sleeper;1832577 wrote:CPI has risen 12.5% since Obama has taken office. Average household earnings have increased only 2.78% since the Bush recession of 2008. Do the math.

Wages are sticky, costs have increased. Reality.

Less than 1.4% annual increases when accounting for compounding ......historically cheap; essentially benign. Wages could have increased much greater had it not been for obamaKare, not to mention the destructive and costly regulations that are costing the economy, business, and job-creators tens and tens of billions of dollars. When marxists are in charge, there is little incentive to invest, innovate, or hire. Zero confidence. Pure reality.

QuakerOats;1832584 wrote:Less than 1.4% annual increases when accounting for compounding ......historically cheap; essentially benign. Wages could have increased much greater had it not been for obamaKare, not to mention the destructive and costly regulations that are costing the economy, business, and job-creators tens and tens of billions of dollars. When marxists are in charge, there is little incentive to invest, innovate, or hire. Zero confidence. Pure reality.

And back to the baseless rhetoric.

Hail Trump!

Liberals having a hard time with facts .................common occurrence.


Keeping your voting base enslaved in welfare .......................immoral.

QuakerOats;1832586 wrote:Liberals having a hard time with facts .................common occurrence.


Keeping your voting base enslaved in welfare .......................immoral.

None of your post is fact. It's just an unsupported number with a bunch of conclusions not related to your unsupported number nor backed up by any additional fact.

sleeper;1832564 wrote:Oh, so no indicators. Got it.

Stock market isn't an indicator either right? S&P is only up 232% since the Bush Recession.

Also, your pretty simple isn't that simple. Maybe in the 1930's when we didn't have a global economy but you can create goods OUTSIDE of the country to supply the demand for goods at an affordable price in this country without creating jobs in return.
But yeah, Cuba is a great analogy and is the exact same situation that the US is in. KAPPA.

Sticky wages is not a bullshit excuse. It's reality. Let me know when you want to join reality.

sleeper;1832565 wrote:Demand is inelastic for healthcare. Hard not to pay whatever price it costs to keep yourself alive.

But go on, blame Obama for that economic reality. Obamacare didn't go far enough and Trumpcare won't fix it either; we need single payer or bust.

I gave you indicators, but you choose to be a partisan QO and ignore them. You want to brush aside nearly 50% of our country requiring government assistance by blaming sticky wages. You have been telling us there has been remarkable growth for the past 8 years, yet somehow the wages still can't adjust after 8 years and more people required government assistance. Too many holes in that excuse. If you want more indicators:

-Median household income has dropped (60% of our counties had a decrease in median income)
-National debt has doubled
-Deficit spending is on the rise again after boasting about the shrinking earlier in his presidency
-Home ownership has significantly declined
-Poverty rate has increased
-The income gap has widened
-Healthcare costs have sky rocketed
-GDP growth was less than stellar
-The debt to gdp ratio is 104%
-Money printing increased
-Student loans and defaults on the loans have increased

I am not going to say he is the worst president of all time and has been an economic disaster, but to act like he is our greatest president of all time, especially with fiscal policy is a complete joke. He is probably a C- when it comes to his economic record. I would probably rank Obama in the 22-25 range in terms of greatest presidents.

Also my simple, is pretty simple with a global economy. You can be competitive in a global environment. Perhaps if the Government (this goes to both GOP and DNC) would intervene less with business, they would be incentivized to create more of their goods/services in the US. As for Cuba, you're missing the point. I said jobs aren't an indicator of an economy's strength. Cuba was an example of a country with very low unemployment, but a shitty economy. There are plenty of other countries out there with low unemployment numbers, but shitty economy overall (mainly socialist countries). You knew what I was saying, but you chose to be intellectually dishonest.

Obamacare has been a joke, and "Trumpcare" will most likely be a joke. If are making around 32K, you have to pay $165 monthly premium for a middle of the road healthcare that gives you a $6.5K deductible. That is not affordable... Obamacare has been a failure, and moving the goalposts by telling people that more people are insured (because they would be penalized if not) does not change the fact that you have every day working americans giving up a big chunk of their income for mediocre healthcare. I don't have a solution, but Obamacare clearly isn't it, and I have a hard time beliving single payer will change it as well. Just ask active duty military (or vet) how they feel about Tricare. Tricare is decent sample of what social healthcare is like. The majority of the military I know hate Tricare.

