Alright folk, the biggest game of the year thus far. What are your thoughts? Who wins this game? If Boise wins, beat Oregon State in a few weeks, and finishes the season undefeated and in convincing fashion, will they play for the National Championship?

Personally, I'm wearing my BSU jersey today and will be cheering hard for the Broncos tonight! My parents moved to Idaho three years ago so I've become a bit of a BSU fan since then. I think that with their schedule if they are the only undefeated team or one of only two undefeated teams at the end of the year that they'll stand a very good chance of making it to the National Championship Game. My hope is that they end up making it there and that they're playing the Buckeyes, because I know I'll definitely be going to the game if that happens. Tonight I'll take the Broncos, but by a TD or less.

Interesting, no choice of a VT win by more than 7?

I'm in the camp that feels feels Cinderella needs bitch slapped back to reality. The last thing I want to hear about all season long is how good Boise State looks hanging 40+ on the likes of this turrible schedule...

Wyoming at Laramie, WY 6:00 pm
CBS College Sports
Sat, Sep 25 Oregon State Bronco Stadium TBA
ABC/ESPN
Live Stats
Sat, Oct 02 New Mexico State * at Las Cruces, NM 6:00 pm

Sat, Oct 09 Toledo Bronco Stadium 6:00 pm
Live Stats
Sat, Oct 16 San Jose State * at San Jose, CA 6:00 pm

Tue, Oct 26 Louisiana Tech * Bronco Stadium 6:00 pm
ESPN 2
Live Stats
Sat, Nov 06 Hawai'i * Bronco Stadium Noon
Live Stats
Fri, Nov 12 Idaho * at Moscow, ID 7:00 pm
ESPN 2
Fri, Nov 19 Fresno State * Bronco Stadium 7:30 pm
ESPN 2
Live Stats
Fri, Nov 26 Nevada * at Reno, NV 8:15 pm
ESPN2
Sat, Dec 04 Utah State *


VT by a lot...

Those teams are no worse than Indiana, Minnesota, and Northwestern.

LOL...that's bullshit ...and you know it.

Point is there are (0) ZERO that are as good as Ohio State, Iowa, Wisconsin or even Penn State.

Good try though.

ytownfootball;473019 wrote:Interesting, no choice of a VT win by more than 7?

Crap! Obviously that second choice should read "VT by more than 7." I tried to edit it, but it will only let me edit my post and the thread title, but not the poll. If a mod would be so kind as to fix my mistake, that would be peachy!

Ha...I knew that but thought maybe you could fix it.

Those 3rd and 4th choices are going to confuse several huddlers after they have a few beers at cookouts today. Have Labor Day everyone.

ytownfootball;473019 wrote: I'm in the camp that feels feels Cinderella needs bitch slapped back to reality. The last thing I want to hear about all season long is how good Boise State looks hanging 40+ on the likes of this turrible schedule...

Hate Virginia Tech, but hope they win this for the exact reason quoted above. Underdogs are fun when they know their role. Don't pull a couple upsets over five seasons and then start bitching about how you don't get your due. Step up to the plate consistently and you'll earn your spot - kudos to Utah and BYU for getting this. I actually really like watching Boise State play, but I'm more tired of this bullshit argument, so hopefully they get the shit kicked out of them tonight.

ManO'War;473025 wrote:Those teams are no worse than Indiana, Minnesota, and Northwestern.

Yes, they are. Much worse, aside from the huge difference between playing three creampuffs and ten.

As much as this hurts me to say I hope Va Tech wins, can't stand them.

I'm heading to the game tonight and am stoked. I have my Boise shirt and my buddy and I will definitely be outnumbered. I can't stand VT and am a Maryland grad, so its a natural hatred.
I see Boise winning by a FG or less. The noise will definitely be a factor for them, and VT's defense will be more than ready. But, I think Moore and the Boise offense can just do enough to win. VT's Taylor should have a great game as well.

I expect a shootout in the mid 30s, with Boise winning it late.
Final: Boise-35, VT-32

Boise State goes out and plays one of the big boys in the first week of the season and you still have people busting their balls. They're trying to beef up the schedule, but few powerhouses are willing to do it. Just think back to that article published last year... Boise was trying to get somebody to play them (they were willing to even travel to play somebody) but everybody just ignored them

The big conferences have realized that if you refuse to play Boise, Boise won't get any marquee wins and in turn won't get any respect, and because of that they will never make the championship when comparable teams are sitting there beside of them.

OR

If you play Boise you may get beat, your season will get short circuited, and they will might steal somebody's spot down the road during the BCS.

