Cleveland Browns 2023 Season Thread

posted by Al Bundy

Stefanski sucks too, but what do you possibly see in Watson that justifies giving up 3 first round picks? 

It was the right move in that they were going nowhere with Mayfield and Watson was perceived as a FQB. I don't think anyone would've known he was going to be as bad as he's been. The correct intent was there.

On a side note, if I'm Jimmy Haslam, prior to the next meeting with these guys I'm whispering "$10 million to whoever takes out Fitzpatrick's knees." EVERY national pundit I've seen has called blatant cheap shot to try to take him out by Fitzpatrick but typical "Stiller Football."

This game was SO disappointing. Outplayed them across the board but kind of hard to win when your offense scores more points than their offense for THEIR team. Chalking this one up to an anomaly as that defense isn't going to put up 2 TD's every week and that offense is lucky if it will score more than one against any opponent.

And WTF is Watson's fascination with face masking opponents? When was the last time you've seen a QB with 2 personal foul penalties in a game?

That second face mask was bad. The first one his finger got caught. It wasnt as aggressive as it looked, as he was trying to free his finger. Still not sure why he grabbed initially on it though lol.

posted by BR1986FB

It was the right move in that they were going nowhere with Mayfield and Watson was perceived as a FQB. I don't think anyone would've known he was going to be as bad as he's been. The correct intent was there.

On a side note, if I'm Jimmy Haslam, prior to the next meeting with these guys I'm whispering "$10 million to whoever takes out Fitzpatrick's knees." EVERY national pundit I've seen has called blatant cheap shot to try to take him out by Fitzpatrick but typical "Stiller Football."

This game was SO disappointing. Outplayed them across the board but kind of hard to win when your offense scores more points than their offense for THEIR team. Chalking this one up to an anomaly as that defense isn't going to put up 2 TD's every week and that offense is lucky if it will score more than one against any opponent.

And WTF is Watson's fascination with face masking opponents? When was the last time you've seen a QB with 2 personal foul penalties in a game?

I get taking a chance on guy, but to give up 3 first round picks for a project was crazy. No one else offered anything else close to what we offered. We greatly overpaid. Plus, we are losing out on first round picks who could currently be on the roster helping us, and we don't have a pick next year. It is going to take a long time to recover.

posted by Al Bundy

I get taking a chance on guy, but to give up 3 first round picks for a project was crazy. No one else offered anything else close to what we offered. We greatly overpaid. Plus, we are losing out on first round picks who could currently be on the roster helping us, and we don't have a pick next year. It is going to take a long time to recover.

A project? The guy was in the MVP discussion and a multiple Pro Bowl QB. Three 1st rounders for Trey Lance is a "project", not Watson. He was proven.

posted by BR1986FB

A project? The guy was in the MVP discussion and a multiple Pro Bowl QB. Three 1st rounders for Trey Lance is a "project", not Watson. He was proven.

After missing basically 2 years, I think that it is fair to call him a project right now. He put up big numbers in a gimmick offense in a dome in a terrible division. They got exposed when they made the playoffs. If you are going to give up 3 first round picks, it better be for an all-time great, and even then it doesn't usually work out. We win easily last night with an average QB.

posted by Al Bundy

After missing basically 2 years, I think that it is fair to call him a project right now. He put up big numbers in a gimmick offense in a dome in a terrible division. They got exposed when they made the playoffs. If you are going to give up 3 first round picks, it better be for an all-time great, and even then it doesn't usually work out. We win easily last night with an average QB.

He had only missed 1 year, and it was mostly on his own accord to get out of Houston. And we overpaid, because he was going elsewhere if we didnt. This is all revisionist history, the move is not working out currently, but it was a swing a franchise like the Browns had to make, imo. How many more QBs did you want to draft and waste more time on? 

posted by Laley23

He had only missed 1 year, and it was mostly on his own accord to get out of Houston. And we overpaid, because he was going elsewhere if we didnt. This is all revisionist history, the move is not working out currently, but it was a swing a franchise like the Browns had to make, imo. How many more QBs did you want to draft and waste more time on? 

