SportsAndLady;456950 wrote:The 31st pick in the draft (or whatever pick they have) means essentially nothing. If you're going to argue that the picks the Cavs got from the Heat for Lebron S&T weren't valuable, then you can't say that pick to the Wiz is.

It's still a draft pick. And guys that late are cheap. The picks they got back for Lebron have some value, but obviously they probably wanted more, but Miami just didn't have anything else to offer. You take what you can get in that situation.

As for the pick they traded away this year, the Wizards drafted Lazar Hayward. Daniel Orton went 1 pick ahead and two of the first picks in the second round were Dexter Pittman and Hassan Whiteside. Not saying any of those 4 are franchise players, but they bring some youth to build around. Again hindsight is 20/20 now, but with the current situation of the franchise, I would rather the Cavs have Whiteside or Hayward and start to rebuild now while setting themselves up for a high pick next year, rather than staying semi-competitive for another year.

But then again, I can see where some would disagree with that. Many Cavs fans might be happy with a playoff team, and it might bring more in terms of attendance, so maybe that's your goal.

You're failing to mention the trade value asset that Jamison brings. In a year he will be cap relief for a team, and a nice trading piece. That alone is worth more than the 30th pick in the draft. You have to be able to view these things from more than one angle which most people who disagree with you, aka not a dumbass, can do. Again like I have stated many times, you dont know what youre talking about when it comes to the NBA.

ernest_t_bass;456932 wrote:Seriously, man. By saying this, you just DID address him. You are just adding fuel to the fire.

+1

I remember when i was 10 years old.

Gilbert should have pulled a dick move during the sign and trade process.

Re-sign LeBron, then not trade him. Would never work, but would be pretty funny.

He's still a douche... GQ magazine? really?

hmm.. thedynasty seems to be right here.. just because more ppl think you're wrong doesn't make you wrong.. he's just saying the article isn't credible because its got simple mistakes..

thedynasty had to start a new username to agree with his own posts lol

SportsAndLady;457148 wrote:thedynasty had to start a new username to agree with his own posts lol

+1 lol.

Commander of Awesome;456999 wrote:You're failing to mention the trade value asset that Jamison brings. In a year he will be cap relief for a team, and a nice trading piece. That alone is worth more than the 30th pick in the draft. You have to be able to view these things from more than one angle which most people who disagree with you, aka not a dumbass, can do. Again like I have stated many times, you dont know what youre talking about when it comes to the NBA.

This is absolutely true....I cannot believe that people thought the Jamison deal was not a good one. They got a player for nothing and then can have a real trade asset in a year.

SportsAndLady;456950 wrote:The 31st pick in the draft (or whatever pick they have) means essentially nothing. If you're going to argue that the picks the Cavs got from the Heat for Lebron S&T weren't valuable, then you can't say that pick to the Wiz is.

Come on dude. A 1st round pick certainly isn't "nothing". That pick could have been used as a bargaining chip or they may have even drafted a solid player in that spot.

Jamison is going to score 14 ppg on a bad team this season, just like he has always done. However, the worst part of all this is that he makes a crap ton of money. The move was short-sighted and it was a desperation move. There's no defending it. Hindsight is 20-20 but when you are rebuilding (the Cavs are, despite what fans may think) you can use every single pick you get. Maybe the Cavs can move him this season, but will teams remember his gag job from this past season?

I can identify with dynasty. I was one of the other guys who wanted to talk NBA basketball on here. But a lot of times that was impossible in threads that dealt with Cavalier fans. Every thread was either a suck off session of Lebron or it was a thread devoted to laughing at other teams/cities who thought Lebron might play for them.

jordo212000;457219 wrote:Come on dude. A 1st round pick certainly isn't "nothing". That pick could have been used as a bargaining chip or they may have even drafted a solid player in that spot.

Jamison is going to score 14 ppg on a bad team this season, just like he has always done. However, the worst part of all this is that he makes a crap ton of money. The move was short-sighted and it was a desperation move. There's no defending it. Hindsight is 20-20 but when you are rebuilding (the Cavs are, despite what fans may think) you can use every single pick you get. Maybe the Cavs can move him this season, but will teams remember his gag job from this past season?

I can identify with dynasty. I was one of the other guys who wanted to talk NBA basketball on here. But a lot of times that was impossible in threads that dealt with Cavalier fans. Every thread was either a suck off session of Lebron or it was a thread devoted to laughing at other teams/cities who thought Lebron might play for them.

Finally some common sense brought to this discussion.

Ask Dan Gilbert today if he could take back the Jamison trade, and he absolutely does it. Hell, even during the season Cavs fans were saying that it's a bad trade unless he is the piece to put them over the top. He wasn't and now people want to defend it? So, in two years when he's an expiring, they get what for him? A young player with some promise. That's what is traded for expirings often times. Like I said, he is just delaying the rebuilding process.