^^^That's all fine and good, but it does nothing to change the fact that a gang of wins against their schedule does nothing to warrant a trip to the ship.

Trying to beef up the schedule doesn't actually count for shit, I "try" to win the lottery too, seems to be working out the same for both of us.

jordo212000;473096 wrote: Boise State goes out and plays one of the big boys in the first week of the season and you still have people busting their balls.

I think its great they are playing this type of game. But this year and in past years, it is still only one game. Basically, they play a two game schedule and if they win those two games, they (or others who are blinded by this underdog sob story) expect to be rewarded with a title game. Their season is pretty much over before October. There isn't a top team in the country that wouldn't go undefeated against the WAC year in and year out. So sorry, not buying. Didn't before, won't now.

jordo212000;473096 wrote:They're trying to beef up the schedule, but few powerhouses are willing to do it. Just think back to that article published last year... Boise was trying to get somebody to play them (they were willing to even travel to play somebody) but everybody just ignored them

The big conferences have realized that if you refuse to play Boise, Boise won't get any marquee wins and in turn won't get any respect, and because of that they will never make the championship when comparable teams are sitting there beside of them.

OR

If you play Boise you may get beat, your season will get short circuited, and they will might steal somebody's spot down the road during the BCS.

I'm still interested to see this list of who they asked, who declined, and what the reason was. I wouldn't expect a team to drop everything just so Boise State can get one more game against decent competition. It is easy to say everything you said, but it doesn't make it a fact.

BYU seems to be willing to take the risk of going independent and Utah is moving to a BCS conference. These were both options that were pointed out over the last few years as steps toward "proving" yourself. Until one of those things happens, Boise is going to get the same cricticism - there are too many other teams that play Boise's "big challenge" several weeks a year.

So, like I said, I just hope we end all the nonsense tonight.

Also, I don't know if anyone has ever answered this. If Boise loses tonight and ends up as one of say, five teams that finish with one loss (the others being BCS schools), would they still deserve consideration for a national title shot?

enigmaax;473131 wrote:
Also, I don't know if anyone has ever answered this. If Boise loses tonight and ends up as one of say, five teams that finish with one loss (the others being BCS schools), would they still deserve consideration for a national title shot?

I think you know my answer, but I'd go one better and say they shouldn't get it undefeated and all others with one loss imo


edit: And before anyone comes on here and says "they have been ranked third from the begining of the season...yada, yada, yada..."

Let's get this out of the way...they should never be ranked third to begin with, they don't play a schedule that allows any kind of judgment to be rendered by seasons end.

ytownfootball;473118 wrote:^^^That's all fine and good, but it does nothing to change the fact that a gang of wins against their schedule does nothing to warrant a trip to the ship.

Trying to beef up the schedule doesn't actually count for shit, I "try" to win the lottery too, seems to be working out the same for both of us.

Strength of schedule is the biggest load of crap! The quality of teams on a team's schedule does not determine how good that team is. That team determines how good they are. If you took Alabama and had them play Boise's schedule, no one would complain about Bama being ranked #1, regardless of the schedule, because they would be judged on who they are, not who they play.

Boise has also done everything they could do to play a tougher schedule. They can't help the fact that they have improved their football program while few others in their conferences have. Besides, Boise State schedule a game against Virginia Tech AND Oregon State this year, they have said repeatedly that they will play anyone, anywhere, anytime. They are willing to do a single game series and not require a return trip. The problem is that Boise is actually good enough that most major teams are afraid to play them because it's a lose-lose (they could either actually lose, or not get any credit for winning since it was against Boise State). Also, in recent years Boise State has defeated Pac-10 Oregon at home in 2009 (and held an offense that averaged 36 ppg to just 8 points), #17 Oregon in Eugene in 2008, Oregon State (by 4 TD's) in 2006, and Oklahoma in the Fiesta Bowl. They are 2-0 on BCS bowl games. Since 2006 Boise State is 4-1 against teams from BCS conferences. They have played the "big boys" as often as possible, and they have won.

Also, don't give me the crap about Utah and BYU. Utah joined the Pac-10 because they were INVITED. And the only reason BYU can afford to go independent is because they have the money of the LDS church backing them. Boise financially could not go independent and they can only join a "big boy" conference if invited.

As far as their 2010 schedule goes, it's no cake walk. They open the season on a Monday night in prime time, going across the country, playing in a neutral site that's anything but neutral, against a team that's one of the favorites to win their conference that's the #6 ranked team in the country. The play Oregon State who, yes, lost to TCU on Saturday, but who is still one of the favorites to win the Pac-10 after being the runner-up in their conference last year. They play a Hawaii team that just put up 36 against USC, a Fresno State team that just beat the defending Big East champions by two touchdowns. And they finish the year against a Utah State team that nearly beat Oklahoma in Norman this weekend. This is not VT and 11 cupcakes.

