ptown_trojans_1
Posts: 7,632
Jun 1, 2010 5:32pm
I don't see a problem. But, I defer to New Yorkers, since they have to live next to it.
krazie45
Posts: 1,055
Jun 1, 2010 5:34pm
CinciX12;375714 wrote:There is also a strip club two blocks away from Ground Zero. Thats okay but not a mosque? Lol okay. I'll put this in the patriotism gone a little too far category.
Not really sure how this is relevant. Personally I have no problems with strip clubs and that is more of a question of your own personal morals, and strip clubs do not have the connection to the events of 9/11 that a mosque does.
LJ
Posts: 16,351
Jun 1, 2010 5:35pm
krazie45;375710 wrote: How would people feel about a Japanese Embassy in Hawaii next to Pearl Harbor?
Oh, you mean the one on Nuuanu Ave just a few miles from Pearl Harbor?
I
isadore
Posts: 7,762
Jun 1, 2010 5:43pm
and there are mosques in New York a few miles from the Towers, but there is no Japanese Embassy next to the Arizona monument and no demand for it.
LJ
Posts: 16,351
Jun 1, 2010 5:47pm
isadore;375737 wrote:and there are mosques in New York a few miles from the Towers, but there is no Japanese Embassy next to the Arizona monument and no demand for it.
And a Mosque is not owned by the people who attacked the WTC. The comparison is ridiculous. I can understand why people don't want it, sure, but the comparisons are asinine.
I
isadore
Posts: 7,762
Jun 1, 2010 5:58pm
When Muslims have been victorious they have seized Christian Churches and made them into Mosques as with Hagia Sophia, the largest church in Christendom. When they establish their world wide caliphate then they can put their mosque at the Towers.
ptown_trojans_1
Posts: 7,632
Jun 1, 2010 6:11pm
isadore;375751 wrote:When Muslims have been victorious they have seized Christian Churches and made them into Mosques as with Hagia Sophia, the largest church in Christendom. When they establish their world wide caliphate then they can put their mosque at the Towers.
lol. Let's not go down the Crusades route. No one wins.
I
isadore
Posts: 7,762
Jun 1, 2010 6:17pm
Islam, from its very beginning, has been spread by conquest more than any other religion, even Christianity.
CinciX12
Posts: 2,874
Jun 1, 2010 6:20pm
I don't see how it matters what is around Ground Zero is what I was trying to get across. As long as they are not hanging signs in the windows saying 'you pricks deserved it' who the hell cares. It is just a topic that is fueled by racism and the patriotic types in this country think that allowing a muslim mosque closeby is like Bin Laden pissing on us.
ptown_trojans_1
Posts: 7,632
Jun 1, 2010 6:20pm
isadore;375760 wrote:Islam, from its very beginning, has been spread by conquest more than any other religion, even Christianity.
lol. Not really.
The Crusades, Inquisition, Spanish conquering of the new world, Russian and German Pogroms, etc are all Christian. No one wins this argument.
I
isadore
Posts: 7,762
Jun 1, 2010 6:28pm
interesting that any of these events happened several centuries after beginning of Christianity, but the conquest and atrocities start right from the begiinning of Islam. Actions commanded by Muhammed himself. (well I guess I am on a hit list with a fatawa now)
C
cbus4life
Posts: 2,849
Jun 1, 2010 7:29pm
matdad;375596 wrote:This is an insult! If Muslims were truly concerned with mending ties they would denounce the terrorism that is taking place. Their silence speaks volumes!
I realize that not every Muslim is a terrorist and there are many good people who follow Islam but it is also my opinion that it is their express desire to spread their religion all over the world and have done very little, as a whole, to denounce the radicals in their own religion. If you think that people in many Muslim countries are sorry for what happened on 9/11 you are naive!
And before any of you bleeding hearts attack me for my statements just know that I have had a lot of contact with Muslims in both this country and elsewhere.
Talk with many Europeans who have seen the spread of Islam on their continent and get their perspective. Women's rights have regressed as more Muslims have taken leadership in politics.
Ask yourself this question; why build a mosque at Ground Zero?
http://www.unc.edu/~kurzman/terror.htm
And, as someone who grew up in London and France (because of parents and their work), and lived next to, went to school with, etc., many Muslims, they were a great group, and having talked with them and others there since 9/11, they have expressed nothing but regret and outrage at the attacks. As did their entire community, they said. Just my own experience.
If you think that people in many Muslim countries are sorry for what happened on 9/11 you are naive!
And that is just pure BS. How can you make such a blanket statement?
S
superman
Posts: 3,582
Jun 1, 2010 7:36pm
Maybe he saw all the videos of the celebrations in those countries after the attacks.
C
cbus4life
Posts: 2,849
Jun 1, 2010 7:50pm
Lol, yes, because those videos represent all those in all Muslim countries.
