Dust_E_Roads;1381518 wrote:A.) It is really 285 to 220, not 260 to 230. (not sure why you pared it inside the actual range, unless it was to distort the issue perhaps?!?)

B.) Where are all of these 90 pound kids who wrestle 106? I haven't seen one all year?

a) I was referring to It is what is's example. No need to distort any facts. Biggest disadvantage is that many of these undersized 106 pounders can do nothing to improve their plight as they are usually naturally under or around 7% body fat. Not really sure the last time I saw anybody over 220 remotely close to 7%. Check out how many 8th graders are under 90 pounds and no where near hitting puberty. Probably one of the main reasons "redshirting" has become in vogue.

b.) There are several undersized 106 pounders around the 90 lb or even less. Lancaster has two of them and another coming up next year as a freshman. Jacob Spearman was 90 pounds as a freshman and barely 95 as a sophomore. It would have been a tragedy if he would have gotten so frustrated with giving up 18% weight (even more considering those that cut). Dublin's Chris Mullucey was around 90 pounds his freshman year. This year Teays Valley's Luke Nace as a junior has finally grown into the weight. New Lexington had district qualifier Trey Davisson weighing under 100 pounds until his senior year. Truth is, there are a larger number of kids around here than most realize. Of course, there is no way to calculate how many have quit the sport because they were undersized and getting clobbered in practice or even matches. So in answer to your question look around, they are out there. Ask the coaches how many kids they have lost over the years because of this. You will be surprised. The OAC junior high championships are coming up shortly. Check out the brackets under or around 90 pounds and count the 8th graders.

Couldn't agree with you more rassler. I actually happened to be a case in high school of a wrestler that weight around 95 pounds soaking wet eating everything in sight wrestling guys making serious drops. And these are athletes we are talking about. Kids that don't have an once of body fat on them. I try not to be offensive, but how many heavyweights do you see and say "holy cow that kid is a beast"? I can tell you its not very many. Probably can count them on your hand. Maybe it is time to start dropping that upper threshold of 285 to a lower weight and start looking at ways to give some other weights a chance where dedicated lifelong wrestlers get cut short from the trip to state because of how condensed those weights are.

The 95-pound freshman topic is a tough one.

On the one hand, you hate to see kids get shut out of varsity action because they are undersized.

On the other hand, although we can all name several notable talented kids at this weight, there are way more than several teams out there who wouldn't field one. Heck, a lot already don't put out a 106 pounder. Giving up a forfeit is huge in a dual situation. Stack a few forfeits, and you can really drain the life out of a program when the kids go into every dual already feeling like losers...

Maybe the best answer is a more-active freshman-only scene that even adds weight classes for the smaller guys? Maybe allow varsity kids to wrestle one of these a year without earning points to up the competition a bit? Maybe a bad idea, but just trying to think out of the box.

In any case, while i hate to see a few great kids who have dedicated their life to the sport get shut out, i think it would be worse to disadvantage entire programs by requiring a new weight class they they have little chance of filling.

You mean you don't think the wrestle one match and you make it to districts for heavyweights should exist? It's a good time to make a run to the bathrooms if anything else.

Maverick15;1381719 wrote:I try not to be offensive, but how many heavyweights do you see and say "holy cow that kid is a beast"?

Actually, I would say all heavy weights are beasts, it is really a matter of what kind of beast.

I have no problem with 106 being the lowest weight class. What I have a problem with is people who want to add another weight above 195. If the sport is evolving this way as Dust E Roads says then why has there been no change in college weights. Wouldn't logic dictate that wrestlers are bigger in college hence the lowest weight class being 125. But the highest weight class below HVWT is 197. In my opinion when they added 220 it was a huge mistake. We lost a middle weight (140). Do you think it is a coincidence that the middle weights (120-145) are always loaded with talent?

I have also witnessed 2 Central Ohio Division 1 schools that wrestle very competitve schedules have first year wrestlers (1 a Junior and 1 Senior) in the 220 weight class this year that have winning records and have placed at tournaments. Do you think that would happen in the middle weights? If you are honest with yourself you know it is not very likely.