Boise State certainly doesn't have the depth that other top teams have. However, their starting lineup is as good as any in the country.

It's time that people start admitting that Boise State is a good team and that they are here to stay. They have earned the right to compete for a National Championship.

No...Alabama gets respect by defeating who they defeat, not LATech, Toledo and Idaho.

We disagree about whether Boise has "arrived" as of yet, a couple marquee wins in the last few years isn't enough to convince me. Get the shit kicked out of you week to week and sustain the same injuries as "the Big Boys" and still win then we'll talk.

ytownfootball;473138 wrote:I think you know my answer, but I'd go one better and say they shouldn't get it undefeated and all others with one loss imo


edit: And before anyone comes on here and says "they have been ranked third from the begining of the season...yada, yada, yada..."

Let's get this out of the way...they should never be ranked third to begin with, they don't play a schedule that allows any kind of judgment to be rendered by seasons end.

Agreed on all counts. The point being, nobody is going to say they deserve it if they lose tonight. So why would that one game make a difference if they win. The whole season doesn't hinge on one game for anyone else.

enigmaax;473131 wrote:BYU seems to be willing to take the risk of going independent and Utah is moving to a BCS conference. These were both options that were pointed out over the last few years as steps toward "proving" yourself. Until one of those things happens, Boise is going to get the same cricticism - there are too many other teams that play Boise's "big challenge" several weeks a year.

First off, to enter a conference you have to get an invite. I'm willing to bet that Boise's AD would give his left nut to be in the Pac-10. However, because Boise is basically only good at football and because they are in a tiny market, nobody wants them. They're not attractive in the expansion game because let's be honest at the end of the day it is about eye balls on the tv screen.

Second, who says what BYU did was smart? Who knows if it will payoff? Boise struggles to schedule now, what happens when they have to schedule 12 games? What about other sports? Which conference would they get into? They already burned their bridge with the WAC. The WCC (where BYU joined) is a conference for religion affiliated schools. Boise doesn't fit there either.

Big conferences do play the better schedule. I'm not going to argue that. However, I'm not sure many of them are all that much better. SEC schools turn around and schedule plenty of garbage on their schedule as well. And let's be honest of these "power conferences" only 3-4 schools are actually worth anything.

krambman;473146 wrote: Strength of schedule is the biggest load of crap! The quality of teams on a team's schedule does not determine how good that team is. That team determines how good they are. If you took Alabama and had them play Boise's schedule, no one would complain about Bama being ranked #1, regardless of the schedule, because they would be judged on who they are, not who they play.

As far as their 2010 schedule goes, it's no cake walk. They open the season on a Monday night in prime time, going across the country, playing in a neutral site that's anything but neutral, against a team that's one of the favorites to win their conference that's the #6 ranked team in the country. The play Oregon State who, yes, lost to TCU on Saturday, but who is still one of the favorites to win the Pac-10 after being the runner-up in their conference last year. They play a Hawaii team that just put up 36 against USC, a Fresno State team that just beat the defending Big East champions by two touchdowns. And they finish the year against a Utah State team that nearly beat Oklahoma in Norman this weekend. This is not VT and 11 cupcakes.

I disagree. The top BCS teams have their OOC schedules scrutinized all the time. They all get knocked for scheduling two or three lightweights. If Alabama played Utah State, Fresno State, and Hawaii you would NOT be talking about how good their schedule is. And even if you put Boise in the small class of elite programs...and most other things are equal...you HAVE to have some way of separating them. And that gets back to who has proven themeselves week-in and week-out. Because Boise has a lower standard and a lesser schedule, you are finding ways to justify them that you would not apply to anyone else. Strength of schedule is a tough one in most cases, but not for Boise because they don't play anything like what the other top schools do. Sorry, that is what eliminates them from the conversation.

krambman;473146 wrote: Boise has also done everything they could do to play a tougher schedule. They can't help the fact that they have improved their football program while few others in their conferences have. Besides, Boise State schedule a game against Virginia Tech AND Oregon State this year, they have said repeatedly that they will play anyone, anywhere, anytime. They are willing to do a single game series and not require a return trip. The problem is that Boise is actually good enough that most major teams are afraid to play them because it's a lose-lose (they could either actually lose, or not get any credit for winning since it was against Boise State). Also, in recent years Boise State has defeated Pac-10 Oregon at home in 2009 (and held an offense that averaged 36 ppg to just 8 points), #17 Oregon in Eugene in 2008, Oregon State (by 4 TD's) in 2006, and Oklahoma in the Fiesta Bowl. They are 2-0 on BCS bowl games. Since 2006 Boise State is 4-1 against teams from BCS conferences. They have played the "big boys" as often as possible, and they have won.

