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3 bucks a gal for gas is back

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ernest_t_bass's avatar

ernest_t_bass

12th Son of the Lama

24,984 posts
Nov 7, 2010 6:30 PM
Read this write-up. It's hilarious. I think "financial advice" should be added to it. Just because something works for you doesn't mean it will work for someone else, and it doesn't necessarily mean you are "right." However, most people will go to any expense to make sure everyone hears how they did it, and how it "worked" for them.

http://www.cracked.com/article_18853_5-topics-guaranteed-to-elicit-condescending-advice.html
Nov 7, 2010 6:30pm
LJ's avatar

LJ

Senior Member

16,351 posts
Nov 7, 2010 6:32 PM
ernest_t_bass;549262 wrote:No, it doesn't. Your situation isn't the same as others. There are too many variables.

I had $75 bucks per week to eat, buy gas, and buy any incidentals. I was on $115/month of prescriptions meaning I had a little under $50/week for food and gas. I drove a truck that got 12 MPG and used about 6 gallons per week at 3.25. I would budget and shop to strech my money as far as I could and I still would have money to eat well and go out and party
Nov 7, 2010 6:32pm
IggyPride00's avatar

IggyPride00

Senior Member

6,482 posts
Nov 7, 2010 6:37 PM
Nobody forces anyone to live/work somewhere or drive a particular vehicle. They're all trade-offs. Some people want to live in the bigger house, or in the country, or near family, or without a roommate, or whatever else. They get the benefit of that bargain, and I think it's only fair that they get the costs, too. That's how being a grown-up works.
I agree with the sentiment, but when you consider the amount of wildly underwater mortgages there are in this country there is a significant part of the population that actually couldn't afford to move/re-locate if they wanted to. That has been one of the big untold stories of the mortgage collapse (the amount of people literally trapped in their house.

On a broader note I am shocked at the number of people angry about gas/oil going up even in the face of record inventories. How do you guys expect Wallstreet speculators, investment banks and Hedge funds to get by if they aren't allowed to borrow money from the Fed at 0% so they can create commodity bubbles that generate massive profits to pay themselves bonuses with? There are certainly a lot of cruel/heartless people on this board if you ask me.
Nov 7, 2010 6:37pm
F

fan_from_texas

Senior Member

2,693 posts
Nov 7, 2010 6:39 PM
IggyPride00;549273 wrote:I agree with the sentiment, but when you consider the amount of wildly underwater mortgages there are in this country there is a significant part of the population that actually couldn't afford to move/re-locate if they wanted to. That has been one of the big untold stories of the mortgage collapse (the amount of people literally trapped in their house.
This is a good point. Exposure to fuel prices is something that can be managed well upfront (before you buy a home/car), but it's much tougher to do after-the-fact, particularly with many homes underwater. People can still drive less, carpool, take the bus, etc., but their options are much more limited after they've bought a home.
Nov 7, 2010 6:39pm
LJ's avatar

LJ

Senior Member

16,351 posts
Nov 7, 2010 6:58 PM
ernest_t_bass;549269 wrote:Read this write-up. It's hilarious. I think "financial advice" should be added to it. Just because something works for you doesn't mean it will work for someone else, and it doesn't necessarily mean you are "right." However, most people will go to any expense to make sure everyone hears how they did it, and how it "worked" for them.

http://www.cracked.com/article_18853_5-topics-guaranteed-to-elicit-condescending-advice.html

I disagree. It obviously worked for a reason. Numbers have no variables, while all the things in that article do
Nov 7, 2010 6:58pm
ernest_t_bass's avatar

ernest_t_bass

12th Son of the Lama

24,984 posts
Nov 7, 2010 7:40 PM
LJ;549303 wrote:I disagree. It obviously worked for a reason. Numbers have no variables, while all the things in that article do

The variables are the different obstacles in one's life. Example, you had medical expenses that I do not. I have two children, etc. My only issue with this whole argument is the condescending tone from those who say "it's so easy."

I could say I don't think it's very hard to overcome depression, but you may disagree. The more I push my side of it, disregarding your situation, the dumber I sound. You are failing to admit that higher prices (on anything) do, in fact, hurt some people. Every person is not the same.
Nov 7, 2010 7:40pm
Z

Zombaypirate

Senior Member

581 posts
Nov 7, 2010 7:41 PM
I hope gas goes to around $6.00 a gallon. Keep the poor non-insured drivers off the road. Keep the roads a little clearer for me.
Nov 7, 2010 7:41pm
LJ's avatar

LJ

Senior Member

16,351 posts
Nov 7, 2010 7:45 PM
ernest_t_bass;549345 wrote:The variables are the different obstacles in one's life. Example, you had medical expenses that I do not. I have two children, etc. My only issue with this whole argument is the condescending tone from those who say "it's so easy."