Also the fact that Hillary and the dems ran on an Obama third term platform and lost to Trump is another indicator. :RpS_lol:

If the Great Recession had waited another year Obama would have one of the worst economic records of any POTUS - you'd be subtracting all those jobs bound to come back naturally from the recession leaving you with a pretty ugly number.

W's presidency was book-ended by two pretty significant recessions, which is probably very rare. The first would really be on Clinton and just cyclical. The second is the result of how they chose to climb out of that internet bubble and the economy they built, which wasn't very good. I see a lot of similarities with the Obamaconomy, only now there are bigger and deeper problems and things just aren't going as well.

At least Sleeper doesn't have to log out from isadore anymore




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like_that;1832590 wrote:Also the fact that Hillary and the dems ran on an Obama third term platform and lost to Trump is another indicator. :RpS_lol:

except Hillary got more votes :RpS_drool:

Yep, this country really stepped on its dick not electing Romney. And now I fear a Trump disaster is going to give us someone way left and way worse of Hillary and Barry, even worse if they get the supermajority Obama narrowly missed.

bases_loaded;1832594 wrote:At least Sleeper doesn't have to log out from isadore anymore




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Sticky wages

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gut;1832596 wrote:except Hillary got more votes :RpS_drool:

Yep, this country really stepped on its dick not electing Romney. And now I fear a Trump disaster is going to give us someone way left and way worse of Hillary and Barry, even worse if they get the supermajority Obama narrowly missed.

I went doom and gloom during the election thinking the Dems possibly had a shot at taking the house (WH and Senate were a forgone conclusion to me). This election obviously proved I was wrong. Looking at the map now it is hard to believe this worst case scenario will happen. The dems have turned into the party of the smug elitist in new york and the wackos in california. On top of that they are doubling down on the same bullshit rhetoric that lost them the election.

like_that;1832598 wrote:I went doom and gloom during the election thinking the Dems possibly had a shot at taking the house (WH and Senate were a forgone conclusion to me). This election obviously proved I was wrong. Looking at the map now it is hard to believe this worst case scenario will happen. The dems have turned into the party of the smug elitist in new york and the wackos in california. On top of that they are doubling down on the same bullshit rhetoric that lost them the election.

Well, people thought the Repub party was dead in 2008.

Hard to imagine the supermajority because most states have almost all Republican legislatures, which should indicate the House remains Repub, at least for awhile. But I think Trump may have to be better than mediocre for Repubs to keep the POTUS and Senate in 2020.

The Dems don't, at the moment, have a rising young star. But, again, look at the Repubs who didn't appear to have anyone in 2008 and by the 2016 election you had Rubio, Cruz, Kasich and some others. Obama, himself, was a relative unknown in 2004 until giving the DNC address.

I keep hoping that party has a return to sanity, but they likely will look at Sanders and Trump and conclude they need to move the party further left.

bases_loaded;1832594 wrote:At least Sleeper doesn't have to log out from isadore anymore




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I liked old sleeper. This new version is a fucking douche bag.


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sleeper;1832603 wrote:

Luls. Have of that is fake

Spock;1832607 wrote:Luls. Have of that is fake

Seriously. Fucking really man. Do you even look at the shit you post?

iclfan2;1832604 wrote:I liked old sleeper. This new version is a fucking douche bag.


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They are the same just now he's posting the opposite side of bullshit. I've never cared for any version of sleeper.

Iliketurtles;1832612 wrote:They are the same just now he's posting the opposite side of bullshit. I've never cared for any version of sleeper.

It's just painfully predictable when he starts a "new" act. They all follow the same pattern. It might work on a forum like Reddit, but not a small forum here where everyone has seen every posting style for the last 3-5 years.

He would get lost in the group think shuffle on the political Reddit threads.


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Reddits political sections are the worst lol

"This story is the biggest political story of all time!!!"
And then 24 hours later it's a non story.

SportsAndLady;1832641 wrote:Reddits political sections are the worst lol

"This story is the biggest political story of all time!!!"
And then 24 hours later it's a non story.