Also, don't give me the crap about Utah and BYU. Utah joined the Pac-10 because they were INVITED. And the only reason BYU can afford to go independent is because they have the money of the LDS church backing them. Boise financially could not go independent and they can only join a "big boy" conference if invited.

So now it is the rest of the country's problem that Boise State has outgrown their conference but hasn't taken the appropriate steps to completely upgrade their schedule. Life is tough sometimes. It doesn't change the fact that they are where they are at the moment...and it isn't good enough to be elite right now.

The other thing is that you are talking about Boise being 4-1 recently. Okay, Texas and Texas Tech were 11-1 a few years ago and that wasn't good enough. Michigan was 11-1 a couple years ago and that wasn't good enough. Boise State hasn't even played as many games against reasonable competition in FIVE years that those teams beat in a single season. And they lost to a horrible Washington team in the meantime. And they're something like 6-17 overall against BCS teams in the last decade. Once again, it is easy to pick and choose a few games here and there, but you wouldn't do that for any other team. Boise is a solid mid-level program and a fun story. That is as far as it goes.

enigmaax;473166 wrote:Agreed on all counts. The point being, nobody is going to say they deserve it if they lose tonight. So why would that one game make a difference if they win. The whole season doesn't hinge on one game for anyone else.

Yep...only two things are going to get Boise State off the schnide as far as I'm concerned, an exponentially tougher schedule, which would mean a conference change or a play-off system, neither which I foresee happening near future.

jordo212000;473179 wrote:First off, to enter a conference you have to get an invite. I'm willing to bet that Boise's AD would give his left nut to be in the Pac-10. However, because Boise is basically only good at football and because they are in a tiny market, nobody wants them. They're not attractive in the expansion game because let's be honest at the end of the day it is about eye balls on the tv screen.

Second, who says what BYU did was smart? Who knows if it will payoff? Boise struggles to schedule now, what happens when they have to schedule 12 games? What about other sports? Which conference would they get into? They already burned their bridge with the WAC. The WCC (where BYU joined) is a conference for religion affiliated schools. Boise doesn't fit there either.

Big conferences do play the better schedule. I'm not going to argue that. However, I'm not sure many of them are all that much better. SEC schools turn around and schedule plenty of garbage on their schedule as well. And let's be honest of these "power conferences" only 3-4 schools are actually worth anything.

Your points:
1. That isn't the rest of the country's problem. It isn't like there is some big conspiracy against Boise State. If they aren't good enough, they aren't good enough. And that is exactly the point. Enjoy what you are, but don't pretend or expect people to treat you like something you aren't (a title contender).

2. One of two things is going to happen to BYU. They are either going to be exposed or they are going to earn their spot. But we'll know based on their results, not what we think they might do if everyone didn't treat them unfairly and since they won a couple big games here and there.

3. But even those BCS bottom dwellers beat the WAC schools FAR more than they lose. Here's another one that I ask that rarely gets any takers. If Vanderbilt left the SEC and joined the Sun Belt...then went undefeated with their big win being over Tennessee...would you say they deserve a shot at the national title in that season? For that matter, what if Florida did the same thing? People would talk about how they sold out, played the system, etc.

Boise State came out of nowhere and people are willing to give them benefit of doubt. TCU (another school that is bound to come up in this debate) failed miserably for 40 years at the highest level and most people don't remember that now. It is a simple matter of the underdog getting too big for its britches and people naturally wanting to see something out of the ordinary. You wouldn't think the same way about any school who put themselves in the same position by stepping down a level.

Fresno State a couple years ago...

enigmaax;473194 wrote:Your points:
1. That isn't the rest of the country's problem. It isn't like there is some big conspiracy against Boise State. If they aren't good enough, they aren't good enough. And that is exactly the point. Enjoy what you are, but don't pretend or expect people to treat you like something you aren't (a title contender).

2. One of two things is going to happen to BYU. They are either going to be exposed or they are going to earn their spot. But we'll know based on their results, not what we think they might do if everyone didn't treat them unfairly and since they won a couple big games here and there.