I could say I don't think it's very hard to overcome depression, but you may disagree. The more I push my side of it, disregarding your situation, the dumber I sound. You are failing to admit that higher prices (on anything) do, in fact, hurt some people. Every person is not the same.

But numbers do not have variables. A 6 is always a 6 and there are always ways to make that 6 go further than others on things you can control so that those you can't do not hurt you
Nov 7, 2010 7:45pm
ernest_t_bass's avatar

ernest_t_bass

12th Son of the Lama

24,984 posts
Nov 7, 2010 7:50 PM
LJ;549352 wrote:But numbers do not have variables. A 6 is always a 6 and there are always ways to make that 6 go further than others on things you can control so that those you can't do not hurt you

No matter what I say, or anyone else, you won't admit that some people struggle, will you? You are not happy until everyone says your pompous ass is right.
Nov 7, 2010 7:50pm
LJ's avatar

LJ

Senior Member

16,351 posts
Nov 7, 2010 8:03 PM
ernest_t_bass;549361 wrote:No matter what I say, or anyone else, you won't admit that some people struggle, will you? You are not happy until everyone says your pompous ass is right.

Where did I ever admit that some people won't struggle? I am merely saying that with proper budgeting and planning, many of those people don't have to struggle. Do you eat meals out? Do you rent movies? Do you buy clothes not on sale? Many people that struggle do so to live a lifestyle that their salary does not afford them. I am not saying that people cannot enjoy life, but certain things need to be taken care of before doing so.
Nov 7, 2010 8:03pm
ernest_t_bass's avatar

ernest_t_bass

12th Son of the Lama

24,984 posts
Nov 7, 2010 8:14 PM
I actually do very well at budgeting and saving. I save roughly $250 per month in my children's savings. I have my "extra" money going where it needs to go, not on myself. My wife drives 80 miles per day, in another state, out of my daughter's school district. The company moved against her will. Every. Penny. Helps!
Nov 7, 2010 8:14pm
BGFalcons82's avatar

BGFalcons82

Senior Member

2,173 posts
Nov 7, 2010 8:47 PM
LJ - It's kind of interesting watching you and ernest t. going back and forth. Not everyone is the same and not everyone budgets to their needs. But you both make good points. I would reference our state and federal government, but that would be too easy.

I am going to disagree with the premise that gas has only gone up 25 cents per gallon, or 10%. A few months ago, it was in the low $2's...it wasn't unusual to see it in the $2.30 to $2.40 range for several months. I would argue that it's gone up at least $.60 or 25% in the past 4 or 5 months, which kind of throws your whole argument out the window. Also...what makes you think it's going to stop at $3/gallon? With all of these debt purchases by the Fed and our insatiable appetite for spending, I would argue that it's headed for at least $3.50 within the next 6 months. Would that then qualify as a problem for most Americans? Then we'd have another party formed....the Gas is Too Damn High Party. :)
Nov 7, 2010 8:47pm
LJ's avatar

LJ

Senior Member

16,351 posts
Nov 7, 2010 8:54 PM
BGFalcons82;549439 wrote:LJ - It's kind of interesting watching you and ernest t. going back and forth. Not everyone is the same and not everyone budgets to their needs. But you both make good points. I would reference our state and federal government, but that would be too easy.

I am going to disagree with the premise that gas has only gone up 25 cents per gallon, or 10%. A few months ago, it was in the low $2's...it wasn't unusual to see it in the $2.30 to $2.40 range for several months. I would argue that it's gone up at least $.60 or 25% in the past 4 or 5 months, which kind of throws your whole argument out the window. Also...what makes you think it's going to stop at $3/gallon? With all of these debt purchases by the Fed and our insatiable appetite for spending, I would argue that it's headed for at least $3.50 within the next 6 months. Would that then qualify as a problem for most Americans? Then we'd have another party formed....the Gas is Too Damn High Party. :)

Gas has averaged above the 2.60's for over a year and abve 2.75 for over 3 months
Nov 7, 2010 8:54pm
BGFalcons82's avatar