I've actually never read it lol. Not a shocker though. Sounds like any comment section on a partisan op-ed.

It's also sad we have to provide the "not a trump guy" disclaimer whenever we call out flawed liberal logic or hypocrisy.

Why do we have both an "Impressed" and "Disgusted" with Trump thread? They seem to both be "Disgusted."

like_that;1832588 wrote:I gave you indicators, but you choose to be a partisan QO and ignore them. You want to brush aside nearly 50% of our country requiring government assistance by blaming sticky wages. You have been telling us there has been remarkable growth for the past 8 years, yet somehow the wages still can't adjust after 8 years and more people required government assistance. Too many holes in that excuse. If you want more indicators:

-Median household income has dropped (60% of our counties had a decrease in median income)
-National debt has doubled
-Deficit spending is on the rise again after boasting about the shrinking earlier in his presidency
-Home ownership has significantly declined
-Poverty rate has increased
-The income gap has widened
-Healthcare costs have sky rocketed
-GDP growth was less than stellar
-The debt to gdp ratio is 104%
-Money printing increased
-Student loans and defaults on the loans have increased

I am not going to say he is the worst president of all time and has been an economic disaster, but to act like he is our greatest president of all time, especially with fiscal policy is a complete joke. He is probably a C- when it comes to his economic record. I would probably rank Obama in the 22-25 range in terms of greatest presidents.

Also my simple, is pretty simple with a global economy. You can be competitive in a global environment. Perhaps if the Government (this goes to both GOP and DNC) would intervene less with business, they would be incentivized to create more of their goods/services in the US. As for Cuba, you're missing the point. I said jobs aren't an indicator of an economy's strength. Cuba was an example of a country with very low unemployment, but a shitty economy. There are plenty of other countries out there with low unemployment numbers, but shitty economy overall (mainly socialist countries). You knew what I was saying, but you chose to be intellectually dishonest.

Obamacare has been a joke, and "Trumpcare" will most likely be a joke. If are making around 32K, you have to pay $165 monthly premium for a middle of the road healthcare that gives you a $6.5K deductible. That is not affordable... Obamacare has been a failure, and moving the goalposts by telling people that more people are insured (because they would be penalized if not) does not change the fact that you have every day working americans giving up a big chunk of their income for mediocre healthcare. I don't have a solution, but Obamacare clearly isn't it, and I have a hard time beliving single payer will change it as well. Just ask active duty military (or vet) how they feel about Tricare. Tricare is decent sample of what social healthcare is like. The majority of the military I know hate Tricare.

I don't typically respond to long posts because there's a lot of junk in there and the message can get lost. I'll give you an A for effort and provide some brief commentary.

#1) Your metrics are a joke and probably not true. No point in going through a fact discussion because you are clearly biased and not interested in rational debate. Obama hasn't created the Perfect economy, but you're downright delusional/partisan if you can't give Obama ANY credit for the progress he has made since the Bush recession.

#2) I'm not going to ask for your Presidential ranking because A) You don't have one and used them to try to make a sad point and B) You don't matter

#3) You are clueless on how the world works and are comparing the US economy to Cuba, capitalism to communism, and pretending that Obama is a communist. I'm not sure where you are going with this; didn't you go to Miami?

#4) We agree on both Obamacare and TrumpCare. The only system proven to work is single payer healthcare. If Trumpcare is a single payer system, I will support it regardless of what it is called. Republicans don't like to admit that Obamacare is Romneycare, a Republican idea, and try to pretend this is the system that Obama wanted. No, Obama tried to compromise with Republicans to get some type of healthcare reform passed to HELP people that need it and for that I applaud him tremendously.

gut;1832592 wrote:If the Great Recession had waited another year Obama would have one of the worst economic records of any POTUS - you'd be subtracting all those jobs bound to come back naturally from the recession leaving you with a pretty ugly number.

W's presidency was book-ended by two pretty significant recessions, which is probably very rare. The first would really be on Clinton and just cyclical. The second is the result of how they chose to climb out of that internet bubble and the economy they built, which wasn't very good. I see a lot of similarities with the Obamaconomy, only now there are bigger and deeper problems and things just aren't going as well.

Republican Congress. Your partisanship is showing.