Spot on. This roster is built to win now. They have a small window to try to put something together. They don't have time to develop a young QB. The defense is now going to likely be a top 5 defense. They had a generational talent at RB and a good run blocking (not pass blocking) O-Line. They had to put all of their chips in. The last time a QB like Watson became available was Drew Brees and many considered him damaged goods.

posted by Laley23

He had only missed 1 year, and it was mostly on his own accord to get out of Houston. And we overpaid, because he was going elsewhere if we didnt. This is all revisionist history, the move is not working out currently, but it was a swing a franchise like the Browns had to make, imo. How many more QBs did you want to draft and waste more time on? 

He basically missed 2 years. He played a handful of games in 2022. Almost everyone thought that it was insane to give up 3 first round picks. Where would you rank him in AFC QBs? If a franchise is going to give up 3 first round picks, you better be the best. He's not even in the top half. 

posted by Al Bundy

He basically missed 2 years. He played a handful of games in 2022. Almost everyone thought that it was insane to give up 3 first round picks. Where would you rank him in AFC QBs? If a franchise is going to give up 3 first round picks, you better be the best. He's not even in the top half. 

The 49ers gave up three 1st rounders to move up to draft an unknown in Trey Lance. Watson, at one point, was a proven commodity and borderline MVP quality. People may think it's "insane" but 1) it's the going rate and 2) if you hit, the draft picks are an afterthought.

posted by BR1986FB

The 49ers gave up three 1st rounders to move up to draft an unknown in Trey Lance. Watson, at one point, was a proven commodity and borderline MVP quality. People may think it's "insane" but 1) it's the going rate and 2) if you hit, the draft picks are an afterthought.

So the logic is that the niners gave up 3 first rounders for a QB who sucks, so we made a good trade? There are other veterans who we could have had much cheaper. The Rams only gave up 2 first rounders for Stafford, who is much better than Watson. We greatly overpaid.

posted by Al Bundy

So the logic is that the niners gave up 3 first rounders for a QB who sucks, so we made a good trade? There are other veterans who we could have had much cheaper. The Rams only gave up 2 first rounders for Stafford, who is much better than Watson. We greatly overpaid.

Trey Lance also didn't cost $230M guaranteed.  THAT is a gigantic issue in and of itself - he WILL be your QB through 2025, unless you get lucky and snag a young QB outside of R1.

Best case scenario is you find someone willing to give you maybe an R2, if you eat half his guaranteed money.

But I think it may still be a bit premature to write him off.  Only Wk2, and that's pretty devastating to lose a guy your gameplan was built around that week.

posted by Al Bundy

He basically missed 2 years. He played a handful of games in 2022. Almost everyone thought that it was insane to give up 3 first round picks. Where would you rank him in AFC QBs? If a franchise is going to give up 3 first round picks, you better be the best. He's not even in the top half. 

At the time we traded, he had only missed 1 season. And there was decent speculation that would be his punishment. 

posted by Al Bundy

So the logic is that the niners gave up 3 first rounders for a QB who sucks, so we made a good trade? There are other veterans who we could have had much cheaper. The Rams only gave up 2 first rounders for Stafford, who is much better than Watson. We greatly overpaid.

I wouldve rather traded 3 first for Watson, than 2 for Stafford. Again, revisionist history that isnt currently working out. But if Watson was still good (and still a little early), that money would be a joke compared to what guys will be in 5 years. And he is younger/in prime. It was a good trade for a team like the Browns, they just need Watson to still be elite/very good and thus far he has not been. Doesnt mean the process was wrong. 

posted by Laley23

I wouldve rather traded 3 first for Watson, than 2 for Stafford. Again, revisionist history that isnt currently working out. But if Watson was still good (and still a little early), that money would be a joke compared to what guys will be in 5 years. And he is younger/in prime. It was a good trade for a team like the Browns, they just need Watson to still be elite/very good and thus far he has not been. Doesnt mean the process was wrong. 