Don't paint such a blanket statement of the entire Islamic faith.
I know that there are parts of it that are like those you describe, but am tired of the ridiculous generalizations about the faith as a whole.
Equating some of my best friends with terrorists and people who cheered the deaths of Americans is getting a little old.
Don't paint such a blanket statement of the entire Islamic faith.
I know that there are parts of it that are like those you describe, but am tired of the ridiculous generalizations about the faith as a whole.
Equating some of my best friends with terrorists and people who cheered the deaths of Americans is getting a little old.
I
isadore
Posts: 7,762
Jun 1, 2010 9:34pm
CinciX12;375761 wrote:I don't see how it matters what is around Ground Zero is what I was trying to get across. As long as they are not hanging signs in the windows saying 'you pricks deserved it' who the hell cares. It is just a topic that is fueled by racism and the patriotic types in this country think that allowing a muslim mosque closeby is like Bin Laden pissing on us.
oh those horrible "patriotic types" where do they get off loving their country.
I
isadore
Posts: 7,762
Jun 1, 2010 9:39pm
you would seem to be generalizing, after all as you wrote, your opinions are just based oncbus4life;375858 wrote:Lol, yes, because those videos represent all those in all Muslim countries.
Don't paint such a blanket statement of the entire Islamic faith.
I know that there are parts of it that are like those you describe, but am tired of the ridiculous generalizations about the faith as a whole.
Equating some of my best friends with terrorists and people who cheered the deaths of Americans is getting a little old.
" Just my own experience." Do you have any evidence that your experiences are definitive.
.
C
cbus4life
Posts: 2,849
Jun 2, 2010 10:49am
Na, just making the point that his assertion that essentially those in Muslim countries weren't upset at 9/11, and by extension a large portion of those in the Muslim world, is ridiculous.
CinciX12
Posts: 2,874
Jun 2, 2010 11:22am
isadore;376056 wrote:oh those horrible "patriotic types" where do they get off loving their country.
When those 'patriotic types' make asses out of everyone else it is extremely annoying. If you love the country so much, go join the armed forces and stop complaining about where a mosque goes.
jhay78
Posts: 1,917
Jun 2, 2010 12:25pm
LJ;375729 wrote:Oh, you mean the one on Nuuanu Ave just a few miles from Pearl Harbor?
Not sure you can tie Japanese militarism/empiricism of the 1930's-1940's with the Japanese embassy of today.
You CAN, however, tie Islamic teachings and their Scriptures with violence and terrorism.
I
isadore
Posts: 7,762
Jun 2, 2010 12:26pm
you consider being patriotic an insult, interesting. People have a right to be offended by the location of that Mosque.
while a small proportion of the people who died in the Towers werre Muslim, all the murderers were.
while a small proportion of the people who died in the Towers werre Muslim, all the murderers were.
I
I Wear Pants
Posts: 16,223
Jun 2, 2010 12:35pm
isadore;375737 wrote:and there are mosques in New York a few miles from the Towers, but there is no Japanese Embassy next to the Arizona monument and no demand for it.
Did you ever think that there is no Japanese Embassy next to the USS Arizona memorial because it's in the middle of the harbor?
It wouldn't be a very practical place for an Embassy. I mean the Japanese are kind of weird but not insane.
I
I Wear Pants
Posts: 16,223
Jun 2, 2010 12:37pm
No you can't. Or at least not any more that you can tie Christian teachings with intolerance and violence or the United States with imperialism and destruction of other countries and their citizens.jhay78;376648 wrote:Not sure you can tie Japanese militarism/empiricism of the 1930's-1940's with the Japanese embassy of today.
You CAN, however, tie Islamic teachings and their Scriptures with violence and terrorism.
I
isadore
Posts: 7,762
Jun 2, 2010 12:45pm
I Wear Pants;376659 wrote:Did you ever think that there is no Japanese Embassy next to the USS Arizona memorial because it's in the middle of the harbor?
It wouldn't be a very practical place for an Embassy. I mean the Japanese are kind of weird but not insane.
a floating one in the shape of a torpedo bomber, a lingering reminder for of what was to them, good old days.
sleeper
Posts: 27,879
Jun 2, 2010 12:46pm
A world with violent destructive religions is where I want to be, seeing as how it would degrade the image of it and forcing people to disassociate from being religious. A mosque built a ground zero elevates this tension, so I'm all for it.
I
isadore
Posts: 7,762
Jun 2, 2010 12:47pm
I Wear Pants;376661 wrote:No you can't. Or at least not any more that you can tie Christian teachings with intolerance and violence or the United States with imperialism and destruction of other countries and their citizens.
its alot easier with Muhammed who himself provided personally examples of intolerance and violence.