I will admit my bias. My son wrestled 103, 103, 119, 126 during his high school career. We traveled all over the state for open mats (Jordans, Solon, Prodigy, Capital Club) and very rarely saw bigger guys there, usually only a handfull at most. If there is such a demand for these weight classes where are the wrestlers. Wrestling should be like any sport and cater to where the demand is. Do we need some heavier classes? Yes Should we add more? NO!!

Underrated,




I agree with you 100%.

Underrated;1382159 wrote:I have no problem with 106 being the lowest weight class. What I have a problem with is people who want to add another weight above 195. If the sport is evolving this way as Dust E Roads says then why has there been no change in college weights. Wouldn't logic dictate that wrestlers are bigger in college hence the lowest weight class being 125. But the highest weight class below HVWT is 197. In my opinion when they added 220 it was a huge mistake. We lost a middle weight (140). Do you think it is a coincidence that the middle weights (120-145) are always loaded with talent?

I have also witnessed 2 Central Ohio Division 1 schools that wrestle very competitve schedules have first year wrestlers (1 a Junior and 1 Senior) in the 220 weight class this year that have winning records and have placed at tournaments. Do you think that would happen in the middle weights? If you are honest with yourself you know it is not very likely.

I will admit my bias. My son wrestled 103, 103, 119, 126 during his high school career. We traveled all over the state for open mats (Jordans, Solon, Prodigy, Capital Club) and very rarely saw bigger guys there, usually only a handfull at most. If there is such a demand for these weight classes where are the wrestlers. Wrestling should be like any sport and cater to where the demand is. Do we need some heavier classes? Yes Should we add more? NO!!

There will be no sensible talk in this forum. Stick to ONLY opinions, yours or someone elses. Preferably something that you heard somewhere else.
If we all stick to these simple guidelines this forum will thrive...If not????? :eek:

Don't have an official thread for this one yet. So i'll post it here because I am too lazy to start a new thread on it and it is still early in the game.

I am taking a stab at Darby 120:
1. Timchenko
2. Penzone
3. Rahmani
4. ????

Yes I said Rahmani - I watched Wimer wrestle last night and he's good, but I think he has a better shot at 113. 4th spot up for grabs...

If someone wants to start the darby prediction thread, I can re-post this or a mod can move it there.

Discuss....

Underrated;1382159 wrote:If the sport is evolving this way as Dust E Roads says...

Small, but important, distinction: I didn't say it "is evolving", I said it "will evolve". I am a firm believer in the old adage that nature abhores a vacuum. If there are a ton of openings at 195 and 220 and thus opportunities to collect easy points, coaches will recruit and fill these positions. Also, fewer kids near those wieghts will drop out after middle school if they won't be surrendering 30 and 70 lbs respectively.

Underrated;1382159 wrote:....why has there been no change in college weights. Wouldn't logic dictate that wrestlers are bigger in college hence the lowest weight class being 125. But the highest weight class below HVWT is 197.

Great point for which I have no counter. Only thing I can suggest is that perhaps college is more bound by tradition than the lower levels are. I.e. it would be a much bigger deal for them to add a weight class, etc.

All of this being said, I am curious about the fact that people general 'hate' on the bigger classes so much. If I went out to Baum's page a pulled up a generic entry grid, I'm pretty conifdent that I would see roughly an equal number of 285's as 106's, 220's as 113's and so on. Ademittedly, there is definitely a glut from 138 to 152, but why is that everyone's first bias is to reduce the upper weight classes or widen their ranges and no one ever says anything about the lower weights?

nykc;1385231 wrote:Don't have an official thread for this one yet. So i'll post it here because I am too lazy to start a new thread on it and it is still early in the game.

I am taking a stab at Darby 120:
1. Timchenko
2. Penzone
3. Rahmani
4. ????

Yes I said Rahmani - I watched Wimer wrestle last night and he's good, but I think he has a better shot at 113. 4th spot up for grabs...

If someone wants to start the darby prediction thread, I can re-post this or a mod can move it there.

Discuss....

Considering Wimer beat Screptock (Oregon Clay) & Keller (Delta), placed 2nd at NC Hoover, & placed 3rd at Medina I think he will be fine at 120. Let's remember.... No one had him making it out last year either.

I take Wimer as second depending on the seed, although Penzone has been wrestling well lately and Rahmani is tough. I think these 4 may be state placers at 120. I think Kakos and Valenti bump up to 126 adding a lot of flavor there as well.