NO ONE else was offering what we offered. When we try to be smarter than everyone else, it always backfires. Just make smart football decisions instead of taking stupid chances where you need everything to be just perfect. I'll ask the question again, where would you rank Watson in terms of AFC QBs? In terms of what we gave up for him, he should be the best. He's not even in the top half. 

posted by Al Bundy

NO ONE else was offering what we offered. When we try to be smarter than everyone else, it always backfires. Just make smart football decisions instead of taking stupid chances where you need everything to be just perfect. I'll ask the question again, where would you rank Watson in terms of AFC QBs? In terms of what we gave up for him, he should be the best. He's not even in the top half. 

He had a no trade clause so he could pick where he wanted to go ultimately. Cleveland was seemingly out of the race and there were 2-3 teams that he was debating. Cleveland came in at the last second with the ridiculous guaranteed money and he was sold then. Cleveland had to offer what no else was otherwise they weren’t getting him. Whether or not it was a good investment is yet to be seen but so far you’d be right to be nervous. 

posted by friendfromlowry

He had a no trade clause so he could pick where he wanted to go ultimately. Cleveland was seemingly out of the race and there were 2-3 teams that he was debating. Cleveland came in at the last second with the ridiculous guaranteed money and he was sold then. Cleveland had to offer what no else was otherwise they weren’t getting him. Whether or not it was a good investment is yet to be seen but so far you’d be right to be nervous. 

100%. Doesn't mean this will work out but that was the price if they were going to get him. 

I wasn't thrilled with what they paid for him either but it's kind of the cost of doing business to land a (perceived) FQB. As I stated before, the only other time I can remember a QB in his prime (not TB12) being on the market was Drew Brees so this isn't common.

Much of Watson's woes, at least last night, were on Stefanski. Once Fitzpatrick "Tonya Harding'd" Chubb, the Browns were one dimensional. The Pittsburgh front 7 could send the hounds. 

All Stefanski had to do was run a few screens and it would've kept the Steelers defense honest. But instead he dials up these long developing routes, allowing the pass rush to get to Watson. No excuse for Deshaun's inaccuracy but KS needs to put him in a position to succeed.

posted by BR1986FB

100%. Doesn't mean this will work out but that was the price if they were going to get him. 

I wasn't thrilled with what they paid for him either but it's kind of the cost of doing business to land a (perceived) FQB. As I stated before, the only other time I can remember a QB in his prime (not TB12) being on the market was Drew Brees so this isn't common.

Much of Watson's woes, at least last night, were on Stefanski. Once Fitzpatrick "Tonya Harding'd" Chubb, the Browns were one dimensional. The Pittsburgh front 7 could send the hounds. 

All Stefanski had to do was run a few screens and it would've kept the Steelers defense honest. But instead he dials up these long developing routes, allowing the pass rush to get to Watson. No excuse for Deshaun's inaccuracy but KS needs to put him in a position to succeed.

If the price is too high, you walk away. They paid the price for a hall of famer, but only got a very inconsistent player who will make highlight plays at times because of his athletic ability. We did the exact same thing with OBJ a few years ago except we threw away more picks this time. 

posted by Al Bundy

If the price is too high, you walk away. They paid the price for a hall of famer, but only got a very inconsistent player who will make highlight plays at times because of his athletic ability. We did the exact same thing with OBJ a few years ago except we threw away more picks this time. 

So they are supposed to sit on their hands and ride it out with Baker Mayfield when he was 1) not all that talented and 2) kind of a divisive presence in the locker room?

Whether we like it or not, these front office guys will do anything to keep their jobs and I think Haslam, unlike the Dolan's, wants to win in the worst way. If they saw this as the way to do it, so be it, although it may not have been the best decision but you still have to pull the trigger.

I hate to defend the Browns or Watson but there were about a half dozen other teams willing to do what they did. 

posted by friendfromlowry

I hate to defend the Browns or Watson but there were about a half dozen other teams willing to do what they did. 

Exactly and I bet if their backs were against the wall, some of them probably would've given him the fully guaranteed deal.