There are some really good posters on here that like to add to a discussion, but it's the few that only have input such as, "lol" "+1" or "pwned" who make threads really frustrating to read at times.

Back on topic...that he even does interviews like this shows you the immaturity and ego involved -- and the horrid advice he continues to get from his crew.

thedynasty1998;456899 wrote:What exactly is my posting history? That Cavs fans have acted delusional over the last year? I said a year ago Lebron was leaving, and everyone criticized me. I said the Jamison trade was terrible, and everyone criticized me. I said they wouldn't win the championship, everyone criticized me. I said once again Lebron would leave, everyone criticized me. I said Gilbert acted like a teenage girl, everyone criticized me. I said Cavs fans were delusional about bringing in Bosh/Paul, everyone criticized me. I said Grant is a bad GM, everyone criticized me. I said the Cavs wouldn't move into the first round, everyone criticized me.

Those are all things that I've stated an opinion on that is different than the majority on here, and people don't like it. But I'm not sure where that leaves me with little credibility, or where exactly I've been wrong?

there's a lot here, so i guess we'll go in chronological order.

1) don't post enough to know your posting history
2) cav fans may have acted delusional but i think every fanbase would act delusional if the superstar kept telling everyone how committed he was to winning a championship in cleveland
3) i wouldn't exactly use the "i called lebron is leaving" card. hell people have been saying lebron was leaving before he even played a game and it only intensified when he signed the three year contract. i think most cavs fans believed lebron would go through the whole dog and pony show in the summer of 2010 only to re-up because his goal of a championship in cleveland wasn't satisfied. hell most reporters believed lebron was re-upping after the six interviews were concluded up until that wednesday when dwade and bosh signed in miami.
4) in hindsight the jamison may have been bad, but any gm in the league would have traded an expiring contract and a first round pick for someone who was averaging nearly 20/10. did it work out? no, but i think that can be blamed on mike brown's incompetence more than anything.
5) saying a cleveland team wouldn't win a championship doesn't deserve a cookie. sure the cavs had a great shot at a championship but most recognized that it would be no cakewalk getting through orlando and los angeles. did we underestimate boston? of course but the whole world underestimated boston (celtic fans included)
6) i already touched on this but after the series of interviews, most believed lebron was coming back. chicago had kind of faded, the knicks and nets hadn't done enough to improve their respective teams (amare aside) and no one believed lebron would crucify his legacy to join dwade and bosh in miami. even after it happened (and still today), people are still in shock of what happened on july 8.
7) gilbert may have acted immature but his emotional outburst galvanized crest-fallen cavs fans. could it have cost gilbert potential free agents? sure, but it's not cleveland was a hotbed of free agent activity even with lebron.
8) paul was definitely unrealistic but had lebron committed, getting bosh would not have been as an impossible task as perceived. would miami have had a better shot? yes, but not out of the realm of possibility.
9) how is grant a bad gm? he's made one move. we could have just cut delonte but got sessions, hollins and a second round pick instead. is it a great move to make cleveland a championship contender? hardly but a good move regardless because he brought in two guys on respectable contracts
10) moving into the first round isn't the end all be all. dallas did that and it cost them 3 million dollars. gilbert and company did not see potential enough to warrant paying 3 million for

jordo212000;457219 wrote:Come on dude. A 1st round pick certainly isn't "nothing". That pick could have been used as a bargaining chip or they may have even drafted a solid player in that spot.

Jamison is going to score 14 ppg on a bad team this season, just like he has always done. However, the worst part of all this is that he makes a crap ton of money. The move was short-sighted and it was a desperation move. There's no defending it. Hindsight is 20-20 but when you are rebuilding (the Cavs are, despite what fans may think) you can use every single pick you get. Maybe the Cavs can move him this season, but will teams remember his gag job from this past season?

I can identify with dynasty. I was one of the other guys who wanted to talk NBA basketball on here. But a lot of times that was impossible in threads that dealt with Cavalier fans. Every thread was either a suck off session of Lebron or it was a thread devoted to laughing at other teams/cities who thought Lebron might play for them.

Weren't you the one saying the picks they got from the Heat are basically worthless because they're going to be the 32nd pick in the draft every year? I mean honestly, how many really good players are taken with the 32nd pick? It's a true statement, the picks from the Heat, while nice that we got something, are essentially worth a 2nd or 3rd guy off the bench...its no different with the pick they could have saved with the Jamison trade.

oh and it's 20 points a game, not 15.

SportsAndLady;457257 wrote:Weren't you the one saying the picks they got from the Heat are basically worthless because they're going to be the 32nd pick in the draft every year? I mean honestly, how many really good players are taken with the 32nd pick? It's a true statement, the picks from the Heat, while nice that we got something, are essentially worth a 2nd or 3rd guy off the bench...its no different with the pick they could have saved with the Jamison trade.

oh and it's 20 points a game, not 15.