BGFalcons82

Senior Member

2,173 posts
Nov 7, 2010 9:09 PM
LJ;549453 wrote:Gas has averaged above the 2.60's for over a year and abve 2.75 for over 3 months

I use the attached website every now and then to check on prices. You can toy around with it and go back as far as you want - http://www.columbusgasprices.com/retail_price_chart.aspx

Back in June, just 4 short months ago, the average around town was about $2.50. While it goes up and comes back down, it is definitely on the upward trajectory. You can also layout the price of oil on the graph and see how they go together. Your take on oil vs gas price time lag is not true either. Matter of fact, they trace right on top of each other. Go check it out for yourself.
Nov 7, 2010 9:09pm
IggyPride00's avatar

IggyPride00

Senior Member

6,482 posts
Nov 7, 2010 9:11 PM
BGFalcons82;549439 wrote:LJ - It's kind of interesting watching you and ernest t. going back and forth. Not everyone is the same and not everyone budgets to their needs. But you both make good points. I would reference our state and federal government, but that would be too easy.

I am going to disagree with the premise that gas has only gone up 25 cents per gallon, or 10%. A few months ago, it was in the low $2's...it wasn't unusual to see it in the $2.30 to $2.40 range for several months. I would argue that it's gone up at least $.60 or 25% in the past 4 or 5 months, which kind of throws your whole argument out the window. Also...what makes you think it's going to stop at $3/gallon? With all of these debt purchases by the Fed and our insatiable appetite for spending, I would argue that it's headed for at least $3.50 within the next 6 months. Would that then qualify as a problem for most Americans? Then we'd have another party formed....the Gas is Too Damn High Party. :)
Higher gas/oil prices will cut into economic activity, and thus lead to more need for free money from the FED to prop things up.

These guys (TBTF banks, Hedge Funds and such) have an incentive to keep unemployment high and asset bubbles growing, because it keeps the free punch bowl from the FED around and constantly refilled.

What is their reward for lending out money in a way that grows the economy and is productive for main street? There isn't one. All it does is take away access to the free money, loan guarantees, FED purchase of toxic assets and all the other free handouts they get because of the economic situation being what it is.

They've got the best of all worlds now. They have access to free money, and make are making it back hand over fist through a new series of bubbles they are creating. Since they have essentially detached themselves from the real economy, they are insulated from all of the misery and stagnation going on out there, but on the flip side are in line for continual financial windfalls because of it because the policy makers in government and at the FED are too stupid to realize (or just don't care) how the system is being gamed/rigged.
Nov 7, 2010 9:11pm
LJ's avatar

LJ

Senior Member

16,351 posts
Nov 7, 2010 9:14 PM
BGFalcons82;549475 wrote:I use the attached website every now and then to check on prices. You can toy around with it and go back as far as you want - http://www.columbusgasprices.com/retail_price_chart.aspx

Back in June, just 4 short months ago, the average around town was about $2.50. While it goes up and comes back down, it is definitely on the upward trajectory. You can also layout the price of oil on the graph and see how they go together. Your take on oil vs gas price time lag is not true either. Matter of fact, they trace right on top of each other. Go check it out for yourself.

I use EIA.Gov

and the lag is true because, well it's reality and well, I work in the industry. They trace because of trending, it is not a real time issue because well, it's impossible. Oil trading right now will not hit your gas tank until Jan.
Nov 7, 2010 9:14pm
LJ's avatar

LJ

Senior Member

16,351 posts
Nov 7, 2010 9:17 PM
using your website you can see the reality of the lag without trending between 7/08 and 10/08 and 3/09 and 5/09
Nov 7, 2010 9:17pm
HitsRus's avatar

HitsRus

Senior Member

9,206 posts
Nov 7, 2010 9:25 PM
That's all well and good, but that approaching $90 is for oil delivered in december and will hit the gasoline market in Jan. Has nothing to do with the gas price on Nov 7th

which means we can expect it to go even higher in January as the Treasury continues to spend like a drunken sailor.

In all fairness, a cheaper dollar makes American exports more attractive to foreigners, as well as boosts tourism. Truly a double edged sword.

This topic is about gasoline prices here in the U.S....so yes, as we continue to cheapen our currency by huge deficit spending...the price of commodities is going to go up.
Nov 7, 2010 9:25pm
BGFalcons82's avatar

BGFalcons82

Senior Member

2,173 posts
Nov 7, 2010 9:26 PM
LJ;549489 wrote:I use EIA.Gov

and the lag is true because, well it's reality and well, I work in the industry. They trace because of trending, it is not a real time issue because well, it's impossible. Oil trading right now will not hit your gas tank until Jan.