3. But even those BCS bottom dwellers beat the WAC schools FAR more than they lose. Here's another one that I ask that rarely gets any takers. If Vanderbilt left the SEC and joined the Sun Belt...then went undefeated with their big win being over Tennessee...would you say they deserve a shot at the national title in that season? For that matter, what if Florida did the same thing? People would talk about how they sold out, played the system, etc.

Boise State came out of nowhere and people are willing to give them benefit of doubt. TCU (another school that is bound to come up in this debate) failed miserably for 40 years at the highest level and most people don't remember that now. It is a simple matter of the underdog getting too big for its britches and people naturally wanting to see something out of the ordinary. You wouldn't think the same way about any school who put themselves in the same position by stepping down a level.

1. I would say that there is something very close to a conspiracy happening in college football. The current system was created by the power conferences and as a result it benefits the power conferences. For the little guys to get into the BCS they have to play a tough schedule AND go undefeated AND look good doing it. The catch 22 is that because they cannot gain access to one of these power conferences because the schools location isn't sexy enough they must beef up their schedule. However few of these power teams are willing to play the Boises and BYUs. Thus creating the pseudo conspiracy.

2. True, we will see what happens to BYU. Maybe Boise will follow suit down the road. My point remains the same though. Boise has problems scheduling 4 games with anybody of importance. What happens when they leave? They'll have ticked off the conference they are currently in (maybe those schools will blackball them and refuse to play them) and the big boys who refuse to play them will probably continue to do so.

3. I think it is obvious at this point that TCU and Boise State are exceptions. No longer can anybody honestly say that they are a creation of a week schedule. They have talent and both squads are well coached. They can beat anybody any week. Let's stop pretending that it is 2001. These teams are for real. Heck both Boise State and TCU had guys go in the 1st round of the draft this year. Our favorite team Ohio State can't even say that anybody go in the 1st three rounds this past year.

3a. What does 40 years ago have anything to with right now. Army used to be a power program? Are they now? Who cares? Look at Notre Dame. Kids today could give a crap less about "tradition" Most kids in college now don't even remember a time when Notre Dame was a power. Today's college athlete is very familiar with Boise State's recent track record and it is evidenced by the talent they have there

enigmaax;473180 wrote: So now it is the rest of the country's problem that Boise State has outgrown their conference but hasn't taken the appropriate steps to completely upgrade their schedule. Life is tough sometimes. It doesn't change the fact that they are where they are at the moment...and it isn't good enough to be elite right now.

The other thing is that you are talking about Boise being 4-1 recently. Okay, Texas and Texas Tech were 11-1 a few years ago and that wasn't good enough. Michigan was 11-1 a couple years ago and that wasn't good enough. Boise State hasn't even played as many games against reasonable competition in FIVE years that those teams beat in a single season. And they lost to a horrible Washington team in the meantime. And they're something like 6-17 overall against BCS teams in the last decade. Once again, it is easy to pick and choose a few games here and there, but you wouldn't do that for any other team. Boise is a solid mid-level program and a fun story. That is as far as it goes.

You are doing it right now. Schools like Texas, Tx Tech, and Michigan only play a handful (maybe 3 to 4 games) of teams that would be considered to be good competition. The rest is made up of mediocre to bad BCS conference teams with a few OOC opponents sprinkled in that are basically paid to walk in to the Ann Arbor or Austin, take their lumps, and leave. For example, Texas is able to sleepwalk through its schedule outside of games against Oklahoma, whoever is having a good year out of Tx A&M, Tx Tech, and Oklahoma State, and if they are unlucky, they have to play a decent B12 North team. Big 12 Conference championship game may be good competition, although there are some years where the B12 North is an absolute joke. Why does an undefeated Texas team this year deserve a shot at the NC game over an undefeated Boise State team this year? If both run the table, looking at Texas schedule, the only wins I would count as really quality wins are those against OU (who struggled against Utah State, btw) and Nebraska and whoever they play in the ccg (probably Nebraska again). Meanwhile Boise would have to beat Va Tech and Oregon State, two upper tier BCS conference teams. I don't care if the Baylor team that Texas clobbers is slightly better than the New Mexico State team that Boise State clobbers or if the Texas Tech team that Texas blows out would beat San Jose State by 3 touchdowns and finish 3rd in the WAC as long as Boise takes care of business and beats San Jose State by 4 touchdowns. BSU would deserve a shot just as much as Texas in my book. Sure, BSU's schedule isn't exactly tough and is not as tough as those of most of the BCS conference teams. I'm not gonna argue that. But lets not make it out like Texas and Michigan go 11-1 playing against teams that are ranked 1 through 12.

I have Va Tech by 7 or less, but wouldn't bet on it.