No, I was saying Gilbert was acting foolish by refusing to sign and trade Lebron. The ultimate cutting off your nose to spite your face situation. I took a lot of flak for that. If you are rebuilding you need young guys to roll the dice with. Maybe you'll get lucky and get a nice player? We know what Jamison is. He is a guy who when he is the best player on the team, will lead you to 20-25 wins all while eating a lot of cap.

Well if Jamison is the best player on your team, you're not really expecting a championship...sooooo

SportsAndLady;457264 wrote:Well if Jamison is the best player on your team, you're not really expecting a championship...sooooo

Jamison isn't the best player....this guy is....

dazedconfused;457248 wrote:there's a lot here, so i guess we'll go in chronological order.

1) don't post enough to know your posting history
2) cav fans may have acted delusional but i think every fanbase would act delusional if the superstar kept telling everyone how committed he was to winning a championship in cleveland
3) i wouldn't exactly use the "i called lebron is leaving" card. hell people have been saying lebron was leaving before he even played a game and it only intensified when he signed the three year contract. i think most cavs fans believed lebron would go through the whole dog and pony show in the summer of 2010 only to re-up because his goal of a championship in cleveland wasn't satisfied. hell most reporters believed lebron was re-upping after the six interviews were concluded up until that wednesday when dwade and bosh signed in miami.
4) in hindsight the jamison may have been bad, but any gm in the league would have traded an expiring contract and a first round pick for someone who was averaging nearly 20/10. did it work out? no, but i think that can be blamed on mike brown's incompetence more than anything.
5) saying a cleveland team wouldn't win a championship doesn't deserve a cookie. sure the cavs had a great shot at a championship but most recognized that it would be no cakewalk getting through orlando and los angeles. did we underestimate boston? of course but the whole world underestimated boston (celtic fans included)
6) i already touched on this but after the series of interviews, most believed lebron was coming back. chicago had kind of faded, the knicks and nets hadn't done enough to improve their respective teams (amare aside) and no one believed lebron would crucify his legacy to join dwade and bosh in miami. even after it happened (and still today), people are still in shock of what happened on july 8.
7) gilbert may have acted immature but his emotional outburst galvanized crest-fallen cavs fans. could it have cost gilbert potential free agents? sure, but it's not cleveland was a hotbed of free agent activity even with lebron.
8) paul was definitely unrealistic but had lebron committed, getting bosh would not have been as an impossible task as perceived. would miami have had a better shot? yes, but not out of the realm of possibility.
9) how is grant a bad gm? he's made one move. we could have just cut delonte but got sessions, hollins and a second round pick instead. is it a great move to make cleveland a championship contender? hardly but a good move regardless because he brought in two guys on respectable contracts
10) moving into the first round isn't the end all be all. dallas did that and it cost them 3 million dollars. gilbert and company did not see potential enough to warrant paying 3 million for

I respect your stance on each topic you touched on, and like I said before, I made predictions/opinions on each of the above. Whether everyone agrees with me or not is not my issue. I don't get the people who act childish because someone has a difference viewpoint.

I respect each of your statements above, however some I do not agree with, however I'm not going to call you an idiot.

Writerbuckeye;457244 wrote:Back on topic...that he even does interviews like this shows you the immaturity and ego involved -- and the horrid advice he continues to get from his crew.

First off, of course he is going to do interviews. He's still a superstar.

Secondly, of course he has a huge ego. He had one in HS, one in Cleveland and continues to have one. Nothing has changed regarding his ego.

thedynasty1998;457268 wrote:First off, of course he is going to do interviews. He's still a superstar.

Secondly, of course he has a huge ego. He had one in HS, one in Cleveland and continues to have one. Nothing has changed regarding his ego.

The only thing that has changed is that people are not covering up what a doucher he is now. Cleveland/Akron always covered up for his shenanigans....now that is gone.

Trueblue23;457071 wrote:Gilbert should have pulled a dick move during the sign and trade process.

Re-sign LeBron, then not trade him. Would never work, but would be pretty funny.

Stupid NBA has a rule that says the contract is voided if the player isnt traded after 72 hours, but woulda been sweet

thedynasty1998;457267 wrote:I respect your stance on each topic you touched on, and like I said before, I made predictions/opinions on each of the above. Whether everyone agrees with me or not is not my issue. I don't get the people who act childish because someone has a difference viewpoint.

I respect each of your statements above, however some I do not agree with, however I'm not going to call you an idiot.

Oh wow, how cute, you go from wanting to meet me at the flag pole and threatening to beat me up, to mr. innocent I wanna be an adult. You're such a pos.

Jamison is a career 19PPG scorer, Jordo is misinformed, as usual.

Im actually going to side with thedynasty on this one, and hes a piece of shit. But Commander of Awesome, you arent pwning anyone, youre just resorting to childish drivel without saying anything of substance.

Evidently you havent been keeping track and following this thread very carefully.