Look, you're a Lebron fan/bandwagon hopper... We get it. You like going from good team to good team because it's "fun" to watch (READ: The pussification of a sports fan)....
Dec 3, 2010 11:54pm
hoops23's avatar

hoops23

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Dec 3, 2010 11:55 PM
enigmaax;586922 wrote:I don't get it.

Their home attendance is 5th in the league, road attendance is 1st, and overall is 1st. The NBA market isn't great to begin, but they're doing better than anyone else and you quote an article about how they are struggling to sell out one game. Hey, if I'm missing something, let me know.

You and I both know they aren't truly 5th in the league. That arena hasn't sold out since opening day. Corporate buy outs don't count as true sell outs in my eyes.
Dec 3, 2010 11:55pm
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jordo212000

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Dec 3, 2010 11:56 PM
hoops23;586924 wrote:This current formula has the NBA steadily losing money and cutting salary cap space. Yeah, fans want to see this product. LOL.

Look, you're a Lebron fan/bandwagon hopper... We get it. You like going from good team to good team because it's "fun" to watch (READ: The pussification of a sports fan)....

Uh I hate Lebron James haha. I have never defended him, you should know that by now. Remember when I used to be a hater because I thought his dancing routine during games was bush league?
Dec 3, 2010 11:56pm
hoops23's avatar

hoops23

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Dec 3, 2010 11:58 PM
jordo212000;586928 wrote:Uh I hate Lebron James haha. I have never defended him, you should know that by now. Remember when I used to be a hater because I thought his dancing routine during games was bush league?

Hmmm. I thought you hopped on his wagon when he left to join Wade and Bosh because "They would be fun to watch"... If you didn't, then my bad, I thought it was you however.
Dec 3, 2010 11:58pm
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jordo212000

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Dec 4, 2010 12:01 AM
I really don't know what else to say. Can a person really be this dense. We realize that not everybody is selling out. haha. That's not the point. The league as a whole is doing much better (see above stats from the Sporting News).

So yes, it is possible that stadiums are only being filled to 90% capacity, but it also possible that being filled to 90% capacity is an improvement from last year.

The NBA is in the shape it is in because they have been handing outlandish contracts to terrible players for years. (Etan Thomas, Darko, Eddy Curry, Desagana Diop, Dampier all come to mind)
Dec 4, 2010 12:01am
jordo212000's avatar

jordo212000

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10,664 posts
Dec 4, 2010 12:02 AM
hoops23;586931 wrote:Hmmm. I thought you hopped on his wagon when he left to join Wade and Bosh because "They would be fun to watch"... If you didn't, then my bad, I thought it was you however.

Nah I have always said that I am a NBA fan who is pretty casual. I like to watch good basketball, I really don't have a preference. Just because I don't like James, doesn't mean I can't respect his game.
Dec 4, 2010 12:02am
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enigmaax

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4,511 posts
Dec 4, 2010 12:03 AM
hoops23;586866 wrote:Why has the NFL become so popular? Parity.
Here's another funny one. In the 80s, 7 out of 10 Super Bowls had 45+ ratings. You know the last three times a Super Bowl has gone over that mark?

Here they are: Dallas in 93, 94, and 96.
Dec 4, 2010 12:03am
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enigmaax

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4,511 posts
Dec 4, 2010 12:11 AM
hoops23;586927 wrote:You and I both know they aren't truly 5th in the league. That arena hasn't sold out since opening day. Corporate buy outs don't count as true sell outs in my eyes.

Sorry, dude...changing the facts doesn't work. You want to take a couple random bullshit generalizations and pass them off as fact and try to make a bigger point. Then say, "Well that doesn't count." You brought up attendance, not me. I'll still refer you to the fact that attendance isn't where the money is made anyway. TV money is where it's at.
Dec 4, 2010 12:11am
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HitsRus

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Dec 4, 2010 12:27 AM
Last year:
Lakers
Cavs
Magic
Celtics

Nobody outside of that group had a chance of winning the title last year. Everybody knew who the best teams were

...and yet the NBA goes thru the sham of 16 teams in the playoffs. How stupid do you have to be to buy a ticket to the first round match up of #1 vs. #8? It's extortion,pure and simple. It's why the NBA needs this kind of drama to sell tickets....nobody gives a shit when the bottom feeders play each other.
Dec 4, 2010 12:27am