If you are in the industry, then you know more than I. However, I'm very sure that retailers are charged for their next tankful of gas based on the current price of refining it, not what they are currently paying. In other words, last in-first out. In my industry, we are paid 45 to 60 days out after putting work in place, so we are always in a lag. Gas retailers charge what they think they will pay for their next fill-up from the refinery, not what they paid for what is in the ground.
Nov 7, 2010 9:26pm
LJ's avatar

LJ

Senior Member

16,351 posts
Nov 7, 2010 9:27 PM
HitsRus;549511 wrote:which means we can expect it to go even higher in January as the Treasury continues to spend like a drunken sailor.

I expect prices to level off and hold steady as we go through the winter. The actual price of gas is set to drop soon as well as the switch to winter blend is made. As I said before, our price jump here is a regional issue and will correct itself shortly. Some retailers like Kroger and such are eating the cost of the jump this weekend and are hedging their bets on prices being lower in the coming weeks.
Nov 7, 2010 9:27pm
LJ's avatar

LJ

Senior Member

16,351 posts
Nov 7, 2010 9:29 PM
BGFalcons82;549513 wrote:If you are in the industry, then you know more than I. However, I'm very sure that retailers are charged for their next tankful of gas based on the current price of refining it, not what they are currently paying. In other words, last in-first out. In my industry, we are paid 45 to 60 days out after putting work in place, so we are always in a lag. Gas retailers charge what they think they will pay for their next fill-up from the refinery, not what they paid for what is in the ground.

Yes, but that is not what I am referring to. The price of oil you see on the market, is oil that will be delivered to refineries in the month of December. That oil will not be refined until later December and delivered to stations until Jan. You are talking about retailers setting the price based on the delivery set to come in 3 days, not what is coming in 2 months.
Nov 7, 2010 9:29pm
BGFalcons82's avatar

BGFalcons82

Senior Member

2,173 posts
Nov 7, 2010 9:32 PM
LJ;549516 wrote:I expect prices to level off and hold steady as we go through the winter. The actual price of gas is set to drop soon as well as the switch to winter blend is made. As I said before, our price jump here is a regional issue and will correct itself shortly. Some retailers like Kroger and such are eating the cost of the jump this weekend and are hedging their bets on prices being lower in the coming weeks.

I hope you are right, but from what I'm reading...and so is hitsrus, the price of all commodities has to rise because our dollar is now worth less than squat....and falling. Speculators took it to our pain threshold a couple years ago, so they know where to go to find salvation. I pray we don't go there, but it really is out of anyone's control.
Nov 7, 2010 9:32pm
J

jmog

Senior Member

6,567 posts
Nov 7, 2010 9:37 PM
fan_from_texas;548020 wrote:$3 gas? Great! Who cares? How much of your overall budget does gas make up? We spend somewhere on the order of 1% of our budget on gas each month. I can't imagine gas prices make a huge difference for most people when it actually comes down to it.

I can honestly say I spend about 5% of my bring home income on gas for our 2 cars. Of course I choose to drive 35 miles each way to work, and while I drive a 35 mpg car, it still adds up.

That 5% is at $3/gal, and it doesn't change much percentage wise at $2.5/gal.
Nov 7, 2010 9:37pm
J

jmog

Senior Member

6,567 posts
Nov 7, 2010 9:52 PM
One thing that has been said on here that rings true. A proper budget for anyone/any family is key to having varying gas prices not be HUGE to you.

This has nothing to do with how much you make. I've had times when I was making less than 20k and budgetted very well and had plenty of money each month.

I've also had times where I was an idiot, made over 70k and couldn't make ends meet.

I'm sorry, but if you are budgeting your income/expenses well, a 10-20% change in gas prices should not throw a huge wrench into your life. Do we like spending the extra couple dollars a week? Of course not, but it won't make us start going to our credit cards.

But hey, I'm a huge Dave Ramsey's budget/debt snowball guy, so what do I know ;).
Nov 7, 2010 9:52pm
sleeper's avatar

sleeper

Legend

27,879 posts
Nov 7, 2010 10:00 PM
I don't really care about the price of gas.
Nov 7, 2010 10:00pm